Pentax P30t - Broken advance lever

[Scheimpflug]

So I dropped into our local thrift store a few weeks back, and something caught my eye behind the counter. Could it be? A SLR? (It has been ages since I have seen anything other than 80's era plastic fixed-lens cameras).

I inspected it the best I could (dead batteries = no functionality, but it looked decent), and NZ $15 later (~US $10), I was the proud (?) owner of a Pentax P30t, a Takumar-A-Zoom 28-80mm f/3.5-4.5 lens, and a roll of Kodak Max 400.





I brought it home and cleaned out the battery compartment, where the old batteries had been leaking. Fortunately, the green gunk from the old batteries was in a crystallized form that literally fell off cleanly when poked at with a toothpick, so I didn't have any corrosion or serious cleanup to deal with. NZ $3.50 in new batteries, and the meter was working and the shutter snapped! .... once.


It turns out that the reason it was donated was because the advance lever is broken. It was a weak design, and someone pushed on it too hard and broke the end where it attaches to the camera.



I searched for repair parts, but I can't find any on the internet. The P30t seems to have a street value of around US $30, so perhaps this model just isn't worth the time for anyone to part out?

I attempted to bend the broken part back into shape, but it is obvious that the metal is very fatigued, and the stresses have deformed the shape of the opening. It certainly will not hold up to regular use.




... But then I made a discovery. The screw holding the lever to the camera has reverse threads, so turning anti-clockwise tightens the screw. This is also the same direction as the lever needs to turn to advance the film! So, even with the broken lever, it is possible to advance the film (and wind the shutter) with a screwdriver!





Obviously this is a bit cumbersome for regular use... but I am now considering purchasing a cheap "precision screwdriver set", and epoxying a screwdriver bit, the lever, and the screw all together.

This would in theory bind the lever to the tiny screwhead via the bit. It's a kludge, that is for sure, but it seems to be the only real way to save an otherwise working camera from the rubbish bin. It also has the disadvantage that if it doesn't work, there is no going back as the screw could no longer be unscrewed.


So, before I try that, does anyone have any other repair suggestions? Or perhaps a place that would sell a replacement advance lever?

Thanks.
_________________
Sigma DP1, Nikon D40 (hers ), Polaroid x530, Pentax P30t, Pentax P50, (P30t/P50 K-A to Nikon F body mount conversion)
Nikon: 18-55/3.5-5.6 "G ED II DX" (F) Soligor: 28/2.8 (FL->F converted), 135/3.5 (F), 3x TC (F, modified) Kalimar: 28-85/3.5 (F)
Vivitar: 70-210/2.8-4.0 Version 3 (F), Tele 500/6.3 Preset (F), 19/3.8 (F) Minolta: 300/5.6 (SR/MC/MD pending F conversion)
Tamron: 28/2.8 (Adaptall) Panagor: 28/2.5 (FD) Aetna: 300/5.6 (F) Osawa: MC 28/2.8 (F)
Vintage Lenses: Dallmeyer: 1940s A.M. 14in 356mm f4 (ULF->M42) 1930s Adon Telephoto Taylor, Taylor & Hobson: 1880s Rapid Rectilinear 8 1/2 x 6 1/2 11.31in f/8 (LF->?)
Parts Lenses: Nikon 35-135/3.5-4.5 (F), Sigma 70-210/4.5 (F), Nikon 50/1.8 Series E (F)

[kansalliskala]

Try find a spanner that has the slot width the same as the original lever? Then it sticks to slightly awkward position but you can try to bend it. Don't buy too expensive, the cheaper the softer to bend ..

Click here to see on Ebay

EDIT: something like this but smaller:
Click here to see on Ebay
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Projects: Agfa Isolette III (no shutter), Canon AE-1D (no sensor), The "Peace Camera

[Scheimpflug]

Now that's an interesting idea!

Unfortunately, the orientation of the slot is 90-degrees rotated from the ideal, so the mini spanner would be facing out when at rest, and would have to rotate around the front of the camera when advancing! I'm not sure if this is possible due to the shape of the plastic around the lever....

Still a good idea though, I'll have to think about it. Thanks!
_________________
Sigma DP1, Nikon D40 (hers ), Polaroid x530, Pentax P30t, Pentax P50, (P30t/P50 K-A to Nikon F body mount conversion)
Nikon: 18-55/3.5-5.6 "G ED II DX" (F) Soligor: 28/2.8 (FL->F converted), 135/3.5 (F), 3x TC (F, modified) Kalimar: 28-85/3.5 (F)
Vivitar: 70-210/2.8-4.0 Version 3 (F), Tele 500/6.3 Preset (F), 19/3.8 (F) Minolta: 300/5.6 (SR/MC/MD pending F conversion)
Tamron: 28/2.8 (Adaptall) Panagor: 28/2.5 (FD) Aetna: 300/5.6 (F) Osawa: MC 28/2.8 (F)
Vintage Lenses: Dallmeyer: 1940s A.M. 14in 356mm f4 (ULF->M42) 1930s Adon Telephoto Taylor, Taylor & Hobson: 1880s Rapid Rectilinear 8 1/2 x 6 1/2 11.31in f/8 (LF->?)
Parts Lenses: Nikon 35-135/3.5-4.5 (F), Sigma 70-210/4.5 (F), Nikon 50/1.8 Series E (F)

[Scheimpflug]

Ok, so I went with my first approach. In the end, I just couldn't find the parts, and it wouldn't have been worth it to buy & ship a whole second body just for parts.

I did change my plans a little bit though. Instead of epoxying the advance lever to the shaft, I instead epoxied a wing nut to the screw which previously held the advance lever on the shaft. The reason for this is that epoxying the advance lever would have been permanent - if it had worked, great, but if not, I never would have been able to remove it. Without being able to remove the lever, the top shell of the camera can't come off, so it essentially would have made the camera un-serviceable.

So first, I picked up a cheap mini-screwdriver with bits. I think I paid NZ $1.50 (~ US $1.06).


Did I mention it was cheap? Look at that Phillips bit on the left!


Next, I took the smallest Phillips bit, and filed the tip to a smaller shape with thinner blades that fit snugly into the tiny screwhead. This is the mechanical connection which will transfer the force - the epoxy is just to hold the pieces together. Here is the final result all glued together:



I had first tried a knob, but found that any knob I could find was too tall, and blocked access to the shutter button. So instead I went with the wing nut. With it oriented the way it is, you can just reach right past the side of it. The large ears actually make it pretty easy to turn as well - probably easier than a knob would have been. Here is the completed assembly on the camera:




If I was doing it again, I would get a slightly smaller wing nut, and cut down the rear of the bit to make it shorter. Otherwise, it seems sturdy enough, and is actually pretty easy to wind, aside from the fact that you can't do it with just a thumb anymore. Plus, if I ever do come across the replacement parts, this assembly just unscrews, so it should be pretty easy to return it to factory condition.
_________________
Sigma DP1, Nikon D40 (hers ), Polaroid x530, Pentax P30t, Pentax P50, (P30t/P50 K-A to Nikon F body mount conversion)
Nikon: 18-55/3.5-5.6 "G ED II DX" (F) Soligor: 28/2.8 (FL->F converted), 135/3.5 (F), 3x TC (F, modified) Kalimar: 28-85/3.5 (F)
Vivitar: 70-210/2.8-4.0 Version 3 (F), Tele 500/6.3 Preset (F), 19/3.8 (F) Minolta: 300/5.6 (SR/MC/MD pending F conversion)
Tamron: 28/2.8 (Adaptall) Panagor: 28/2.5 (FD) Aetna: 300/5.6 (F) Osawa: MC 28/2.8 (F)
Vintage Lenses: Dallmeyer: 1940s A.M. 14in 356mm f4 (ULF->M42) 1930s Adon Telephoto Taylor, Taylor & Hobson: 1880s Rapid Rectilinear 8 1/2 x 6 1/2 11.31in f/8 (LF->?)
Parts Lenses: Nikon 35-135/3.5-4.5 (F), Sigma 70-210/4.5 (F), Nikon 50/1.8 Series E (F)

[mo]

I reckon it looks kinda cool ...the personal touch! You could say it's your own personal camera radar... Is that the squashed Nikon lens?
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Moira, Moderator
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Auto Mamiya/Sekor 1.8/55 ...Auto Mamiya/Sekor 2/50 Auto Mamiya/Sekor 200/3.5 Tamron SP500/8

[visualopsins]

Nicely done!

"Wing nut" always makes me laugh Does anybody know what those nuts with a ring are called? (no, not "ring nut") One of those would, besides being too tall to comfortably reach the shutter button, make the camera look like a miniature old radio direction finder, used for radio navigation before GPS. I'm old enough to have used those as a teen(!). Used to be charts had frequencies and location of transmitters; first the receiver was tuned, then the RDF antenna which swiveled on a 'compass rose' was turned until radio signal strength nulled to find transmitter direction; two or more transmitter directions when plotted crossed at your position on the chart...useful when too far to see shore and when foggy...
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Cameras: Canon 5Dc, Spotmatics II, F, ESII, Pentax 6x7

Lenses: S-M-C Takumars 17-500mm (18 lenses), S-M-C Macro-Takumars 50 & 100mm, S-M-C Bellows Takumar, Macro-Takumar 50/4 1:1, S-M-C Takumars/6x7 55-200mm (7 lenses)

[Scheimpflug]

Haha, yeah, I suppose I should have also picked up a brass wing nut instead of this one out of my drawer. To give it a little zing while keeping with the vintage feel. Oh well.

Yep, that's your lens! Still just as smashed.. but I actually got it back together after the repair attempt! It still technically works, I suppose, you just can't focus and it is a permanent tilt lens.
_________________
Sigma DP1, Nikon D40 (hers ), Polaroid x530, Pentax P30t, Pentax P50, (P30t/P50 K-A to Nikon F body mount conversion)
Nikon: 18-55/3.5-5.6 "G ED II DX" (F) Soligor: 28/2.8 (FL->F converted), 135/3.5 (F), 3x TC (F, modified) Kalimar: 28-85/3.5 (F)
Vivitar: 70-210/2.8-4.0 Version 3 (F), Tele 500/6.3 Preset (F), 19/3.8 (F) Minolta: 300/5.6 (SR/MC/MD pending F conversion)
Tamron: 28/2.8 (Adaptall) Panagor: 28/2.5 (FD) Aetna: 300/5.6 (F) Osawa: MC 28/2.8 (F)
Vintage Lenses: Dallmeyer: 1940s A.M. 14in 356mm f4 (ULF->M42) 1930s Adon Telephoto Taylor, Taylor & Hobson: 1880s Rapid Rectilinear 8 1/2 x 6 1/2 11.31in f/8 (LF->?)
Parts Lenses: Nikon 35-135/3.5-4.5 (F), Sigma 70-210/4.5 (F), Nikon 50/1.8 Series E (F)

[martyn_bannister]

[Scheimpflug]

Thanks for the concerns. I had thought about making a replacement lever, but that hole with the squared off sides, combined with the tight tolerance against the top plastic housing on the camera, had me stumped.

How would you go about it?

I suppose if this breaks, I would probably bite the bullet and find another Pentax body at auction. Much less work than sourcing another left-handed screw... potentially cheaper too.

In the mean time, I'll try to be gentle with it...
_________________
Sigma DP1, Nikon D40 (hers ), Polaroid x530, Pentax P30t, Pentax P50, (P30t/P50 K-A to Nikon F body mount conversion)
Nikon: 18-55/3.5-5.6 "G ED II DX" (F) Soligor: 28/2.8 (FL->F converted), 135/3.5 (F), 3x TC (F, modified) Kalimar: 28-85/3.5 (F)
Vivitar: 70-210/2.8-4.0 Version 3 (F), Tele 500/6.3 Preset (F), 19/3.8 (F) Minolta: 300/5.6 (SR/MC/MD pending F conversion)
Tamron: 28/2.8 (Adaptall) Panagor: 28/2.5 (FD) Aetna: 300/5.6 (F) Osawa: MC 28/2.8 (F)
Vintage Lenses: Dallmeyer: 1940s A.M. 14in 356mm f4 (ULF->M42) 1930s Adon Telephoto Taylor, Taylor & Hobson: 1880s Rapid Rectilinear 8 1/2 x 6 1/2 11.31in f/8 (LF->?)
Parts Lenses: Nikon 35-135/3.5-4.5 (F), Sigma 70-210/4.5 (F), Nikon 50/1.8 Series E (F)

[martyn_bannister]

[Scheimpflug]

Haha. Ok, well, that experiment didn't last too long.



As you can see by the counter, I made it through 8 shots before it broke free. Was anyone taking bets? It separated right at the screw head - the epoxy gave free on about 3/4 of the screwhead, with about 1/4 of the screw still having a small amount of epoxy stuck to it. I had roughened the surface of the screwhead and cleaned it with alcohol, so apparently it was just too much force on too small of an area.

[martyn_bannister]

[luisalegria]

I would first try thick brass stock. You can probably forget about fitting it to the plastic, thats just for show anyway. A bench vise, biggish pliers, tin snips and a hefty flat file will give you the basic shape.

As Martyn said, its a hand filing job, but very doable.

The hole is the critical part. You will have to drill it out to a size just big enough for a fine triangle or square section file, and then its basically carving with a file, until it fits.
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I like Pentax DSLR's, Exaktas, M42 bodies of all kinds, strange and cheap Japanese lenses, and am dabbling in medium format/Speed Graphic work.

[Elkind]

hi, everyone.
have you any photos of P30n under top cover of my camera's wire distribution is not equal to “service manual” (possible, not accurate service was in past), so, I have troubles with “diaphragm control block” and exposure values.

thanks a lot!

[Scheimpflug]