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Metabones speedbooster
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PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
DanielT74 wrote:
Sorry to be a bother, but let me repeat this question for fear of it being lost in the midst of the discussion, perhaps for Brian Caldwell or other people who are involved:

Would anyone be able to comment on the performance with the Alpa mounts and in particular Macro-Switar 50/1.9? Are there any samples/comparisons (with the Speedbooster and without)?

I would be very grateful for any relevant info before committing to a purchase.



Well since there currently doesn't exist one yet (or are they shipping them already?), you might be asking in the wrong place at the wrong time. However, why would you expect anything other than how the EF-NEX adapter works with other lenses? You can take a look at, e.g., how the EF 50/1.4 works with this adapter on the NEX in comparison to how it works on a 5D, and expect that the Alpa lens would work with this adapter on the NEX in a similar way as the above as it would work on a 5D.


PostPosted: Sat Jan 26, 2013 11:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The Alpa version was shipped within a few days of annoucement but the Kern Macro Switar 50/1.9 is almost as rare as the feather of a phoenix and the horn of a unicorn, so you are not going to hear about it a lot. I think the first buyer was in Hong Kong and some impressive photos (on Fuji X-E1) were posted.

http://www.dchome.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1175342


PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
How does it add what.. a stop extra to the lens? It would be interesting to see the science behind this.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
philslizzy wrote:
How does it add what.. a stop extra to the lens? It would be interesting to see the science behind this.


Read this thread; the science is in there Smile


PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
rawhead wrote:
philslizzy wrote:
How does it add what.. a stop extra to the lens? It would be interesting to see the science behind this.


Read this thread; the science is in there Smile


Thanks, I understand a little better now.

Why can't they make a cheaper, 'dumb' version without all the electronics? I you're going to stack say, m42 lenses, on top of an EF adapter, the electronics are redundant.

Nice, but it's outa my price range just now though!


PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 10:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
philslizzy wrote:

Why can't they make a cheaper, 'dumb' version without all the electronics? I you're going to stack say, m42 lenses, on top of an EF adapter, the electronics are redundant. Nice, but it's outa my price range just now though!..


they certainly 'could' and I expect that they eventually will but that first they would want to sell many of the 'smart', expensive ones.
Me too I'd go for a cheaper, 'dumb', best K mount adapter and stack the M42, possibly the more people say so the earlier they come.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 27, 2013 11:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
philslizzy wrote:

Why can't they make a cheaper, 'dumb' version without all the electronics? I you're going to stack say, m42 lenses, on top of an EF adapter, the electronics are redundant. Nice, but it's outa my price range just now though!..


they certainly 'could' and I expect that they eventually will but that first they would want to sell many of the 'smart', expensive ones.
Me too I'd go for a cheaper, 'dumb', best K mount adapter and stack the M42, possibly the more people say so the earlier they come.


I expect the Chinese will start knocking them out in the next year or so.


PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 5:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
conurus wrote:
The Alpa version was shipped within a few days of annoucement but the Kern Macro Switar 50/1.9 is almost as rare as the feather of a phoenix and the horn of a unicorn, so you are not going to hear about it a lot. I think the first buyer was in Hong Kong and some impressive photos (on Fuji X-E1) were posted.

http://www.dchome.net/forum.php?mod=viewthread&tid=1175342


Thanks, conurus. If I get the lens+adapter, I will post some pics. Some of the one's in the link suggest some softness which I guess is expected for an old lens more prone to flare and with a little less contrast wide open, but in the absence of full resolution files it is hard to know (for me) just how well the combo performs.


PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 8:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Test by lensrentals here:[url] http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/01/metabones-magic[/url]


PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kds315* wrote:
Test by lensrentals here:[url] http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/01/metabones-magic[/url]

I suspect (as he mentions) the SpeedBooster will be very popular and make it's money with the video crowd.
The quest for wide lenses and and tiny depth of field is never ending.
The art of storytelling has been lost to a bottomless money pit for technology.


PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 6:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Alternate Internet ID wrote:
kds315* wrote:
Test by lensrentals here:[url] http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/01/metabones-magic[/url]

I suspect (as he mentions) the SpeedBooster will be very popular and make it's money with the video crowd.
The quest for wide lenses and and tiny depth of field is never ending.
The art of storytelling has been lost to a bottomless money pit for technology.


you must be very right about the story being important in a video, much more than technicalities, and that's sure also true for photos.
on the other hand I remember statements of 'bokeh killed' because of APS-C, which I always have found harsh and no reason to discredit APS-C, specially since a digital FF still means more than double the bulk, weight and cost. On the other hand if this adapter enables a tiny and light NEX with it's outstanding manual focus lens compatibilities and abilities, to record what a 50mm and wider lens would on a FF, than this speed booster is an unimagined gift of the goods Smile

Last edited by kuuan on Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:26 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Mon Jan 28, 2013 7:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
Alternate Internet ID wrote:
kds315* wrote:
Test by lensrentals here:[url] http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/01/metabones-magic[/url]

I suspect (as he mentions) the SpeedBooster will be very popular and make it's money with the video crowd.
The quest for wide lenses and and tiny depth of field is never ending.
The art of storytelling has been lost to a bottomless money pit for technology.


you must be very right about the story being important in a video, much more than technicalities, and that's sure also true for photos.
on the other hand I remember statements of 'bokeh killed' because of APS-C, which I always have found harsh and no reason to discredit APS-C, specially since a digital FF still means more than double the bulk, weight and cost. On the other hand, if this adapter enables my tiny and light NEX5N, with it's outstanding manual focus lens compatibilities and abilities, to record what my 50mm and wider lenses would on a FF, than this speed booster is an unimagined gift of the goods Smile


Nicely said.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 29, 2013 1:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
sichko wrote:
kuuan wrote:
Alternate Internet ID wrote:
kds315* wrote:
Test by lensrentals here:[url] http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/01/metabones-magic[/url]

I suspect (as he mentions) the SpeedBooster will be very popular and make it's money with the video crowd.
The quest for wide lenses and and tiny depth of field is never ending.
The art of storytelling has been lost to a bottomless money pit for technology.


you must be very right about the story being important in a video, much more than technicalities, and that's sure also true for photos.
on the other hand I remember statements of 'bokeh killed' because of APS-C, which I always have found harsh and no reason to discredit APS-C, specially since a digital FF still means more than double the bulk, weight and cost. On the other hand, if this adapter enables my tiny and light NEX5N, with it's outstanding manual focus lens compatibilities and abilities, to record what my 50mm and wider lenses would on a FF, than this speed booster is an unimagined gift of the goods Smile


Nicely said.


apart from the goods bit


PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 3:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
http://www.dpreview.com/articles/2667195592/first-impressions-metabones-speed-booster

At last some proper test cherts - seems like the corners from Nex and Speed Booster look bad compared to a full frame Canon.


PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 3:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I wouldn't say they look bad. They look worse (as common sense dictates) but IMHO they look very good compared to what one might expect with a foreign piece of glass in-between. Such amount of CA is fairly easy to correct in LR nowadays.


PostPosted: Fri Feb 01, 2013 4:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
It's a nice idea, and the results look much better than I could expect.
A bit on the expensive side for my taste. Maybe if I had a decent collection of Leica R lenses i could think about buying it.
But those are also on the expensive side for my taste.


PostPosted: Mon Feb 11, 2013 7:08 pm    Post subject: Re: MFT version Reply with quote
ulli65 wrote:
Brian, did Metabones already scheduled the micro four thirds version?
And what would be the 1st mount(s)?

Really looking forward getting one for M42


Don't know if this was ever answered, but this is straight from the horse's mouth (Metabones website):

Quote:
When will m4/3 cameras be supported?

Manual focus lenses such as Nikon, Leica R, Contax C/Y, Contarex, ALPA and Rollei will be supported in March, 2013.

Canon EF lens (but not EF-S) support is planned in the future, but we do not have an estimated date yet.

The m4/3 version also reduces focal length by a 0.71x factor. So, the combined focal length multiplier of a m4/3 camera and Speed Booster is 1.4x. (2x from camera x 0.71x from Speed Booster.) The optics are optimized for the smaller sensor size.


PostPosted: Wed Feb 27, 2013 10:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm late to this discussion, having found out about the Speed Booster just today. To me, this is exciting news. So first thing I did was go to Metabones' site and read what they had to say, including the white paper. It seemed even more encouraging.

I've been into astronomy for over two decades, so I'm quite familiar with telecompressors -- which is in essence all the Speed Booster is. And I've wondered for years why nobody has ever made telecompressors for cameras. Maybe there wasn't enough of a need or demand until nowadays?

Klaus posted a link to the Lens Rental people's evaluation of the Speed Booster, but his link contains characters that don't belong there, so it ends up not working as it should. This is the correct link to the Lens Rental tests:

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2013/01/metabones-magic

I would suggest to any doubters out there to read through the entire review. Pay attention to the actual numbers he cites. Look at the test charts. Check out the example photographs. Then you'll be informed at least when you attempt to criticize this product.

To me this is great news for a variety of reasons, but mostly it is because it means that, with the Speed Booster, a NEX has effectively become an FF camera when using FF lenses, plus the lenses are faster to boot. A real win-win.

I don't have a NEX yet, but I'll be buying one in the very near future. Just have to sell a few items that are worth quite a bit of money and that I don't use anymore to raise the funds for the kit. After that, I'll probably get the EF-to-NEX model because I shoot Canon currently and have a small assortment of EF lenses, but also the Canon registration distance is such that a large number of "dumb" adapters can be used on it, which means I can use the EF Speed Booster for anything from M39 to Nikon F. Sadly, though, not Canon FD. My best and fastest lenses are all Canon FD -- 85/1.2, 85/1.8, 55/1.2, 50/1.4, 35/1.9. Plus I have a 24mm and a 17mm, so the increased wide-angle-ness will be nice as well. I have read the rumors that Metabones has a Canon FD Speed Booster in the works and, if this is indeed true, then for me it's especially good news.

I can see why Dr. Rawhead is so stoked about it, and judging by the looks of the images he's posted so far, it looks like he has good reason to be.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 20, 2013 8:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Some news and a time line Question
http://www.43rumors.com/metabones-speed-bosster-coming-soon-and-mitakon-cheap-clone-too/

04/2013 : Nikon (and others) Metabones Speed Booster ; FF Nikkors (and others) for 400$ ; Available inside Europe ?
07/2013 : Mitakon Speed Booster ; What mounts ? FF line of lenses for 200/250 $ ; Available inside Europe ?
2014 : Nex FF ; $$$ > to RX1...
^^


PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 11:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
AFAIK, the "opposite teleconverter" was used to produce the Zeiss Planar 50mm/f0.7 (the lens that was used by NASA and Stanley Kubrick). Back then the guys at Zeiss took the existing design of the 70mm/f1, and had added a condenser to the rear of the Gauss lens.

I hope, one happy day this idea will be implemented to use Medium format (or even large format) lenses on FF bodies.
That would be just great! Very Happy


PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 2:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
tond wrote:
...I hope, one happy day this idea will be implemented to use Medium format (or even large format) lenses on FF bodies.
That would be just great! Very Happy

You can reach 0.3x with normal 0.5x focal reducers (~50€)


PostPosted: Thu Mar 21, 2013 4:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
ForenSeil wrote:
tond wrote:
...I hope, one happy day this idea will be implemented to use Medium format (or even large format) lenses on FF bodies.
That would be just great! Very Happy

You can reach 0.3x with normal 0.5x focal reducers (~50€)

The magnification depends on the exact position of the reducer between the rear element and the focal plane?
If I move the reducer closer to the film/matrix plane, the effect becomes less pronounced? And vice versa.
I must boost my knowledge, and do some investigation in this area.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
tond wrote:

I hope, one happy day this idea will be implemented to use Medium format (or even large format) lenses on FF bodies.
That would be just great! Very Happy


I'm guessing there's probably a "happy" medium somewhere wherein, once you're passed a certain "reduction ratio", you start getting into trouble regarding field curfvature, distortion, chromatic and other aberration, size, weight, etc. I'm also guessing that this "0.7x" (instead of, you know, 0.66x) is pretty close to that happy medium.

So, I won't go so far as to pray/ask for a MetaBones MegaBooster that can shrink MF lens circle to 135.

But, as I've mentioned a few times in different places, I'm just DYING to get one that will reduce Hasselblad 6x6 lens down about 0.66x, because that would take a 56 x 56 mm image (size of 6x6 medium format) and reduce it to around 37 x 37 mm, which is the sensor size for the very last "square" sensor digital medium format back that was made for the Hasselblad V system (CFV-16).

A CFV-16 used can be had for less than 5,000USD nowadays, so such a MetaBones lens would be like getting a Full Frame 6x6 digital MF camera for $5000+adapter cost.

For something like that, there's no argument about "getting a "REAL" full frame camera" because such a camera/sensor does not exist (full frame 56 x 56 mm sensor).


PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I guess even better might be backs like PhaseOne P25(+), which have dimensions like 48.9 x 36.7mm, which is around 0.68x of 56 x 70mm (Pentax 67 frame size)!! Very Happy And those go for cheaper, like $4000 on Ebay. Imagine that, a "Full Frame" 67 Digital MF for $4000 + MetaBones adapter price! Very Happy

(Of course, in both cases, there needs to be a design of a chassis that will connect the lens with the sensor and provide a shutter mechanism, etc. So we're talking more money… BUT, You can spend 30,000USD today on the highest end IQ280 back from PhaseOne, and you will *still* not get a full frame 6x6 image.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
rawhead wrote:
tond wrote:

I hope, one happy day this idea will be implemented to use Medium format (or even large format) lenses on FF bodies.
That would be just great! Very Happy


I'm guessing there's probably a "happy" medium somewhere wherein, once you're passed a certain "reduction ratio", you start getting into trouble regarding field curfvature, distortion, chromatic and other aberration, size, weight, etc. I'm also guessing that this "0.7x" (instead of, you know, 0.66x) is pretty close to that happy medium.

So, I won't go so far as to pray/ask for a MetaBones MegaBooster that can shrink MF lens circle to 135.

But, as I've mentioned a few times in different places, I'm just DYING to get one that will reduce Hasselblad 6x6 lens down about 0.66x, because that would take a 56 x 56 mm image (size of 6x6 medium format) and reduce it to around 37 x 37 mm, which is the sensor size for the very last "square" sensor digital medium format back that was made for the Hasselblad V system (CFV-16).

A CFV-16 used can be had for less than 5,000USD nowadays, so such a MetaBones lens would be like getting a Full Frame 6x6 digital MF camera for $5000+adapter cost.

For something like that, there's no argument about "getting a "REAL" full frame camera" because such a camera/sensor does not exist (full frame 56 x 56 mm sensor).

I think you're 100% right. there is no need to squeeze everything from the Medium format circle. I think if I had enough knowledge in optics it would be not impossible to calculate required formula for a reducer, and order the from opticians or something. The mounts are then easier as many ring adapters, filters (where you can screw out old glass and screw in yours), extension rings, helicoids are available. Especially in your case, with expensive lenses it's easier to justify for yourself the expense. Or even skip the DYI calculation part, but give a task to a skilled optician. Have you thought going this way?
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