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Is people really this stupid
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 5:53 pm    Post subject: Is people really this stupid Reply with quote
Click here to see on Ebay

155 GB for a lens what you can find any time on auction for less than half ?


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Well, maybe it's time to start selling our spare samples (to raise funds for other lenses, of course Wink ) ...


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Last week sold my Yashica ML 42-75mm for 60gbp+shipping costs...ebay is very strange animal.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
looked at the bidding history, seems like the guy won it had set an incrediable high price for this lens(155GBP is still auto bid price). Only explanation would be he was drunk Laughing


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 8:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
lwsy711 wrote:
looked at the bidding history, seems like the guy won it had set an incrediable high price for this lens(155GBP is still auto bid price). Only explanation would be he was drunk Laughing


Laughing


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sonnar is at least proven performer. But can you understand this? Bonotar 1:4,5 / 105 for 166€ Click here to see on Ebay.de Shocked


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 8:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
BRunner wrote:
Sonnar is at least proven performer. But can you understand this? Bonotar 1:4,5 / 105 for 166€ Click here to see on Ebay.de Shocked


Quite rare, I understand more the race to get it , it is not comes every day like Sonnar.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Surely, it's not common lens. Still the price ranges between 20-40€ in most auctions. I've won my copy for 21€ one week before.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
BRunner wrote:
Surely, it's not common lens. Still the price ranges between 20-40€ in most auctions. I've won my copy for 21€ one week before.


That is a shame for a rare lens like this only the way to preserve them to next generation to fetch at least 100 EUR price in my opinion. Cheap lenses are mostly landing in garbage and they are butchered etc. I hope this lens price will be increasing at least a bit.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
It's crazy isn't it?

The Pentacon 135mm is starting to reach silly prices too.

I guess as using manual lenses becomes more popular some lenses will inevitably become the most spoken about ones!

When someone searches google or posts on a message board saying they are new to MF lenses and asking "can you recommend me some to start with" those two lenses are almost always mentioned.

The name helps too, even 50mm Tessars fetch decent money nowadays.

And the Tamron 300mm mirror, don't even get me started!


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
That is a shame for a rare lens like this only the way to preserve them to next generation to fetch at least 100 EUR price in my opinion. Cheap lenses are mostly landing in garbage and they are butchered etc. I hope this lens price will be increasing at least a bit.

I consider myself to be 66% photographer and 33% collector. I think that the price should be connected with performance. I spend 360€ for my copy of Pancolar 80 in top condition and after first few shots with this lens I don't regret. Even the price was pretty high.
Primoplan 75 at the same price will be considered cheap, but I won't buy it. The appropriate price for me is ~1/2 the price of Pancolar and only due to it's collectors value... Same goes for Bonotar vs. for example Orestor 100. But I understand... collectors are strange people...I have piece of it inside of me Wink

fatdeeman wrote:
It's crazy isn't it?
The Pentacon 135mm is starting to reach silly prices too.
I guess as using manual lenses becomes more popular some lenses will inevitably become the most spoken about ones!

It is. I think we can start list of most silly priced lenses. My candidates:
Flektogon 2.8/20
Flektogon 2.4/35
Trioplan 2.8/100
Don't get me wrong, these are not bad lenses, but the performance is nothing extraordinary (especially 2.8/20). And they are still pretty common, yet the prices are going thru the roof.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is not collector or photographer question , question is our grandchildren still able to find them in volume or they just see them in museum. This is our responsibility. Generations of photographers did care them and now silly people not respect it because they are cheap or not top performer. This is same wrong than in early 20th century people did burn mummies because they were cheap and available. We should take care all equipment no matter of they current price tag , their performance etc. What we can buy nowadays for peanuts that is abnormal , straight way to loose them for ever for photographers.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 10:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
but if they are lost, or if they become traded to the extent that they are cheapened, doesn't that actually mean they are fetching their true value?
If every lens ever made was still in circulation, what value would they have?

There are 26 people bidding for that lens, that's 26 people who are independently deciding what the value is.

What 'you' paid for the same lens last week or last year doesn't matter, there's 26 people out there who have decided on a value today. And it works both ways.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 10:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm not at all dismayed that there are such people. I bought my CZJ Sonnar 135 for about £10. Such buyers may come in handy at some point.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
Generations of photographers did care them and now silly people not respect it because they are cheap or not top performer. This is same wrong than in early 20th century people did burn mummies because they were cheap and available. We should take care all equipment no matter of they current price tag , their performance etc. What we can buy nowadays for peanuts that is abnormal , straight way to loose them for ever for photographers.


So... how's that lens in your bird cage doing? Mr. Green


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Allow me to put one to her if I did save hundreds or thousands already ...


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
Allow me to put one to her if I did save hundreds or thousands already ...


Haha, just giving you a hard time. Wink As you said, it is still fungus free! So perhaps it still is being preserved for future generations...

It would make an interesting experiment to give it a cleaning and see how well it has done. Cool


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing any lenses. If I don't like some lens, I just sell it. If it is necessary, I do cleaning and relubing so it can serve someone other. Not one of my lens ended in trash.
I take same care of all my lenses. It doesn't matter if I bought it for 10€ or 300€.

Attila wrote:
This is not collector or photographer question , question is our grandchildren still able to find them in volume or they just see them in museum. This is our responsibility. Generations of photographers did care them and now silly people not respect it because they are cheap or not top performer.

It is the carefuller photographer vs. collector question. In the end all Biotars 75 or Priomplans 75 ends on shelf of rich collectors and instead of taking photos - which is they primary purpose - they will only collect dust...

And high price is definitely not protection from silly people. I saw lot of irreversibly "converted" EXA lenses to other mounts. Shaved lenses, because they collide with the mirror of new shiny 5D. And while the 5D body will be in 5-10 years dead and nobody cares because here is new shiny 5D MKIV, the 70 years old Biotar which survived WWII is trashed forewer. And only due it is "cool" now to use old MF lenses. That is the dark side of rising popularity of these lenses, which makes me sad.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 03, 2010 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
This is not collector or photographer question , question is our grandchildren still able to find them in volume or they just see them in museum. This is our responsibility. Generations of photographers did care them and now silly people not respect it because they are cheap or not top performer. This is same wrong than in early 20th century people did burn mummies because they were cheap and available. We should take care all equipment no matter of they current price tag , their performance etc. What we can buy nowadays for peanuts that is abnormal , straight way to loose them for ever for photographers.


As a person who enjoys lots of old stuff besides cameras -- like guitars, motorcycles, cars, even hand tools, I can certainly relate to this viewpoint. What we see as being of little value today may have tremendous value in a few decades time. I could tell you stories about guitars I've owned . . . Rolling Eyes Shocked

But as time goes by, demand will increase for the really great pieces and as an inevitable result the price of these pieces will go up as well. This can be a good and a bad thing. The good thing is it insures that these valuable pieces are preserved for future generations -- think Stradivarius violins, as an extreme example -- but the bad news is that most people will not be able to afford them.

Honestly, I don't see how we can have one without the other. If we wish to preserve pieces because of their intrinsic value, sooner or later the word gets out and the values of these pieces increase because of their intrinsic value. I would say the best that future generations can hope for is the crafty moves by makers like Samyang, who see the high demand for excellent quality optics, and who are willing to take the risk and produce them at an affordable price. This will insure that people who are not rich will still be able to enjoy performance on par with the great lenses of the past. One reason why I wish Samyang all the best of success in the marketing of its great lenses.

But there's another thing we need to consider -- and that is the sort of unpredictable nature of the future and what it may have in store for us. Who can honestly say where optics will be in terms of development a few generations from now? It seems to me that chances are highly likely that innovations will occur that we can't even conceive of at this point that will fundamentally change the way we view and capture images. It could easily be as fundamental as the paradigm shift that has occurred from film to digital that has largely rendered film obsolete as a means of capturing image information -- or at least the perception thereof. And look at what this shift has done to the price of film gear? Hey, to a die-hard film user like me, it's a god-send being able to buy gear for dirt cheap that I used to be able only to wish fondly for. But this same sort of shift in paradigms may occur that will render glass as a means of transmitting and focusing light equally obsolete. And when/if this occurs, even the very best of optics will soon become regarded as curious antiques.


PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Just noticed a Canon fd 50mm f1.4 WITH hood(?) currently at 101GBP with 33, yes 33, bidders.....the world is going crazy over mf lenses, are people getting fed up with autofocus etc etc??


PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
What a serious debate =)

I think that starts something like "fashion era" of MF lenses.
...or maybe they haven't money for AFs at same range? Very Happy


PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 10:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
trev wrote:
Just noticed a Canon fd 50mm f1.4 WITH hood(?) currently at 101GBP with 33, yes 33, bidders.....the world is going crazy over mf lenses, are people getting fed up with autofocus etc etc??


Probably 33 bids and not 33 unique bidders?


PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 11:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think this forum would have something to do with the prices as when I checked out a lens on ebay it would nearly always end up here at MFLenses Rolling Eyes ...it's our fault Very Happy for higher prices on MF glass.


PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 4:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Certainly the price of MD and FD lenses is likely to rise now the NEX is about with its 1.5x crop factor Smile


PostPosted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 5:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
ManualFocus-G wrote:
Certainly the price of MD and FD lenses is likely to rise now the NEX is about with its 1.5x crop factor Smile


Yep. Are FD/MD adapters available for the NEX yet? Tell you what, I'm thinking seriously about getting one, just so I can use my FD glass on a digicam. Better buy the FD stuff while it's still affordable too, I suppose. Look at what's happened to M42 in just a few years.
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