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Looking for a 100mm pancake
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PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:11 pm    Post subject: Looking for a 100mm pancake Reply with quote
Well, not really a pancake as I suppose such a lens does not exist...
But a small ~100mm lens wich has good iq. Doesn't has to be superb, but at least ok.

I've been looking at the Nikon E-series 100/2.8 wich seems pretty small (and good), but are there any smaller or equally in size that are better perhaps?


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The only 100mm I have any experience with is the Canon New FD 100mm f/2.8. It's quite compact, considerably smaller than the old style breechlock mount FD. But it will be of limited usefulness for you because of the FD mount, depending on which camera make you use.

Back when I was a camera dealer, I bought and sold quite a few old Takumars, and as I recall, the 105mm f/2.8 is pretty compact. Here's a link showing one, complete with a drawing showing its dimensions. 68.3mm (2.69") from nose to the end of its mounting threads.

EDIT: I should have mentioned that I also have and use a couple of macros in that focal range -- the Tamron 90mm, which actually is quite compact when fully collapsed -- and the Vivitar 105mm, which isn't compact by any stretch of the imagination. I also have and use a Nikkor 105/2.5, but I don't consider this lens to be compact either. Thus I didn't mention it.

Last edited by cooltouch on Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:40 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Michael did you forget the link?

The preset Takumar f2.8/105 is very compact!
Later 105mm Takumars are equal in length, but the diameter of the preset is smaller.


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
My M42 Novoflex-Memmingen Noflexar 105/3.5 is only 38mm deep. But the required tubes or bellows (it's an enlarger lens) would quickly un-pancake it. Smile I can't comment on other ~100mm glass, but my old IS Nikkor 85/2 is just 60mm from top to bottom, especially after I cut away some base protrusions to fit it to a Pentax K-mount. But this is an interesting question: who made/makes the shortest (35mm FF or HF) ~100mm lens? I seem to recall reading of short mirror lenses -- or is that a false memory?


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have a Palinar (Tokina) 100/4 which is tiny and is nice from wide open.

Also, most Olympus Zuiko lenses are pretty compact.


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
Michael did you forget the link?

The preset Takumar f2.8/105 is very compact!
Later 105mm Takumars are equal in length, but the diameter of the preset is smaller.


Whoops, I sure did! Here's the link:

http://whitemetal.com/pentax/smct_105_28/index.htm


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:15 pm    Post subject: Re: Looking for a 100mm pancake Reply with quote
Swappo wrote:
Well, not really a pancake as I suppose such a lens does not exist...
But a small ~100mm lens wich has good iq. Doesn't has to be superb, but at least ok.


Later incarnations of Olympus Zuiko 100/2.8 are great and *very* compact (although slightly heavier than the Nikon Series E lens because they're made of metal). Later versions (labeled simply "Zuiko" and not "E.Zuiko" on the front ring) are, unlike Nikon E's, multicoated. They are supposed to be very sharp and very well corrected for CA and purple fringing.

http://www.whitemetal.com/olympus/om_mc_100_28/index.htm

Nikon Series E 100/2.8: Weight: 215g; Dimensions: 62.5mm dia. x 57.5mm long;

Olympus Zuiko 100/2.8: Weight: 230g; Dimensions: 60mm dia. x 48mm long.


PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
Michael did you forget the link?

The preset Takumar f2.8/105 is very compact!
Later 105mm Takumars are equal in length, but the diameter of the preset is smaller.


Indeed. By the way, the Meyer Orestor 100/2.8 is less long than the Takumar. Not by much, but the Orestor is almost 1cm less long. Both at infinity of course. The Takumar is thinner than the Orestor though.

But the smallest I know of (personally) is the Hanimar Tele-Lens 1:2.8 f=105mm. It's almost as thin as the 105mm pre-set Takumar, and less long than the Orestor (the Hanimar is 0,5cm less long).

Quick picture:



PostPosted: Fri Jul 16, 2010 8:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some very good suggestions here.
Thanks alot everyone. I will look closer at the suggestions.


PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
Michael did you forget the link?

The preset Takumar f2.8/105 is very compact!
Later 105mm Takumars are equal in length, but the diameter of the preset is smaller.


Its difficult to find the earlier version of the preset. There is a difference in the optical formula of the early and late 4/4 & 4/5. The early optics are like the Auto Tak and the later ones optics are like the Super Tak.


PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 5:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Spotmatic wrote:
But the smallest I know of (personally) is the Hanimar Tele-Lens 1:2.8 f=105mm. It's almost as thin as the 105mm pre-set Takumar, and less long than the Orestor (the Hanimar is 0,5cm less long).



Ah, I have this lens! It appears to be a very simple Ernostar-based design (just like the Nikon's Series E lens), yet obviously it's a much older lens. The age takes its tall, and this humble Hanimar (actually, mine is branded "Hanimex", with the rest of the letters, including "Tele-Lens", still there on the ring) is nowhere as sharp or contrasty wide open as the rest of the 100mm bunch. Mine was also very stiff focusing, I had to take it apart to change the lube (a very easy job by the way).

An interesting thing about this Hanimar/Hanimex lens is that it's using an unusial form of a T-mount. The thread is wider than 42mm, so standard T2 adapters will not fit. Luckily, it is mostly found with M42 adapter.


PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The E-series is a great solution for a small and lightweight 100mm. It is literally the size of many 50mm lenses. It is sharp wide open and has nice bokeh. You can often find them at bargain prices.


This might help for a size reference. The lens is shown with an EF adapter, which adds a tiny bit of thickness



PostPosted: Sat Jul 17, 2010 7:54 am    Post subject: Pancakes? Not really, but pretty small Reply with quote
3 short ~100mm lenses:
Panchrotal 1:2,5 4". Very good performer, but not original in this mount, just for comparing the size.
2,8/100 Orestor, nice and compact lens.
Pentacon 2,8/100, bit shorter than the Orestor, but not so slim.

The Orestor would fit in any camera bag. And I remember that it is a nice performer. Maybe not outstanding, but very good.

Klaus



PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
How does the Tamron 105 f/2.5 BBAR MC compare to the mentioned lenses?


PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The MC Kaleinar-5N 100/2.8 is also quite compact about 63 mm long, 61 mm dia.

And sharp wide open.

Markku


PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Gurdie wrote:
The MC Kaleinar-5N 100/2.8 is also quite compact about 63 mm long, 61 mm dia.

And sharp wide open.

Markku


I was just about to mention this lens.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 18, 2010 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Gurdie wrote:
The MC Kaleinar-5N 100/2.8 is also quite compact about 63 mm long, 61 mm dia.

And sharp wide open.


Right, I forgot about this one. It's a nice 100mm, better IMO than the Nikon Series E lens. Multicoated, but can struggle with flare (I had three samples, and one had inadequate blackening). Some (most?) samples have internal haze and internal cleaning marks, so beware when getting one.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 2:17 am    Post subject: Zuiko and Canon and Rokkor Reply with quote
At <50mm length, the Zuiko is probably the shortest of the 100mm world, and a super lens, even the older version.

The Canon FD is a nice 100/2.8 lens (at 55mm) and available reasonably.

If you're willing to go up to 60mm length (and have an unlimited budget!), then the Tele-Rokkor 100mm f2 is divine!

Good luck on your search.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Besides Pentagon / Meyer i think Berolina is great by looks and performance (very sharp wide-open), size is comparable to others mentioned. I don't know the actual producer; have seen them under name Beroflex too. Mine is pretty worn outside though perfect glass.





PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:16 pm    Post subject: Re: Zuiko and Canon and Rokkor Reply with quote
robertro wrote:
If you're willing to go up to 60mm length (and have an unlimited budget!), then the Tele-Rokkor 100mm f2 is divine!


With an unlimited budget you can also buy a Zuiko 100/2.
But I would not consider any 100mm a 'pancake' because none of them is 'flat'.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 19, 2010 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I wish I could find a ~100mm pancake for you like the SMC Pentax-DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited!



PostPosted: Tue Jul 20, 2010 1:09 am    Post subject: Re: Zuiko and Canon and Rokkor Reply with quote
AhamB wrote:
robertro wrote:
If you're willing to go up to 60mm length (and have an unlimited budget!), then the Tele-Rokkor 100mm f2 is divine!


With an unlimited budget you can also buy a Zuiko 100/2.
But I would not consider any 100mm a 'pancake' because none of them is 'flat'.


True, but the Zuiko is ~10mm longer than the superb Tele-Rokkor. One of the few cases where Olympus failed to deliver the shortest lans in its class - I'm sure that there are not many such cases!


PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 10:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Blue wrote:
kuuan wrote:
Michael did you forget the link?

The preset Takumar f2.8/105 is very compact!
Later 105mm Takumars are equal in length, but the diameter of the preset is smaller.


Its difficult to find the earlier version of the preset. There is a difference in the optical formula of the early and late 4/4 & 4/5. The early optics are like the Auto Tak and the later ones optics are like the Super Tak.


Blue do you know how the two versions of the preset Tak compare in IQ?


Spotmatic wrote:
I wish I could find a ~100mm pancake for you like the SMC Pentax-DA 70mm f/2.4 Limited!



a pancake and 105mm equivalent on the Pentax dSLR camera!
must be ideal for candid portraits ( I must own this lens once Wink )


PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Small and sharpest from wide open, difficult to beat the Contax 3.5/100 Sonnar.
But the Pentacon 100 is also a very nice lens to have, albeit completely different in character.


PostPosted: Mon Dec 13, 2010 11:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
100mm lenses like 85mm hard to find crappy one.
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