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Leica mount Sigma sd 14
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PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2008 11:12 pm    Post subject: Leica mount Sigma sd 14 Reply with quote
Interesting business model. If this guy is honest and it looks like he is . I wish him very well. Maybe he can expand to other cameras and mounts. Looks pretty cool either way.


Click here to see on Ebay


PostPosted: Thu May 29, 2008 11:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This guy sell seperate mount too. Nice find!


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
very interesting, thanks for sharing!
If he markets a Sigma with Contax mount for the same price, I might give it a thought for Christmas!


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 12:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Oooooh! nice idea Cool


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 12:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
F16SUNSHINE wrote:
Oooooh! nice idea Cool


Let's talk him into it then Wink


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 1:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I sent him the question. Just for at the least fun to hear why yes or no Cool


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 2:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
WOW Shocked fast response. Here is the mail I just received.


Quote:
Dear f16sunshyn,

Andy it looks very feasible , but although I did purchase a C/Y lens to study the mount architecture I
have not yet started on a Prototype.

My Biz plan is driven by a Poll I did at Dpreview and I have been manufacturing the mounts in the
order that reflects the interest shown .The Contax C/Y was almost the one with the least number of
people interested on it , followed only by the Canon FD.

It is possible that this is motivated by the difficulties associated with those mounts and general skepticism about its feasibility . I believe that once I have a working prototype the interest might
snowball.

The mount that has the most intense calling is the Canon EOS to SD14 !! and that escapes me.

Thanks for your comments and feel free to email me directly at luis@sigmacumlaude.com so I can ad
you to my Contax mail group list.



- virtualcameraboutique


I love the fact that EOS being the most requested is confounding. I also don't get it. Maybe people think that then they can adapt more different mounts (buy a canon). Or maybe it is all the ELLE-HEADS thinking they can use the redstripe lenses from Canon. Interesting anyways. This whole replacing mounts is something new to me anyway.


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 2:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think that there is many people who own a Canon camera and would like to try the Foveon sensor and this explains the rather silly thing.

He should not weight the consensus for Contax mount on a mainstream forum like DPReview.

I think that between the communities that use manual focus lenses, the consensus for a Contax solution would be quite large.


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio I agree with this thought. I wrote to him in my reply similarly and directed him to our forum. This could be an interesting new trend if it catches on. Hopefully the big dogs are watching. Those rat F-ers. I'm glad I did not just say that although I wish I did.


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 6:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
great find sunshine
I want also a body with c/y mount
not that I am not happy with the quality of canon
but I am sometimes jealous of in body anti-shake of pentax and Co
so if somebody found a y/c custom mount for pentax, show me where


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 6:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
How about the M39 mount? Could it work?


patrickh


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 10:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
I think that there is many people who own a Canon camera and would like to try the Foveon sensor and this explains the rather silly thing.

He should not weight the consensus for Contax mount on a mainstream forum like DPReview.


Very true. I did a rough count at my Camera club (174 paid up members this year)
Canon DSLR users outnumber all. BUT. I only know one who uses any MF lenses or lenses other than Canon AF.
With the Nikon DSLR users (Second most popular) about 1/3 of them use a MF lens or two and a good number of them use other makes with Tamron Adaptall being the most popular. This is even more strange (Perhaps) when you consider most of these users can't meter with a manual lens, they use a hand held meter or just guess with the help of the histogram.
I should add that few of the DSLR users have any real interest in MF lenses. The Nikon users usually have a couple of old Nikon lenses they like and the Tamrons are popular for the price performance ratio.
The most popular MF lenses are fish eye, long telephoto, and lens baby, in that order.
Perhaps a pointless observation but of my regular shooting buddies only 3 of them are Canon DSLR users, 1 a Minolta 7D user, I Fuji DSLR user and 10 + Nikon users?
I‘m not sure this tells us anything but it doesn’t seem to reflect the average?
Perhaps one thing that may upset my figures is that Swindon does have a 'Canon users' Camera club.
Rather a stupid idea IMO. I mean what difference does it make what camara you use. perhaps a bit strong but I do think they are a bit of a joke and I imagine they sit about discussing cameras rather than doing any photography!

PS I havn't had a chance to try a Sigma SD 14. I would love to know how it compares in real world use to my own Canon G5, the new Canon G9 and the Ricoh models all shooting RAW.
The reason I can't try one is the 3 camera shops in Swindon (Not including Jessops) are not stocking it and have no plans to do so?


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 11:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
poilu wrote:
great find sunshine
I want also a body with c/y mount
not that I am not happy with the quality of canon
but I am sometimes jealous of in body anti-shake of pentax and Co
so if somebody found a y/c custom mount for pentax, show me where


You might buy a Pentax and use this solution:
http://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/pentax-slr-lens-discussion/23284-zuiko-olympus-om-lenses-pentax.html
(scroll down)
To be more safe you could also buy a broken AF Pentax body with identical bayonet and change that to a Contax one and then replace the bayonet on the Pentax dSLR . This way the process is reversable.


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
thanks Cosmin
I already read this post but I think the lens are not secured.
I prefer to find some solution with a lever who lock the lens
Did you remember the bad story of Orio with his contax 135:2


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 2:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is interesting however the Camera has some pretty iffy reviews. The image quality is very good however no matter what Sigma says, the end result is a 4mp file, not a 14mp file. Also, I have a friend that had one and sent it back due to the difficulty in navigating the menus. Personally, I would rather get an adapter for the Leica lenses and use them on something else.

All that work for a 4mp image seems a bit much IMO.

Jules


PostPosted: Fri May 30, 2008 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
lulalake wrote:
This is interesting however the Camera has some pretty iffy reviews. The image quality is very good however no matter what Sigma says, the end result is a 4mp file, not a 14mp file. Also, I have a friend that had one and sent it back due to the difficulty in navigating the menus. Personally, I would rather get an adapter for the Leica lenses and use them on something else.

All that work for a 4mp image seems a bit much IMO.

Jules


I think this is fair comment. my friend is a big Ricoh fan he has the GRD, the GX100 and now the new GRD II, he is also a Canon 5D user. I use a Canon G5 regularly. With the PS we of course only shoot RAW.
The point is we are both very happy in fact often amazed at the results the PS produce. We have tested the new Canon G9 and find it hardly any better than the old G5 and G3 and certainly not worth 'Upgrading' too. the loss of real features would make it a stupid deal.
We would both like to try the Sigma but have not seen any good examples from it or heard any great reports. One trusted dealer has told us it is **** and he won't ever being stocking it and the results he showed us confirm his opinion. I would still like to try one just to see.
I do think it was brave of Sigma to make the camera but can't help wishing they would have made a better job of it. I would like to see Olympus make a decent PS using the 4/3 sensor,
A good APS sized sensor camera from another manufacturer may have pushed them into doing this? I don't think the Sigma is going to push any other manufacturer to give it go, in fact I believe they may have done more harm than good?
IMO it isn't a big leap or rocket science to put the 4/3 sensor into a neat little body with a big life sized bright line finder and the decent Olmpus 14-whatever lens. I mean how much would such a camera cost? But will they even consider it when they review the sales of the Sigma?
Perhaps the only thing we may be able to look forward to is being able to buy the Sigma for around £150 next year!


PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 1:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think you are referring mostly to the Sigma DP1 in your thoughts. The topic of this thread is a mount modified Sigma SD14 DSLR. I have seen some very remarkable work come from the SD14. Lumping it with a fledgling P+S entry is not really very realistic. We have more than a couple Sigma Foveon DSLR users here at the forum. Once again the work that I have seen is far from humble. Of course I am not much of a Pixel Peeper and maybe therefore can not fathom what the concern is. What I do understand is there is sound theory behind 3 layers of 4MP being stacked up and compared to 10mp or 12mp interpolated. The natural look to the color saturation of a low ISO foveon shot is enough to convince me. There is something very promising to it. Promising enough to not dismiss it that is for sure. Wink


PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
F16SUNSHINE wrote:
I think you are referring mostly to the Sigma DP1 in your thoughts. The topic of this thread is a mount modified Sigma SD14 DSLR. I have seen some very remarkable work come from the SD14. Lumping it with a fledgling P+S entry is not really very realistic. We have more than a couple Sigma Foveon DSLR users here at the forum. Once again the work that I have seen is far from humble. Of course I am not much of a Pixel Peeper and maybe therefore can not fathom what the concern is. What I do understand is there is sound theory behind 3 layers of 4MP being stacked up and compared to 10mp or 12mp interpolated. The natural look to the color saturation of a low ISO foveon shot is enough to convince me. There is something very promising to it. Promising enough to not dismiss it that is for sure. Wink


I agree. It still is a 4 MPix picture, but most probably the best 4 MPix picture you can get. Wink
There is so much information in such a frame that, if you blow it up to 10 Mpix, it will just look like a "regular" 10 MPix CMOS frame. I haven't tried, but that's what I think... (and I have seem some shots...pretty impressive.)


PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 9:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Sorry. Yes I was referring to the Sigma DP1.


PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 9:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
In any case I have some lenses that I'm very happy with and I would like to see them in action on a foveon sensor even if just too see how different they look from a CMOS/CCD result.


PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Very cool avatar Orio!!!


PostPosted: Sat May 31, 2008 5:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have long felt that the foveon is probably the best basis for a really competent sensor and, as others have mentioned, the published results from this SD14 have a magnificent depth to them (spatially and colour). Unfortunately it has never received the kind of big money support that could have driven the research to a point at which it became an obvious candidate. The sensor is little improved over where it was five years ago and the other sensors (despite their Bayer configuration) have definitely caught up a lot of the ground. There is also the lack of clear compatibility with non-Sigma manufactured lenses other than the fairly recent M42 adapter. My big problem years ago and even today was the "only Sigma" constraint. If someone were to produce a range of adapters like those for the Canon system....


patrickh


PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 12:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
patrickh wrote:
I have long felt that the foveon is probably the best basis for a really competent sensor and, as others have mentioned, the published results from this SD14 have a magnificent depth to them (spatially and colour). Unfortunately it has never received the kind of big money support that could have driven the research to a point at which it became an obvious candidate. The sensor is little improved over where it was five years ago and the other sensors (despite their Bayer configuration) have definitely caught up a lot of the ground. There is also the lack of clear compatibility with non-Sigma manufactured lenses other than the fairly recent M42 adapter. My big problem years ago and even today was the "only Sigma" constraint. If someone were to produce a range of adapters like those for the Canon system....


patrickh


Very true.

There is a profound difference between a stacked architecture and a Bayer one. The Trilayered ,stacked photosite of a Foveon sensor measures Luminance and Chrominance all in one photosite , therefore the Pixel size is equal to the photosite size ( Aprox 5 Microns)

The Bayer sensor instead requires at least 3 Photosites(Photoreceptors) to make up one Pixel . Since typical Photoreceptors size is 5 micron then to make up a Bayer Pixel requires at least a a 20 micron square.

That is a very big pixel!!

Worst , given the big size of that pixel , where the Bayer sensor can see ONE pixel , the Foveon sensor can distinguish FOUR!!

If this is not enough to get you warm , think about this : The Bayer striped sensor uses its neighbor photo sites Data, to construct color at any given point so you can clearly see that it can never be sharp , since the separation between Data Points becomes Fuzzy the minute that you start sharing border information between Photosites . Throw interpolation into the mix........and you will have a clear understanding why a Foveon sensor has such a magnificent Spatial and Color depth.

Put good Glass at the front of an SD14 and a good Brain behind ,and see how quickly great images come out.

Luis


PostPosted: Mon Jun 02, 2008 9:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
LUIS A GUEVARA wrote:


Very true.

There is a profound difference between a stacked architecture and a Bayer one. The Trilayered ,stacked photosite of a Foveon sensor measures Luminance and Chrominance all in one photosite , therefore the Pixel size is equal to the photosite size ( Aprox 5 Microns)

The Bayer sensor instead requires at least 3 Photosites(Photoreceptors) to make up one Pixel . Since typical Photoreceptors size is 5 micron then to make up a Bayer Pixel requires at least a a 20 micron square.

That is a very big pixel!!

Worst , given the big size of that pixel , where the Bayer sensor can see ONE pixel , the Foveon sensor can distinguish FOUR!!

If this is not enough to get you warm , think about this : The Bayer striped sensor uses its neighbor photo sites Data, to construct color at any given point so you can clearly see that it can never be sharp , since the separation between Data Points becomes Fuzzy the minute that you start sharing border information between Photosites . Throw interpolation into the mix........and you will have a clear understanding why a Foveon sensor has such a magnificent Spatial and Color depth.

Put good Glass at the front of an SD14 and a good Brain behind ,and see how quickly great images come out.

Luis


I have recently bought an sd14 for these very reasons. It struck me that the camera would also be particularly good for black and white work which I enjoy most.
I'm still toying with it at the moment but will post examples soon.
I don't feel brave enough to change the mount although if I did it would be to an EOS mount to take advantage of the EOS adapters.
As it is it's limited to M42 and adapted PK as although the register is OK for others the opening isn't wide enough. The only other option is to change mounts of the lenses which I don't want to do ( well I might try with one or two cheap ones).
For now I'm going to work through my tamrons and M42s and see what suits.
Flek's first. Smile


PostPosted: Tue Jun 03, 2008 5:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
My local dealer now has the Sigma SD 14.
Already reduced and on special offer Body only £399
http://www.t4cameras.co.uk/
Left menu. Specials.
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