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Ultra Wide for NEX?
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PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:40 pm    Post subject: Ultra Wide for NEX? Reply with quote
Not very happy with my cv15 so was thinking about purchasing another ultra wide for my nex5n. Can anyone suggest a somewhat inexpensive lens (other than the OEM sony)? Looking to spend under 400.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 6:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes, Tokina RMC 3.5/17, it's a great lens on the NEX, I will never sell mine!

If you can find one the Konica Hexanon 4/21 or 2.8/21 are awesome.

Tokina:



Konica:



PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
How wide is "ultra wide" for you?
And 400€, 400GBP or 400$?

I can also recommend the Tokina RMC 17/3.5 - it's really good and a lot better than the 16mm pancake or the 18-55 zoom
And it's far below your budget.

Or are looking for something wider? Than I can recommend Samyang 14/2.8, the Samynag 8/2.8 (I'm not sure if it's already released for NEX) or the Samyang 8mm/3.5
The are all optically very good (sharp, good colors, flare resistant and so on) and fit also easily in to your budget.
The 8mm lenses are fisheyes (but much less fishy than any other APS-C fisheyes I've seen) and the 14mm suffers a little from distortion (which is only relevant if you wan't to shoot architecture and is easily correctable with a lens profile though)

I have the Samyang 8/3.5 and I'm very happy with it:

It has about 177° view on NEX sensor from corner to corner!




(handheld)
Some more examples: http://www.flickr.com/photos/54671350@N02/5666656610/in/set-72157626602263964/lightbox/
I have it since about 10months months (not used it since last 4 months though because the adapter is missing Sad) and payd 255€ for a new one with 2 years guarantee in Sony Alpha Mount on Ebay - I think it's got little more expensive in the meanwhile but still fits into your budget. Bye the way If you wan't to buy this lens try to get it in native NEX mount (for some reason it's often called "Samyang 8mm f/3.5 Fish-eye CS VG10") or look for a good adapter as this lens does not tolerate many bad adapters)

The same lens is also available under other brand names like Vivitar Series 1 7.5mm f=3.5, Walimex Pro 8mm F3.5 Fisheye and many more. They often have slightly different casings though (other focus ring etc.).... but who cares!?

The Tokina RMC 17/3.5, Samyang 8/3.5 and 14/2.8 are not very compact though. If you wan't something very wide and compact wait for Samyang 8/2.8 or try to get a Voigtländer Heliar or something like that in your price range.

@Iangreen: Wow! Very nice examples! Especially the first/HDR pic is stunning!

Last edited by ForenSeil on Tue Mar 27, 2012 4:01 pm; edited 8 times in total


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
[quote="iangreenhalgh1"]Yes, Tokina RMC 3.5/17, it's a great lens on the NEX, I will never sell mine!

If you can find one the Konica Hexanon 4/21 or 2.8/21 are awesome.

Tokina:



Whow Ian, this image is wonderful! I love the saturated green grass on the tree stump. Smile


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
What didn't you like about the CV?


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for the suggestions everyone. Did not like the way CV15 images were exposed on my NEX5N. Images were almost always under exposed and when the exposure was correct, was not impressed with the overall image quality. Maybe it's just my camera but I don't have this problem (under exposed) with my other 6 lenses.

plasticmotif wrote:
What didn't you like about the CV?


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
nonac wrote:
Thanks for the suggestions everyone. Did not like the way CV15 images were exposed on my NEX5N. Images were almost always under exposed and when the exposure was correct, was not impressed with the overall image quality. Maybe it's just my camera but I don't have this problem (under exposed) with my other 6 lenses.

plasticmotif wrote:
What didn't you like about the CV?


Could you post some example/problem pictures? Do you use the lens stopped down or also often wide open?
The TTL exposure meters are generally never working 100% perfect with ultra-wide-angle lenses in my experience. The example pictures above are all shot in "M-Mode" as manual exposure always gave better results than the automatic.

And the NEX has a function to calibrate the exposure-meter if there's a general problem into one direction (general over- or underexposure)! You can press the "down-button" on the wheel in any other mode than the "i"-Mode to get into the exposure-correction menue where you can calibrate the exposure-automatic from -3 to +3 stops in 0.3ev steps.

I also have the feeling the the exposure-meter and automatic white balance of the NEX-5N has a little more problems with rangefinder lenses than with normal lenses bye the way. That's weird somehow! I often had calibrate the exposure-meter to +0.3/+0.7ev with the Contax G Biogon 28/2.8 while I never had to this in normal situations with any other lens.

Last edited by ForenSeil on Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:26 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I can also vouch for the tokina 17/3.5. But at effective 25mm focal it may not qualify as ultra wide. Samyang looks promising. I'm playing with 16mm pancake right now which may not be so bad and also has possibility of adding an ultra wide adapter.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for the kind words guys. I think the Tokina 17 is one of the biggest bargains around to be honest.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
What about Zeiss? any legacy Zeiss lenses (22mm and under) that can be adapted to NEX?

ForenSeil, I'll see if I can find an example.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Thanks for the kind words guys. I think the Tokina 17 is one of the biggest bargains around to be honest.


Can't agree more. But every time we comment on such lenses a £/$/€ gets added to its price! Btw stunning HDR Ian.

Nonac, how about a contax g 21mm? Or flecktogon 20/4?


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
bhargav wrote:
every time we comment on such lenses a £/$/€ gets added to its price!


Ain't that the truth... sadly...


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 10:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Even though I've only had limited usage of shooting with the NEX - the histogram works.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 11:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'd love to get the G 21. I have the 28/45/90 and couldn't be happier. Unfortunately, the G 21's go for about $800-1000 :/ The flecktogon could be an option though.

bhargav wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Thanks for the kind words guys. I think the Tokina 17 is one of the biggest bargains around to be honest.


Can't agree more. But every time we comment on such lenses a £/$/€ gets added to its price! Btw stunning HDR Ian.

Nonac, how about a contax g 21mm? Or flecktogon 20/4?


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
There are better ultrawides than the Flek 4/20 which is a pretty old lens.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
plasticmotif wrote:
Even though I've only had limited usage of shooting with the NEX - the histogram works.


Yes, I find I'm using it a lot more than I do on my Pentax K10 - which obviously only shows after the picture has been taken.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
bhargav wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Thanks for the kind words guys. I think the Tokina 17 is one of the biggest bargains around to be honest.


Can't agree more. But every time we comment on such lenses a £/$/€ gets added to its price! Btw stunning HDR Ian.

Nonac, how about a contax g 21mm? Or flecktogon 20/4?


I doubt that Contax G 21mm will work well on the NEX. It's a Biogon design with the rear element getting very close to the sensor plane. I tried the new Zeiss 2.8/21 ZM which is meant to be very similar and at anything but close up the corners were a mush.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 2:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
DanielT74 wrote:
bhargav wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Thanks for the kind words guys. I think the Tokina 17 is one of the biggest bargains around to be honest.


Can't agree more. But every time we comment on such lenses a £/$/€ gets added to its price! Btw stunning HDR Ian.

Nonac, how about a contax g 21mm? Or flecktogon 20/4?


I doubt that Contax G 21mm will work well on the NEX. It's a Biogon design with the rear element getting very close to the sensor plane. I tried the new Zeiss 2.8/21 ZM which is meant to be very similar and at anything but close up the corners were a mush.


No, the Biogon 21/2.8 is working very fine with the NEX-5N (except far corner which are "only moderate")
It's a great lens but as said usually far above the price limit of the thread starter, as well as the Contax G 16mm Hologon. And 21mm are also not ultra-wide on APS-C.

The new Sonnar 24/1.8 for E-Mount has a almost perfect corners on NEX-Sensor though and as not much more expensive than the Biogon 21, but it's also not an ultra wide and also above the price limit.

Last edited by ForenSeil on Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:23 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 2:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
There's a bunch of people having issues with the Biogon on the NEX:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1042&message=39857458

I also recall seeing it in other places. Have you got one and it's working fine? No colour case on the edges? So softness at infinity focus?


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 10:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Amazing thunderstorm image!!


That's one of the "problems" with the NEX-system, that there is no real "superwide".

The wides original lens (2.8/16) will give you the FoV of a 24mm lens on fullframe.
Old manual lenses are not much wider, but much bigger.

A 10 or 12 mm lens for the NEX system is really missing!!


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 11:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Get one of the LA-EA adapter and use the readily available ultra wide primes/zooms for crop sensor or wait until someone make ultra wide for the NEX.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 11:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
calvin83 wrote:
Get one of the LA-EA adapter and use the readily available ultra wide primes/zooms for crop sensor or wait until someone make ultra wide for the NEX.


First solution is too large and heavy, so I have to go for the second one.
And that's what I meant. Not yet available!


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 11:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
LucisPictor wrote:
calvin83 wrote:
Get one of the LA-EA adapter and use the readily available ultra wide primes/zooms for crop sensor or wait until someone make ultra wide for the NEX.


First solution is too large and heavy, so I have to go for the second one.
And that's what I meant. Not yet available!

The third solution will be a Ultra Wide-Heliar 12mm f/5.6 plus M mount adapter but it is even more expensive than a 5N double kit. Wink

The E16 plus the ultra wide converter may be the only affordable light combo now. There is a wide angle zoom in the E mount lens roadmap this year.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
There's a good ultrawide-adapter made for the 16mm pancake by Sony bye the way.
And as said a second smaller 8mm one is announced by Samyang for NEX.

DanielT74 wrote:
There's a bunch of people having issues with the Biogon on the NEX:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/read.asp?forum=1042&message=39857458

I also recall seeing it in other places. Have you got one and it's working fine? No colour case on the edges? So softness at infinity focus?

Look at the answers to the post - they are skeptical. The internal shades/protectors don't hit the shutter and that they would cause color fringing and vignetting makes no sense as the lens is designed for FF. There was indeed a problem with vigetting, sharpness and color on the old NEX-3 and NEX-5 as the sensor wasn't optimized for RF lenses. But the new NEX-C3 and NEX-5N have an updated sensor-surface with much lower problems with very angular projection.

Look here for some example pics of 21/2.8 Contax G on NEX-5N http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/969329/221#10428624
I can't see any serious sharpness falloff, color fringing, vignetting and so on on NEX-5N


PostPosted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 12:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
When I tried the new Zeiss 21/2.8 ZM with the 5N I got similar results as long as I wasn't at infinity focus. It's hard to know whether the first pic was shot at infinity focus but of course in daylight they could have stopped it down. So I am still skeptical.

Does the new Biogon have a different optical scheme to the old one?
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