Question about average 28mm lenses

[jito]

I looked into manual focus lenses because I wanted to be able to take a bit better pictures without going bankrupt. I started by a zuiko 50mm and a jupiter 37a. I was very happy with the results so I continued bargain hunting and bought a few more lenses.
Even an old vivitar 85-205 zoom (not a series 1) is able to deliver solid results.

All was going fine until I needed a bit wider angle lenses than my mir1. I ordered two 28mm f2.8 from ebay. A yashica ML and a tokina, I didn't have very high expectations on the tokina but I was expecting much more from the yashica.

I haven't thoroughly tested their color rendition and contrast, but after using them quite a bit for family portraits I can't get tak sharp images. Both have similar resolution, somewhere in between my kit lens and my sharp mflenses. Not particularly bad, but on the border to not be worth to bother.

I've noticed that almost every 135mm lens is capable of very good results. The same appears to apply to 50mm lenses to some extent. My question is: is similar quality more difficult to achieve on 28mm lenses?

Or, in other words, is the average 28mm inferior than, say, the average 50mm?

[iangreenhalgh1]

Yes, in short.

However, the two you had should both be good ones, the Tokina is definitely sharp, the Yashica ML too, so I suspect you might have got unlucky and got bad copies, the Yashicas certainly are known to have some lemons, I think QC wasn't their strong point.

[Arninetyes]

My understanding is that yes, it is easier to make an excellent quality lens for an SLR if the focal length ranges from normal to short telephoto. I don't think anyone makes a bad 50mm or 85mm, but there are some dreadful wide angle lenses, and lots of terrible long telephotos.

Also, a brand name doesn't guarantee a good 28mm. You need to know the model. For example: a Nikkor 28/2.8 Ai is an unimpressive lens that is soft and doesn't do anything particularly well. It's replacement, the 28/2.8 Ais, is regarded as one of the best 28s around. There are plenty of people on this forum who can fill you in on which 28s might suit your needs, ranging from spare-no-expense (Zeiss, Leica, etc), to bargains that perform very nearly as well as the best.

Speaking of bargains, don't count Tokina out. My experience with Tokina lenses is that the better ones are very, very good--you just have to know the correct model before you buy.

There is one other factor as well: condition of the lens. I've had used wide-angle lenses that had enough haze and dust to prevent getting sharp images. Check that there is little haze and dust, as well as no fungus, in your lens.

[Excalibur]

There are plenty of cheap (well when I bought them) good 28mm lenses if used stopped down (well on a film camera):-

I can recommended, from my copies, these lenses stopped down...may be good wide open but I've never tested them:-
FD& FDn Canon 28mm
Vivitar 28mm close focus
CZJ east German 28mm
Hexanon 28mm
Tamron 28mm

For a gamble and if bought for peanuts..my Makinon and Sigma are good others say they are crap.
Makinon 28mm
Yashica DSB 28mm
Sigma mini wide II 28mm


My 28mm lenses that are poor are:-
Osawa
Hanimex

[luisalegria]

Super Takumar 28/3.5
Not the cheapest but good results are certain.
You can still get them on US ebay for $50 or a bit more.

[luisalegria]

Also the original Sigma Mini-wide is not bad at all.

[Arninetyes]

Hmm. I made an overly windy reply without giving recommendations, so here are the ones I've used:

Nikkor 28/3.5 Ai
Asahi Super Takumar 28/3.5
Nikkor 28/2.8 Ais
Nikkor 28/2 Ai (my favorite)

NOT recommended:
Nikkor 28/2.8 Ai
Nikon Series E 28/2.8 (same optics as the Ai, cheaper package)

[Andrew G.]

[fermy]

In short what Ian said, although I would put accents differently.

The usefulness of 50mm lenses that you can buy cheaply is far greater than the usefulness of cheap 28mm lenses. Cheap 28mm means f2.8 and slower. Most kit zooms are F3.5-F4 at 28mm and close to their optimum performance. So you gain 1 stop maximum by going manual. With 50mm lenses you can get even f1.4 on the cheap if you are lucky and gain 3.5-4 stops. That's a huge difference.

That being said, there is a number of good 28mm lenses and a number of crap ones. In general 1st tier brands, such as Canon, Nikon, Minolta, Konica, Pentax, Olympus are from good to excellent and 2nd tier brands such as Vivitar, Hoya, Tokina could be good and could be crap.

I have a number of 28mm/f2.8 on sale on dpreview
http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1056&message=39915755 The prices do reflect what I think about the lens.


Soligor - crap
Cosina - decent, but nothing special
Hoya HMC 28/f2.8 Wide-Auto - decent and interesting character
Vivitar (Komine) Auto Wide-Angle - very good
Canon FD and Minolta MD - excellent.

Canon FD is my favorite. Keep in mind though, that performance varies from copy to copy, so I wouldn't be surprised if someone claims that Canon is crap and his Soligor is the best lens he ever owned.

[luisalegria]

Other advantages to cheap 28mm manual lenses over kit lenses -

- focus control, which can be pretty random in many cases with AF, and most AF kit lenses are very hard to focus manually.
- zone focusing - hard to do with AF kit lens - this is the fastest "street photography" method.

[Aanything]

My mamiya sekor sx 28/2.8 (found at a flea market, no expectations on it) is a good lens, so much that it soon became my standard walk-around lens (on aps-c).

[fermy]

[iangreenhalgh1]

[jito]

Thank you all for the feedback.

I think I got so-so copies. I wouldn't call them lime copies, but definitely they are incapable of delivering solid results. I guess for some people they are fine. Still better than my kit lens.

From the diversity of suggestions I take it that affordable 28mm are a gamble, far from a safe bet.

I think I may grab an om zuiko 28mm one of these days, but for the moment I'm a bit off-put.

How does the zuiko compares to a nikkor (assuming I pick the right model), which one is more likely to be a safe bet?

[stingOM]

[iangreenhalgh1]

I can highly recommend the Pentacon 2.8/28 in PB mount, it is so cheap but really excellent. It can be used on EOS but needs a small adjustment for infinity.

[Arninetyes]

[heartcat]

My RMC Tokina 28mm 2.8 in M42 mount is an excellent lens, perhaps my favourite! Sharp from wide open, close focusing, good contrast, and beautiful, natural colour straight out of the camera. Photos need little processing.

Perhaps you did get a bum copy.

[GrahamNR17]

[iangreenhalgh1]

[Lloydy]

I've had very good results from the Pentacon 30 3.5, it does colours superbly. But my recommendation would be the Vivitar 28 2.8 Close Focus from Komine ( serial numbers 28------- ) There are many versions of the Vivitar 28, some way better than others, have a look at the THE GREAT VIVITAR 28MM BESTIARY - http://photografica.robinparmar.com/vivitar.html - it's interesting reading. Don't discount the Vivitar, it's my auto pilot lens out of 8 lenses in that range.

[ForenSeil]

I had M42 Pentacon 30/3.5 and M42 Tokina RMC 28/2.8 which were both usable an cheap.

Here are some sample pics with the Pentacon 30/3.5 made by me (mostly under very bad light conditions though) http://forum.mflenses.com/little-test-of-m42-pentacon-30mm-f3-5-on-nex-t46882,highlight,%2Bpentacon.html
It has good natural colors and is also fairly sharp and fairly contrasty wide open
The Tokina RMC 28/2.8 is also good but I never made a direct comparision to the Pentacon

The Pentacon 29/2.8 plays in the same league (but is a little softer wide open as far as I know).

In the meanwhile I got an (expensive) Carl Zeiss Biogon T* 28/2.8 and now they are all looking like crap for me
(The Biogon is somewhat better in all attributes and also rules out even most modern lenses)

EDIT
I also had a M42 Revue ~30/2.8 Macro (a plastic casing lens made by Enna München and not a real macro - only good close up function) which good (at least sharp in center but it had a little low contrast) and a M42 Auto Revuenon 35/2.8 which was crap (maybe a bad copy though).

[Pancolart]

+1 for Prakticar.

[Ivoverboon]

I have the Vivitar 2.8/28 MC wide angle. It comes from Komine. It is cheap and fantastic.
greetz.....Ivo

[Arkku]