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Photokina 2008
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PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 6:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
A G Photography wrote:
Richard_D wrote:
It looks pretty good for that many pixels, very little noise at 200, if not totally noise free at 100%. Not quite up there with the Canon 1ds MkIII but pretty good.


To my eyes at 100% it looks more nitid than Canon 1ds MKIII though, just my impression?


Yes the samples do look bright but smooth if that's what you mean.

To be honest beyond the large files the Canon 1ds MkIII produces I'm not that impressed with it's IQ - up to 400 ISO I think the 5D produces much better images, I suspect if you interpolated a 5D shot at 200 ISO it would be on a par with the 1ds MkIII...

Sony have obviously cut corners to keep the price low - what's a plastic shell doing on a camera aimed at semi-pro's - and in terms of speed etc. it's specs are decidely average rather than class leading, but provisionally it looks a very good camera for the price. They might not quite be up on the playing field with Nikon and Canon yet, but they seem to be on the sidelines already.


PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 6:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have taken a closer look at more 100% samples:

http://www.imaging-resource.com/PRODS/AA900/AA900HI_ISO_NR.HTM

ISO 800 looks quite noisy compared to resized images, and 1600 ISO even more. However, I have saved on my disk the "noise reduction off" version of one 1600 ISO image, and processed it with Noise Ninja, and obtained a significantly better result than any "NR" versions.

So I think buyers of this camera should also buy Noise Ninja and save pictures with noise reduction off, to denoise them in Photoshop later.


PostPosted: Tue Sep 09, 2008 11:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:

So I think buyers of this camera should also buy Noise Ninja and save pictures with noise reduction off, to denoise them in Photoshop later.


Good advice. Noise Ninja also works stand alone, and recently is available as a plugin for Aperture as well.


PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Another rumor http://www.eos-numerique.com/forums/f11/exclusivite-eos-numerique-le-nouveau-5d-mark-ii-89968/ ???


PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 7:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I will not spend 2600 Euros for a videocamera Mad


PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
I will not spend 2600 Euros for a videocamera Mad


You feel that the ability to capture the liveview video somehow impacts the still-image performance? Could you explain how that could be the case? I can't see a mechanism, myself.


PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2008 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
ChrisLilley wrote:
Orio wrote:
I will not spend 2600 Euros for a videocamera Mad


You feel that the ability to capture the liveview video somehow impacts the still-image performance? Could you explain how that could be the case? I can't see a mechanism, myself.


What I feel is, they have diverted part of the investment to make a video recorder, and I don't want that. This means maybe the camera is a 2000USD worth for photos and 600USD worth for video. Well I don't want that, I want that all the money that I pay for a camera has gone into R&D to make better photos, not video.

Additional worry: the video trend casts a menacing shadow on whom this camera aims at. If they are targeting semi-amateurs, then there is also the risk that they fit in 26 MP or so but without the necessary quality control.

What I want is: more REAL (not cheesy) MP, to allow safer cropping, better quality at ISO 800/1600, and more dynamic range if possible.

For video function, I have the same interest and use that I have for 70 yrs old Jeohva Witness women ringing my bell on Sunday mornings or 200 Kgs, 70cm long hair WWE wrestlers: NONE.

Bottom line: give me a semipro reflex camera, that is what I ask for.
Multiplay toys, that's not for me.

If this is really the new camera, then chances are I might get a 50D as second body, or perhaps no second body at all.


PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 8:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tomorrow we might see what Pentax prepared for Photokina '08
http://www.pentax.de/de/roadshow.php


PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
ChrisLilley wrote:
Orio wrote:
I will not spend 2600 Euros for a videocamera Mad


You feel that the ability to capture the liveview video somehow impacts the still-image performance? Could you explain how that could be the case? I can't see a mechanism, myself.


What I feel is, they have diverted part of the investment to make a video recorder, and I don't want that. This means maybe the camera is a 2000USD worth for photos and 600USD worth for video. Well I don't want that, I want that all the money that I pay for a camera has gone into R&D to make better photos, not video.

Additional worry: the video trend casts a menacing shadow on whom this camera aims at. If they are targeting semi-amateurs, then there is also the risk that they fit in 26 MP or so but without the necessary quality control.

What I want is: more REAL (not cheesy) MP, to allow safer cropping, better quality at ISO 800/1600, and more dynamic range if possible.

For video function, I have the same interest and use that I have for 70 yrs old Jeohva Witness women ringing my bell on Sunday mornings or 200 Kgs, 70cm long hair WWE wrestlers: NONE.

Bottom line: give me a semipro reflex camera, that is what I ask for.
Multiplay toys, that's not for me.

If this is really the new camera, then chances are I might get a 50D as second body, or perhaps no second body at all.


From what I understand if you're providing a live feed for live-view anyway, there's essentially no additional costs in simply recording it. Nikon have added to the D90 as a test to see how pro's react (following requests from pro's to have it) with a view to adding it to pro cameras in the future if it's well recieved. The main market is photojournalists and media services.


PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 2:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
[quote="Richard_D"
From what I understand if you're providing a live feed for live-view anyway, there's essentially no additional costs in simply recording it. Nikon have added to the D90 as a test to see how pro's react (following requests from pro's to have it) with a view to adding it to pro cameras in the future if it's well recieved. The main market is photojournalists and media services.[/quote]

I don't understand how this live view work, does it keep the mirror locked up or...?


PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
[quote="Richard_D"
From what I understand if you're providing a live feed for live-view anyway, there's essentially no additional costs in simply recording it. Nikon have added to the D90 as a test to see how pro's react (following requests from pro's to have it) with a view to adding it to pro cameras in the future if it's well recieved. The main market is photojournalists and media services.


I don't understand how this live view work, does it keep the mirror locked up or...?[/quote]

On most systems yes.


PostPosted: Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio on the Canon the live view is with the Mirror locked up.
I actually was a skeptic of this feature when I bought the 40D.
I figured it would not be used and be a useless extra. Maybe the feeling you have (as I do) for video capability on a DSLR.
The live view has actually become quite useful at times.
Tripod work such as Macro and product shots are a dream with the live view.
The next 5D (and 50D) will be even better as the LCD will be an improvement over the 40D.
Those 10x magnifications will look much nicer.

Another advantage is the LCD compensates for brightness. So when you stop down for a macro scene for example.
The Scene does not go dark as it would in the viewfinder.
I'm not a big macro shooter but, it is a nice advantage to have when I do make some close focus tripod shots.

Where the live view is worthless IMHO is for long lens work.
The tiniest movement and the wholoe scene goes wiggling like mad Rolling Eyes Worthless!


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 1:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I actually really hope the new Canon does offer video. Here's why. I work at a small daily newspaper. Like most newspapers, there is increasing emphasis being put on our Web page, including videos. Our publisher recently asked if we could just shoot everything with a video camera and frame-grab stills as needed. I think that would result in low-quality still images. I would much rather have a DSLR that would also shoot videos. Sure, having a DSLR and a good video camera is the best solution. But if the budget only allowed for one camera, I'd much rather it be a DSLR that shoots videos. Even if I had a video camera, it would be nice to have a DSLR that could shoot video so I always had that option available, even if I left the video camera in the car because I didn't think I would need it.

I'm not trying to be contradictory, and I can understand Orio's desire that time and money be focused on a producing a camera that will take the best still images. I don't disagree with that. But I do think for certain types of photography like photojournalism, it would be nice to have a DSLR that shoots video. Mine is just another viewpoint, and certainly isn't more correct than others.

--Geoff


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 2:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
gcrimmins wrote:

I'm not trying to be contradictory, and I can understand Orio's desire that time and money be focused on a producing a camera that will take the best still images. I don't disagree with that. But I do think for certain types of photography like photojournalism, it would be nice to have a DSLR that shoots video. Mine is just another viewpoint, and certainly isn't more correct than others.
--Geoff


The solution is, Canon gives the 7DV for 2600 Eur and the 7DS for 2000 Eur Wink


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 6:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Panasonic G1 the m4/3 camera Smile
http://www.dpreview.com/Previews/PanasonicG1/


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2008 7:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
F16SUNSHINE wrote:

The live view has actually become quite useful at times.
Tripod work such as Macro and product shots are a dream with the live view.


That is why the next camera I buy has to have live view. (My last one (not an SLR, but a Minolta A1 bridge) had this feature and I really miss it.

F16SUNSHINE wrote:
Where the live view is worthless IMHO is for long lens work.
The tiniest movement and the wholoe scene goes wiggling like mad Rolling Eyes Worthless!


Actually that is useful too Smile its telling you that you need a better tripod, a better head, or better long lens technique Wink


PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:


Actually that is useful too Smile its telling you that you need a better tripod, a better head, or better long lens technique Wink


hehe
Maybe that's true. Try it with a 200-400 on a 1.6 crop cam with the live view in magnification of 5X-10X and tell me what you think Wink

I'll stick to the focus screen. Smile


PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 12:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
sunshine wrote:
Maybe that's true. Try it with a 200-400 on a 1.6 crop cam with the live view in magnification of 5X-10X and tell me what you think

this is true for Canon, others have in body stabilization and liveview is usable even with magnification
for Canon it is better to have enough money and get lens with IS


PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 1:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
My main objection to the liveview is that it will make me look like those idiot-looking tourists that hold their compact cameras at one meter distance from them with their arms extended Laughing


PostPosted: Sun Sep 14, 2008 2:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
HA HA Laughing

I agree. This is not the use for Liveview for us MF lens guys.
It is for "private shoots" only Laughing Laughing

Truly though it does have a real purpose for photography.
I would say that it's hard to call it an "expressive" tool if you know what I mean.
For technical shoots and hardhat/lunch pale photography ( jobby style so to speak) it is very useful at times.
Before making use of it. I would Poo Poo live view now I think I like it Smile


PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 12:51 pm    Post subject: Pentax news Reply with quote
http://img254.imageshack.us/my.php?image=nachrichtendivisionimagjz7.jpg
for the moment. Probably official launch on monday.


PostPosted: Fri Sep 19, 2008 5:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
here is some just leaked products from pentax (in german)

http://www.phototalk24.de/news.php?id=95&XTCsid=3238cfedb8ad56559b709bfb9cb7c445


PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 11:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Oly news http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092208olympus_micro_four_thirds.asp (that is what I call a compact camera Very Happy )

and http://www.dpreview.com/news/0809/08092207olympus_four%20thirds.asp


PostPosted: Mon Sep 22, 2008 1:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
??? http://www.flickr.com/photos/29782425@N08/2879015170/sizes/l/ ???
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