Sony NEX-F3

[fotomachi]

Some rumours about the upcomming NEX-F3:

sonyalphanex blog
sonyalpharumours

[Nesster]

Looks like the Volks-NEX - "Accessory terminal: you can add the trufinder or the microphone" is good news.

[Orio]

Why all people want to buy EVIL cameras, if everyone considers the viewfinder an almost indispensable accessory?
(which raises the cost significantly, by the way)
When there are entry level DSLR with the same number of MP and a proper optical viewfinder, and also liveview, everything included in the base price?

[fotomachi]

[kuuan]

[LucisPictor]

[patrickh]

Fotomachi and Carsten hit the nail. I was almost grateful when my Canon 40D broke, because I now have so many more lenses to choose from (including the Hexanons I have wanted to try). It also happens to be a superior sensor (not just more pixels).


patrickh

[Orio]

[DigiChromeEd]

I personally don't consider it an indispensable accessory. Focus peaking is really great.
But the most important: the NEX takes about every lens you can imagine, also RF-lenses. It put a 50mm lens on it and it fits in my pocket. No DSLR fits in there...

People shouldn't bother about whether they should buy a DSLR or an EVIL... Both systems are IMHO complementary and not in competition against each other.[/quote]

+1

[Orio]

[Himself]

Too tiny, no solid grip on it, I`d need a 3rd hand in order to handle the camera and focus the lens ( Fukushima here I come).
For a few years I use only EF and Contax/Yashica mounts.

[Attila]

[56 DIN]

both systems have their special advantages ( here i don´t count the muuuuuch higher AF speed of good DSLR´s, but for some applications it is still the k.o. point on all this evil toys )
through a viewfinder you can better compose your picture if it has to go fast, in "darkness" or in bright sunlight
the tilt possibility ( i had it in my Canon G 5 and missed it since then till getting a NEX ) is an unbelievable advantage to get uncommon perspectives without making your clothes dirty or using a ladder, the possibility to use much more lenses has been mentioned already
and the overall size using compact lenses like CVs, etc are on the other hand unbeatable arguments for the evils
i think evils are the better narrative cams and DSLRs the better challenging ones

[Orio]

All recent DSLRs have tilting LCDs, it's a draw, not a point for EVILs.

[Lloydy]

I was with a guy today who had a top of the Nikon, a very good and talented photographer. But he'd never handled a NEX to use before, and he said all the things I said, much of which is repeated here - "I want a proper viewfinder" - "It's too small with a big lens" - I don't need focus peaking"
I think he might buy one now he's actually tried one.

[iangreenhalgh1]

DSLRs tend to have awful viewfinders as far as focussing manually goes. Ever since I got a NEX I have had no interest in a DSLR at all.

Also, can't put Hexanons or Russian RF lenses on a DSLR and those are by far the best bang for your buck you can find.

[Aanything]

I have had a tilting LCD dslr (sony a 350) before nex even came out.
The main Advantage of nexes, as stated above, is the possibility to mount every piece of glass ever made (and that's one of the reasons why I ordered a 5-n), with the lack of a proper built-in viewfinder and some features (image stabilization, fps, more effective AF system) being the most evident downs.

The size and ergonomy issue is very subjective, although someone used to handling an slr will easily feel better with a dslr in hands, and many medium range dslr nowadays aren't "that" bigger of a nex with a lens and a viewfinder mounted (I mean, they are bigger, but you can't stick a nex+lens in the pocket of your trousers).

[kuuan]

[LucisPictor]

This quick snap shows the difference between one of the smallest DSLRs and one of the biggest EVIL-cams:


You can see that NEX-7 is about as wide as the Pentax K100D, but the Pentax is much deeper.
Don't look at the lenses. There is a hood on the Sigma 30 which makes it much larger and the lens on the Pentac is a Tamron 2.5/28. The kit-lens is bigger.
That means that you could put the NEX-7 into your coat pocket but not the K100D.
And the NEX-7 is considerable bigger than the NEX-3 (or the NEX-5N if you like).

So, there IS a size difference.

But as I said, for me the most important factor is the chance to use almost any lens on my NEX.

[Orio]

I admit that I still fail to see the "size" point. Do we have to go everyday in a spaceship where every centimeter of space matters?
Is there someone to verify that your camera is less than 3 cms deep otherwise you can not take photos?
No, so where's the problem? You need a bag anyway to carry the camera and lenses (isn't using many lenses the point)?
So what difference does it make a few cms thickness more, once the camera is inside the bag, or at your neck?

I would split the issue between the need of a GAS afflicted photographer, and the normal photographer.

The GAS afflicted photographer indeed enjoys testing the widest availability of lenses. This is a strong point in favour of the EVIL cameras.
However, EVIL cameras so far can only offer crop sensors. A serious lens tester can not ignore that a test conducted on a crop factor camera tells only a partial truth
about a lens, and sometimes, it may be even misleading. Most of the difference between lenses, in fact, happens at the edges of the image circle, which is where
the most obnoxious optical problems do show up. So yes, you can test more lenses on an EVIL camera, but you still can test lenses more thoroughly on a full frame camera.
So until the EVIL cameras go full frame, this limitation exists.

THen there is the need of the normal photographer. Let's say I'm going out to photograph a sports match, or to birdwatch. I need a powerful tele lens.
The crop factor of the EVIL camera helps me, but so does the crop factor of DSLRs. What about the use then. Am I comfortable attaching a long tele to an EVIL camera and focusing it?
I can not hold a tiny camera plus big lens holding the ensemble by the tiny camera. So this means I have to hold it by the lens.
And given that I need another hand to focus the lens, how do I press the shutter? Nose?
What if I end up in a position where I have the sun on my back, is it feasible that I cover myself with a black cloth like 19th century photographers? Or do I have to buy an expensive digital viewfinder?
(which by the way will not likely give me the same comfort and natural vision of an optical viewfinder)
What if I go photograph a wedding, can I really mount a professional flash on the evil camera? Either I don't have the flash shoe on the camera (which means shooting with a remote
in one hand and the camera in the other, and the third hand focusing the lens - or using autofocus, in which case no more using old lenses)
or I do have the flash shoe, but then I have the large flash mounted on tiny camera, with again all the balance issues...

In my opinion, EVILs are basically amateur cameras, that happen to be interesting also to GAS photographers because of the possibility of testing many lenses.
Tasks where photography is more important than testing, like those that I described, do really stress EVIL cameras useability to a limit.
While DSLRs can be either amateur cameras or professional cameras, so are more flexible. You can test less lenses on them,
but if there is a photographer's task that you have to complete, instead of playing with lenses, DSLR is still the camera that delivers.

[Attila]

Both can deliver Orio, matter is subject , photographer , rather than tool

[nemesis101]

Not quite accurate, I use all my Hexanons on my Panasonic L-1 which is a DSLR?

I can also use some rangefinders lenses too..

It's dangerous to make generalizations and both systems have their pros and cons. I am lucky to have a selection of EVIL cameras and DSLR units. I would never use anything other than an EOS 1D? or Nixon D?X series for my political campaign coverage as defending yourself from rampaging riot police or frenzied demonstrators using a NEX or an Olympus OM-D just would not work

For inconspicuous street photography an EVIL camera with a shallow w/a lens is wonderful whereas the big guns would attract unwelcome attention..

Doug

[kuuan]

[Orio]

Guys, I certainly won't argue with you anymore, especially because I am one alone against maybe 20

I still wonder how I would make a fashion/glamour session for 2-3 hours by watching into a LCD holding the camera with both arms extended using a tele lens without ever shaking or getting muscle cramps
Photographing with a normal sized camera and optical pentaprism viewfinder offers me a well balanced tool and the possibility of stabilizing both my camera arm and my lens arm onto my body - and with the battery grip I can photograph in portrait orientation without having to put my arm in awkward position.

[fotomachi]