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PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 9:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I don't think Orio is talking about exporting files as .DNG, rather converting them using the free DNG converter. .DNG is simply Adobe's own RAW format, the idea being that you import your RAW files as .DNG and use Lightroom as you would normally. That way you don't touch the original .DNG files and you keep all your workflow.


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 9:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
My concept is simple:

- keep your originals in native format (as long as you have bought the camera, you also have the software that comes with it, which will be always available)

- make your backup in DNG format, using the free DNG converter (as Shrek pointed out), so you will also have this format option available for the many software that open it

Waste of space? What, you don't make a backup of your best photos anyway? If you don't, too bad for you.
The day your hard disk will die (because it will), you will cry.


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 11:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Of course I have a full backup of my lightroom catalog, which includes originals and lightroom edits. So you propose to have that backup in DNG format, presumably in edited form, is that right? That's not very safe since one can potentially lose originals to the HD crash. Safe solution would be to have lightroom catalog + backup of lightroom catalog + DNGs of edits. That's still 3 big files for each photo, compared to 2 for the setup that I currently use with the advantage that edited files are readily available for use with other programs. Hmm, something to consider...


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
fermy wrote:
So you propose to have that backup in DNG format, presumably in edited form, is that right?


No, direct conversion of original files, via free DNG converter.
My original RAWs are never edited. It would be very stupid to do that, because it's pointless.
My edits are stored in the Lightroom catalogue, which is a set of parameters that only point to the original RAWs location. (same happens with Capture Pro).
When you make edits in Lightroom, you edit the parameters, not the original RAW files.
If for any reason you move the originals (for example, because you have lost original hard disk and use a backup disk),
all you have to do in Lightroom is to point the catalog to the new location. Lightroom will re-address the parameters for all files automatically.

If you prefer to keep the backup copy of original RAW files, it does not really matter.
All you have to do is to keep at hand the DNG converter, and you will be able to convert your files any time in case of need.


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
fermy wrote:
So you propose to have that backup in DNG format, presumably in edited form, is that right?

No, direct conversion of original files, via free DNG converter.


Why not back up the original raws and the free DNG converter? If you need a DNG in the future, you can then do the conversion to DNG from the original…


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I can't see a reason to have a DNG copy of a original file when you have the hole LR catalog backed up as the development settings are stored in the catalog database and sidecars, not in DNG raw file. I'm loosing the point where it shows a clear advantage to convert to DNG instead to have a conventional/ original raw file. Even the raw size is almost the same.
Well, suppose you have a backup copy in DNG format. One day, Adobe is sold to Microsoft and the cloud subscription is US$500 per mounth. If you could use before a raw camera maker file - like CR2 - Canon, .NEF - Nikon and so on - with the software provided by the camera maker, and now you can't no more - as far as i know, the reverse path can't be followed.
I remember some years ago have read at Adobe website the initiative to propose DNG as a open, free standard raw file format, and they were giving this solution for free for camera makers - as i remember well only Leica has accepted to use that standard. Nikon and Canon just ignore it. Why that? I don't know.

Renato


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 2:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Renato, I think the point is this. In future, you may buy a new camera and your existing version of Lightroom will not support the new camera's RAW files. In order to import them, you will need to convert the files into .DNG format or buy the new version of Lightroom or pay for a subscription. For those who don't want to pay for software again, they can use the free .DNG converter instead and stay with the old software.


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 2:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
RSalles wrote:
...as i remember well only Leica has accepted to use that standard. Nikon and Canon just ignore it. Why that? I don't know.

Renato


sorry I don't know about file formats, but I do know that the RAWs of my Pentax dSLRs and Ricoh GXR are DNG files ( on Pentax I can choose between DNG and PEF ) and I believe that Samsung, Casio, and Hasselblad use DNG too


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 3:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
RSalles wrote:
I can't see a reason to have a DNG copy of a original file when you have the hole LR catalog backed up as the development settings are stored in the catalog database and sidecars, not in DNG raw file. I'm loosing the point where it shows a clear advantage to convert to DNG instead to have a conventional/ original raw file.


In case someone is obsessed about losing compatibility for his/her own files because of not being able to subscribe to Creative Cloud.


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 3:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
RSalles wrote:
...as i remember well only Leica has accepted to use that standard. Nikon and Canon just ignore it. Why that? I don't know.

Renato


sorry I don't know about file formats, but I do know that the RAWs of my Pentax dSLRs and Ricoh GXR are DNG files ( on Pentax I can choose between DNG and PEF ) and I believe that Samsung, Casio, and Hasselblad use DNG too


Thanks, Kuuan, one thing more i learned today - as my information was very obsolete,

[]s,

Renato


PostPosted: Sat May 11, 2013 4:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
ManualFocus-G wrote:
Renato, I think the point is this. In future, you may buy a new camera and your existing version of Lightroom will not support the new camera's RAW files. In order to import them, you will need to convert the files into .DNG format or buy the new version of Lightroom or pay for a subscription. For those who don't want to pay for software again, they can use the free .DNG converter instead and stay with the old software.


Graham,

I see the point now. Thanks,

Cheers,

Renato
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