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8x12 (inch) or legal size photo paper?
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PostPosted: Fri Nov 15, 2013 7:05 pm    Post subject: 8x12 (inch) or legal size photo paper? Reply with quote
Folks,

I'm finally getting around to printing out a lot of my images. I'm using an older, but very good, Epson Stylus Photo R300 printer for the tasks -- this is one of the printers that uses the six cartridges. Unfortunately it is a narrow format printer, and the largest width it can handle is 8.5 inches.

A lot of my images are really cramped with the standard letter proportions. Often when I compose an image, I'm using the entire frame and am not thinking about an 8x10 -- or even a 11x14 -- crop. Too bad this R300 couldn't handle 11" because then I could print out 11x17's, which is almost the same proportion as 8x12.

So anyway, I went onto US eBay to see if anybody is selling 8x12 glossy photo paper and got zero hits. I searched online and had a bit more luck. B&H carries it, for example. But then it occurred to me that I could use legal size photo paper and just trim it down. I have a flatbed-style paper cutter so trimming the paper is no big deal.

So anyway, I guess I'm just curious about how you guys handle this sort of thing. What are your preferences regarding photo paper and printing to it?


PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 1:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Letter is 8.5" x 11" A4 is 8.27" × 11.69" more rectangular. Use A4


PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 1:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I always use A4 as well.


PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 4:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Well, A4 is metric, therefore common in the UK and Europe. Letter is what you get when you go into any store that sells paper here in the US. But just for the heck of it, I logged onto eBay and did a search. Wow. I can buy 100 sheets of A4 glossy photo paper for cheap. I reckon I'll have to give it a try next time I order paper.

So A4 is 210mm x 297mm? Why 297? Why not 300? (11.69 x 25.4 = 296.926)

I agree, though. 210 x ~300 is closer to the 2:3 proportion of the standard 35mm film format, or FF and APS-C sensors. So you guys have less of a problem than we do with our silly 8.5x11 format.

I printed out a bunch of images yesterday. Even exhausted one of my printer's ink cartridges. What I started doing was just sizing and cropping the images to 8x10 on the 8.5x11 page, whenever possible. I have a paper cutter so I can trim them. But as I mentioned, I have a lot of images that won't fit well in an 8x10 format. I need the 2:3 proportion. I'm thinking that it will probably be easier just to buy legal size (8.5x14) and crop the images to an 8x12 before printing, rather than having to mess with ordering 8x12. I should be able to find 8.5x14 photo paper locally -- I hope.


PostPosted: Sun Nov 17, 2013 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:


So A4 is 210mm x 297mm? Why 297? Why not 300? (11.69 x 25.4 = 296.926)

.


A-series paper have a specially computed format, if you were to cut an A4 paper in half it would be A5 and precisely the same format ratio, same if you doubled it up, 2x A4's together will make an A3 exactly and so on.

Interestingly A10 - the smallest is 37x26mm or 1.5 x1 inch. Almost exctly the same format as a standard 35mm frame.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 1:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paper_size#A_series
So, it's as mundane as fiddling with the sizes of 1sq m to give a starting point.
Pity - I wondered if it might harken back to something long gone.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I see all the 8x12" papers have gone from marketplace! Shocked Epson used to carry that size...

Even though I have 13" wide EPSON Stylus Photo 1400 Series, after all my hemming & hawing I decided printing 7x10.5" images on 8.5x11" paper was best for me -- images are big enough for me; the border looks nice; for that size paper there is a wide range of frames & storage, etc..

The real tip here is to use CIS continuous Ink Systems -- the savings on ink is substantial!


PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wow, very interesting. I was about to respond to your "continous ink" solution and state that this sort of thing is only practical for people who do a lot of printing because of its high initial cost. But that isn't the case here is it?

After checking things out there, I've determined that, for the cost of a set of six Epson cartridges, I can buy one of those continuous ink sets for my Epson R300 and a set of six 600ml size refills. Actually, it will cost $2 less than the Epson cartridges. I think I'm gonna order a set.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 10, 2014 7:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have had experience of these 'tanks' of ink and you can have big problems. You may have to modify your printer somewhat. The large continuous inks are 3rd party.

I buy 3rd party inks for my Epson. On ebay there is a supplier who will sell you 5 sets of 6 inks for your printer for £10 Click here to see on Ebay
there's bound to be someone in the States offering a similar deal.


Of course for archive purposes I have mine printed at a lab.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 12, 2014 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yeah, we don't have the same deal here on US eBay -- it would be about $15 for the three sets if we did. We do have one seller who is offering four sets -- 24 cartridges -- for $24, which isn't bad. Most of the sellers of 3rd party ink are selling them by the piece, 3-something each.

After considering all the options, and given that I've already had some success refilling my Epson R300's cartridges, I think that just buying some bulk ink will be the best way for me to go. I already have black, yellow, cyan, and magenta, but I don't have light cyan and light magenta. I can buy a set of six 100ml bottles for $17. If my past luck with printers is any indication, the printer will probably break down before I run out of ink.


PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
So A4 is 210mm x 297mm? Why 297? Why not 300? (11.69 x 25.4 = 296.926)


Apart from the useful response you already got, this may amuse you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHeo62B0d0E


PostPosted: Mon Jan 13, 2014 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
dickb wrote:
cooltouch wrote:
So A4 is 210mm x 297mm? Why 297? Why not 300? (11.69 x 25.4 = 296.926)


Apart from the useful response you already got, this may amuse you.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mHeo62B0d0E


Yes, you're correct. I found it not only amusing, but informative. Knowing how the metric system of measurement for distance works, I guess I should have guessed that A4 was some variant of the measure of a meter.

To me, the most memorable quote of that video was "Someone has really pulled that out of their assumption." He said this without a pause. Cool

He also stated that with US paper size, "you only get the ones that are handed down." The "handed down" business came from King who? George, was it? Not an American, then, was he -- so why does this guy insist on referring to "US paper size," since we're using a system of measurement invented by the Brits? Oh, okay, you don't use it anymore -- except on "Top Gear" I suppose. Anyway, I mention this comment because it isn't entirely true. The US system of "paper size" measurements is a good deal more arbitrary than what he mentions -- and in an odd sort of way, that's what lends a bit of superiority to the way we do things non-metrically. Apparently since nobody here in the States wants to have to deal with decimal numbers (except the .5 in 8.5, I remind myself), which would happen if we tried using the most logical proportion -- namely the Golden Mean, which is the irrational number 1.6180339... based on the Fibonacci Sequence -- American size arbiters have decided to stick to whole numbers. But as a result there are many different arbitrary sizes. Sizes that the presenter in the video doesn't mention -- probably because he didn't feel like becoming overwhelmed.

So not only do we have the 8.5x11 and 11x17 (he doesn't mention that the 17 comes from doubling the 8.5), and 8.5x14, as well as the "baby legal" of 8x5 -- a size I've never heard of -- but we have paper sizes that are based on photo enlargements: 4x6 for what has become the standard print size (not all that many years ago, 4x6 was the "Super Size" and cost more than the 3.5x5 or whatever it was), which has the advantage of showing the whole frame of a negative, or the whole sensor area of an APS-C or FF sensor. Extrapolating this 4x6 number, we get 8x12, the first "useful" enlargement size, then 16x24. Surely there are metric equivalents? But I guess they are no longer based on A4? But we also have 16x20 (extrapolation of 4x5 and thus 8x10) and we have 20x24 (extrapolation of 5x6, which is basically nothing, just a convenient large size found in art stores with stretched canvases for painting) and 22x28 (extrapolation of 11x17), 12x16 and 24x32 (extrapolations of 3x4) and others, in just about every combination of inches you can think of. But most of these non-letter based sizes are confined to the canvas bins at the art supply stores, although some of them are available sizes for poster prints. And I tell myself that this same condition probably exists in European art stores, except all the canvases are measured in centimeters, which gives y'all a finer control of ratios, simply because the cm is smaller than the inch.

He also discusses aspect ratio, which dovetails into the above paragraph. With the metric system, all the paper sizes he mentions have the same aspect ratio. I suppose if one deliberately wanted to violate the aspect ratio, then the A-system will have, I presume, agreed upon size variations. But with the US system, since the sizes are pretty much arbitrary to begin with, we have to remember the specific sizes, not just some formula that will tell us what it is. And, as he mentioned, each of the US sizes has as aspect ratio. Which also means we have many different aspect ratios already prepackaged in, as the above sizes illustrate.

Well, I guess I've done that one to death.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 26, 2014 2:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
You can buy A4 paper at staples but they usually don't have it in stock and you gotta order it.

International sized paper is superior to the US sizes although it might seem strange to us. Each size to the next available size can be easily enlarged or reduced without white borders.
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