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Wide angle macro - How did he do it
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PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It was explained in this very thread here, whenever you use a lens (say a fisheye) which image circle is too small to match teh camera sensor or/and its register is not long enough to match the camera body in use (say a c-mount lens on Nikon body), THEN a relay lens system is used that amplifies the image by a certain factor and also its optics allow to match the camera register.

A simple system would be by using a macro lens as a relay lens (or a reversed wide angle) between the front imaging lens (say a small c-mount fisheye) and camera body.



Last edited by kds315* on Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:35 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So, something like the Repro Nikkor would be a relay lens. Give me some examples from lenses that you are I are familiar with, some combinations.


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

That for instance could be used, as Bjorn showed on his own site relaying a fisheye lens to his Nikon body. Don't have a link anymore.

Did something similar here...(but DOF wasn't optimized to also cover up to infinity)



PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

So a rectilinear fisheye might work. But how do I use a relay lens?


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Mount relay lens to camera, mount fisheye lens to relay lens. Adjust optics accordingly. Pretty simple basically, the "devil is in the details" as we say here Wink

Kidding aside, it needs some proper mechanical and optical matching, but it's doable, skills, time + money enough on hands. I was planning myself of doing that, but ingredient was missing and it wasn't skills... Laughing


Last edited by kds315* on Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:58 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kds315* wrote:
That for instance could be used, as Bjorn showed on his own site relaying a fisheye lens to his Nikon body. Don't have a link anymore.


This one ? http://www.naturfotograf.com/D1_fisheye_1,html.htm


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 11:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What are some good relay lenses, the Repro Nikkor? Give me your thoughts. I know you know this stuff.


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

sichko wrote:
kds315* wrote:
That for instance could be used, as Bjorn showed on his own site relaying a fisheye lens to his Nikon body. Don't have a link anymore.


This one ? http://www.naturfotograf.com/D1_fisheye_1,html.htm


Yes John, that's it - Thanks!

@Michael: That also answers your question. The Repro Nikkor is about the best, most expensive and heaviest relay lens one can get. You're already half way there then, as I know you have it...


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Klaus. It is on my list of things to experiment with.

Of late I am enjoying how great the Leica 60mm Elmarir-R Macro lens is, which I converted to Nikon mount, and added a little extension to. While it is not pure APO, the color is very nice indeed. Here is (not a great) shot I took yesterday with the Nikon D800E, Leica 60mm, and Zerene Stacker.



PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 12:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here another such contraption, made by Bjorn Rorslett a few years ago, using a macro lens as relay lens (resulting quite some light loss actually) http://www.naturfotograf.com/roll_your_own_lens.html

@Michael: a very nice shot indeed (but not related to our topic here ... I would propose you open up a seperate thread with your excellent works in the "Oversized Gallery" section here, as I know you have excellent results to show and many here would enjoy seeing those!)

And btw. most welcome here as a new member Michael, that has nearly slipped Wink


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, as I said abowe in my first post, there are probably multiple ways to achieve similar results. Here are few more shots with my setup.

*****



*****



*****



*****

I did not use relay system, and the pictures are minimally cropped (from 2:3 to 3:4 format for example, like the last picture, or just to straigten the image)
Alex


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

These are great macro shots Alex! Originally it was about achieving such macro shots AND have a wide and sharp view around - that's the difficult part to achieve... Wink


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kds315* wrote:
These are great macro shots Alex! Originally it was about achieving such macro shots AND have a wide and sharp view around - that's the difficult part to achieve... Wink


I am not quite sure what You mean, Klaus.

I have looked at the links posted in the original post and thought that the result I am getting is not that different.

What I am trying to say is that I do not think that Solvin Zankl used relay system in those particular shots at all but I can be wrong (as usual Confused ).


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 6:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I should correct myself. I looked at this gallery again: http://solvinzankl.photoshelter.com/gallery/Wide-view-macro/G0000Xj5NXkE1giM/

Indeed, he achieved a wider view, but I am using APS-C camera. On the other hand, the background definition in some of the shots is similar.

Anyway, if my guess about Zankl's technique is correct - it is very simple. When I am back home I will modify my set-up and will see if I can reproduce some of his shots. Unfortunately, I may need to resort to using preserved fly or cockchafer from my museum collections.


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks! Looking forward to seeing your results Alex, doesn't matter to me if the insects are preserved ones, it is about the technique used....


PostPosted: Sun Nov 11, 2012 7:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kds315* wrote:
...doesn't matter to me if the insects are preserved ones, it is about the technique used....


Oh, it just came to my mind that I can get something from the Bait & Tackle shop Very Happy


PostPosted: Mon Nov 12, 2012 3:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Look what I just found!! http://www.adorama.com/alc/article/13056 promoting very thin extension rings...


PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Can't see any of theses pics.
It says "Content protected by owner"


PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What about now? I guess I messed up with permissions in my gallery yesterday night.


PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

No still blocked


PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It should be open now. If not - I do not know what is happening, sorry.


PostPosted: Tue Nov 13, 2012 2:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

We can see it now thx a lot!! Very Happy


PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kds315* wrote:
Look what I just found!! http://www.adorama.com/alc/article/13056 promoting very thin extension rings...


Just a fast experimentation shot with a RE, Auto-Topcor 3.5/25 and a 6mm tube..... at f/11 ......

These flowers are 1.5cm in diameter...

I have a bunch of rings, including a thinner one, and wider lenses.... I think i could get somewhere with this .... Smile




PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The idea was to also get the background somewhat sharp into the picture ....





Last edited by kds315* on Sat Sep 21, 2013 5:53 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sat Sep 21, 2013 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

1 minute, one experimental shot dosen't make perfect !... Wink

I'll work on it ...