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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:10 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
Peter: Have you sold your Pentor? Did you buy the Auto Beriflex? _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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Spotmatic
Joined: 18 Aug 2008 Posts: 4045 Location: Netherlands
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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Spotmatic wrote:
No, I still have the Pentor because it's such a good performer. I'm not planning to sell it. _________________ Peter - Moderator
Pentax K-5 + Pentax 645 + Canon 5D + Bessa RF 10,5cm Heliar, and a 'little' bag full of MF lenses. The lens list is * here *.
My fast 80s: Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 83mm f/1.9 - Super-Takumar 85mm f/1.9 - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - Cyclop 85/1.5 (Helios-40 innards) - Komura 80mm f/1.8 - Meyer Görlitz Primoplan 7,5cm 1:1.9 - Carl Zeiss Jena 80mm f/1.8 Pancolar - Canon 85mm f/1.8 S.S.C. - Canon 85mm f/1.2 S.S.C. Aspherical |
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Spotmatic
Joined: 18 Aug 2008 Posts: 4045 Location: Netherlands
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 9:38 pm Post subject: |
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Spotmatic wrote:
A Tomioka-Chinon 100mm variant. The design is VERY similar but the differences are there (for instance the focusing ring turns into opposite direction when compared to the Pentor etc. variants).
http://articulo.mercadolibre.com.ar/MLA-119684380-teleobjetivo-chinon-100mm-f28-rosca-universal-made-in-japan-_JM _________________ Peter - Moderator
Pentax K-5 + Pentax 645 + Canon 5D + Bessa RF 10,5cm Heliar, and a 'little' bag full of MF lenses. The lens list is * here *.
My fast 80s: Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 83mm f/1.9 - Super-Takumar 85mm f/1.9 - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - Cyclop 85/1.5 (Helios-40 innards) - Komura 80mm f/1.8 - Meyer Görlitz Primoplan 7,5cm 1:1.9 - Carl Zeiss Jena 80mm f/1.8 Pancolar - Canon 85mm f/1.8 S.S.C. - Canon 85mm f/1.2 S.S.C. Aspherical |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Thu Jul 21, 2011 11:01 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
However you find all that stuff... The Chinon is obviously a Tomioka and the similarities are striking. How does one make a connection if not from the similarities and differences - and is the rotation of the focus ring more a factor than the design of the lens barrel? It would be nice if that Chinon had shown the aperture blades. It would be even better to compare the optics.
No, I won't be disappointed if the lens turns out not to be a Tomioka - I'll be more surprised than disappointed. I didn't buy the lens for that reason, I bought it because of Peter's results. Peter, when I was web searching the lens I saw that you had posted it at several forum sites, which gave me the sense that you were quite impressed with it too. I was wondering if your shots were from a FF camera because that would provide better images. Several of your images have a 3-D pop, especially the jumping skater. We'll see if my results are in the same quality range as yours.
I also noted from your considerable lens list that you also have Meyer Orestor and Meyer Trioplan 100mm lenses. Can you comment on how the Pentor compares to those ? _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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martyn_bannister
Joined: 23 May 2010 Posts: 1151
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:25 am Post subject: |
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martyn_bannister wrote:
Just to throw fuel on the fire, I have a Pentor 35mm that might be a CHINON or even a TOMIOKA? |
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dimitrygo
Joined: 01 Apr 2009 Posts: 561
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:44 am Post subject: |
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dimitrygo wrote:
Wow this is definitely a Tomioka lens. I mean even without a label you can find several elements identical to Yashika lenses made by Tomioka. |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3705 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:57 am Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
It would be cool to know the design. It's not Orestor copy, since rear element goes much deeper and is turned inward. I have same optic system also in Tamron lens body (silver styled like Beroflex). _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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Spotmatic
Joined: 18 Aug 2008 Posts: 4045 Location: Netherlands
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:35 am Post subject: |
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Spotmatic wrote:
Pancolart wrote: |
It would be cool to know the design. It's not Orestor copy, since rear element goes much deeper and is turned inward. I have same optic system also in Tamron lens body (silver styled like Beroflex). |
You mean that the last element of the Chinonflex/Pentor etc. goes deeper into the body. Indeed; also the last element is almost perfectly flat. _________________ Peter - Moderator
Pentax K-5 + Pentax 645 + Canon 5D + Bessa RF 10,5cm Heliar, and a 'little' bag full of MF lenses. The lens list is * here *.
My fast 80s: Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 83mm f/1.9 - Super-Takumar 85mm f/1.9 - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - Cyclop 85/1.5 (Helios-40 innards) - Komura 80mm f/1.8 - Meyer Görlitz Primoplan 7,5cm 1:1.9 - Carl Zeiss Jena 80mm f/1.8 Pancolar - Canon 85mm f/1.8 S.S.C. - Canon 85mm f/1.2 S.S.C. Aspherical |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3705 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 1:09 pm Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
Deeper into the body of camera and more out of lens compared to Orestor.
Rear element on both of my lenses (PORST looking like Pentor) and silver Berolina is concave not flat. Optics surely the same, even coating colors. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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Spotmatic
Joined: 18 Aug 2008 Posts: 4045 Location: Netherlands
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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Spotmatic wrote:
Indeed; it's hard to see though if the last element is concave or flat. _________________ Peter - Moderator
Pentax K-5 + Pentax 645 + Canon 5D + Bessa RF 10,5cm Heliar, and a 'little' bag full of MF lenses. The lens list is * here *.
My fast 80s: Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 83mm f/1.9 - Super-Takumar 85mm f/1.9 - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - Cyclop 85/1.5 (Helios-40 innards) - Komura 80mm f/1.8 - Meyer Görlitz Primoplan 7,5cm 1:1.9 - Carl Zeiss Jena 80mm f/1.8 Pancolar - Canon 85mm f/1.8 S.S.C. - Canon 85mm f/1.2 S.S.C. Aspherical |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3705 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
You made me doubt my impressions (it's hard to distinguish just by looking) so i put something of straight shape on rear element and it is concave. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 4:30 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
Is it not reasonable to think these two might share some heritage?
Chinon Tomioka on left and Pentor on right.[/img] _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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Spotmatic
Joined: 18 Aug 2008 Posts: 4045 Location: Netherlands
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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Spotmatic wrote:
Interestingly my Pentor uses another font for the engravings... Note the number 6.
_________________ Peter - Moderator
Pentax K-5 + Pentax 645 + Canon 5D + Bessa RF 10,5cm Heliar, and a 'little' bag full of MF lenses. The lens list is * here *.
My fast 80s: Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 83mm f/1.9 - Super-Takumar 85mm f/1.9 - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - Cyclop 85/1.5 (Helios-40 innards) - Komura 80mm f/1.8 - Meyer Görlitz Primoplan 7,5cm 1:1.9 - Carl Zeiss Jena 80mm f/1.8 Pancolar - Canon 85mm f/1.8 S.S.C. - Canon 85mm f/1.2 S.S.C. Aspherical |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
Peter: I would guess the assembler of the lenses has parts made from multiple vendors and they mix them or just move to a new supply when depleting old supply. My lens is 139 units earlier in production.
I see that your images posted in the oversized gallery are indeed from FF. I wonder if that has something to do with the 3D-ish appearance. If you don't mind, I had asked in post 4th from the top of page 2 if you have any opinions of this Pentor when compared to the Meyer lenses you have. _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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ManualFocus-G
Joined: 29 Dec 2008 Posts: 6622 Location: United Kingdom
Expire: 2014-11-24
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:12 pm Post subject: |
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ManualFocus-G wrote:
Just to confuse matters, there was also a Tokina made 100/2.8 which was sort of similar, and branded with all sorts of names.
_________________ Graham - Moderator
Shooter of choice: Fujifilm X-T20 with M42, PB and C/Y lenses
See my Flickr photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/manualfocus-g |
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dimitrygo
Joined: 01 Apr 2009 Posts: 561
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:41 pm Post subject: |
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dimitrygo wrote:
ManualFocus-G wrote: |
Just to confuse matters, there was also a Tokina made 100/2.8 which was sort of similar, and branded with all sorts of names.
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Yes there are also Tokina made 100/2.8 lenses but this Hanimex looks exactly like Porst and Pentor above. |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 6:56 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
Graham: What leads you to believe that is Tokina made? _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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ManualFocus-G
Joined: 29 Dec 2008 Posts: 6622 Location: United Kingdom
Expire: 2014-11-24
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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ManualFocus-G wrote:
woodrim wrote: |
Graham: What leads you to believe that is Tokina made? |
I can't remember Maybe it is a Tomioka _________________ Graham - Moderator
Shooter of choice: Fujifilm X-T20 with M42, PB and C/Y lenses
See my Flickr photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/manualfocus-g |
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Spotmatic
Joined: 18 Aug 2008 Posts: 4045 Location: Netherlands
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 8:03 pm Post subject: |
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Spotmatic wrote:
woodrim wrote: |
I see that your images posted in the oversized gallery are indeed from FF. I wonder if that has something to do with the 3D-ish appearance. If you don't mind, I had asked in post 4th from the top of page 2 if you have any opinions of this Pentor when compared to the Meyer lenses you have. |
In the coming days I'll try to organize a little shoot-out. I think the differences are small, although the Trioplan is certainly on another level _________________ Peter - Moderator
Pentax K-5 + Pentax 645 + Canon 5D + Bessa RF 10,5cm Heliar, and a 'little' bag full of MF lenses. The lens list is * here *.
My fast 80s: Asahi-Kogaku Takumar 83mm f/1.9 - Super-Takumar 85mm f/1.9 - FA 77mm f/1.8 Limited - Cyclop 85/1.5 (Helios-40 innards) - Komura 80mm f/1.8 - Meyer Görlitz Primoplan 7,5cm 1:1.9 - Carl Zeiss Jena 80mm f/1.8 Pancolar - Canon 85mm f/1.8 S.S.C. - Canon 85mm f/1.2 S.S.C. Aspherical |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3705 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Fri Jul 22, 2011 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
ManualFocus-G wrote: |
woodrim wrote: |
Graham: What leads you to believe that is Tokina made? |
I can't remember Maybe it is a Tomioka |
Did you see the sample that is actually labeled Tomioka? Little space for confusion left here i think.
What about this one? Could it be our friend in metal dress: http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=16881
Concave rear would give good argument. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:08 am Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
Pancolart wrote: |
ManualFocus-G wrote: |
woodrim wrote: |
Graham: What leads you to believe that is Tokina made? |
I can't remember Maybe it is a Tomioka |
Did you see the sample that is actually labeled Tomioka? Little space for confusion left here i think.
What about this one? Could it be our friend in metal dress: http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=16881
Concave rear would give good argument. |
I don't see anything compelling with that one to say it's like the Chinon or Pentor. I couldn't make out the type of aperture blades.
Dimitry seemed to think the Pentor is not Tomioka, I think mainly because of the direction of the focus ring, but I'm still trying to get a handle on what shared characteristics are reasonable to come to a conclusion and what are disqualifiers. This is a curiosity mostly for me; I'm going to like the lens or not regardless of who made it. _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 12:13 am Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
Spotmatic wrote: |
woodrim wrote: |
I see that your images posted in the oversized gallery are indeed from FF. I wonder if that has something to do with the 3D-ish appearance. If you don't mind, I had asked in post 4th from the top of page 2 if you have any opinions of this Pentor when compared to the Meyer lenses you have. |
In the coming days I'll try to organize a little shoot-out. I think the differences are small, although the Trioplan is certainly on another level |
Thanks, Peter, but I wasn't asking you to go to great trouble. I would be happy hearing your opinion. Trioplan definitely will have a different bokeh, but as sharp? Trioplan is one of relatively few lenses that can be singled out easily. WHile I don't have any other 100mm lenses (although had considered a Vivitar), I have two 105 that I can include in some comparisons with this Pentor. _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3705 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 9:17 am Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
It would be nice to separate a collection co-created by Tomioka and among them find those lenses that excel. 1.4/55mm design and 2.8/100mm design is really good. 2.8/135mm and 3.5/200mm are nothing more then average i think, though i am in love with that bluish-yellow glass and leather grip. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3705 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jul 23, 2011 10:22 am Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
dimitrygo wrote: |
ManualFocus-G wrote: |
Just to confuse matters, there was also a Tokina made 100/2.8 which was sort of similar, and branded with all sorts of names.
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Yes there are also Tokina made 100/2.8 lenses but this Hanimex looks exactly like Porst and Pentor above. |
I've checked my Vivitar 2.8/100mm - the same model as Newton's here: http://forum.mflenses.com/vivitar-100mm-f2-8-t10912.html
This would be the only Tokina contender i guess. But it's entirely different since rear element much more inside lens body. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Mon Oct 10, 2011 2:42 pm Post subject: Pentor 100mm - Tomioka |
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woodrim wrote:
I have received my Pentor 100mm lens, which is identical to Peter's (discussed in this thread). I had been quite impressed with the results Peter shared with us in another thread, and in particular what I perceived to be a significant 3-D effect. In fact, I had posted about Peter's images in one of the 3-D threads, but that posting seems to have disappeared; I know not why. Anyway, I wondered if I would receive the same effect with my APS-C sensor that Peter did with his full frame. After my first outing on the past weekend, I'm not at all disappointed. This is truly a wonderful lens and if it wasn't made by Tomioka, I'd like to know who did make it.
The build quality is okay, but nothing great. My only real complaint is that the auto-manual switch is so close to the aperture ring that I frequently pushed it into auto while changing aperture. It focused faily easily and I could even see some of the 3-D in the viewfinder. Results are wonderful. I took several shots wide open for evaluation; they are surprisingly sharp - I'd even go as far as to say it has the best wide open performance of any of my lenses when everything is considered; sharpness, contrast, lack of CA, and pop. Sure, I have other very good wide open performers, but none that handle CA as well. Here are first results after a walkabout through downtown Charleston... and I have posted more here in the Best of Lenses Gallery http://forum.mflenses.com/pentor-2-8-100mm-t43494.html
Do you see 3-D? I do.
Tight crop.
_________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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