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Hardening agent and washing technique
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PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for all the info!
About the hardener... is it something that I can add to any fixer?
Because I have seen "hardening fixers" but this would mean to buy yet another bottle of fixer... so I was wondering if there's the hardener product alone to be added to any fixer...


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 10:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I seem to recall we had big lumps of chrome alum for these kinds of eventualities. It was a crystalline substance. It was one of my jobs to chip chunks off to make hardening baths.

I'd suggest you don't bother if you don't have a hardening fixer on your chemical shelf, but just don't handle the emulsion surface at all and you should be ok Wink


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 10:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
GrahamNR17 wrote:

I'd suggest you don't bother if you don't have a hardening fixer on your chemical shelf, but just don't handle the emulsion surface at all and you should be ok Wink


ok Smile
So I assume, no squeegee after last washing... right?


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 10:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
GrahamNR17 wrote:

I'd suggest you don't bother if you don't have a hardening fixer on your chemical shelf, but just don't handle the emulsion surface at all and you should be ok Wink


ok Smile
So I assume, no squeegee after last washing... right?


Shocked No squeegee after ANY wash of ANY film Surprised

In fact, chuck that squeegee away - NOW! Evil or Very Mad

Have you done it yet?


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
GrahamNR17 wrote:


Shocked No squeegee after ANY wash of ANY film Surprised

In fact, chuck that squeegee away - NOW! Evil or Very Mad

Have you done it yet?


Ok, ok... Laughing
I will use it only on prints Rolling Eyes Laughing


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 11:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
GrahamNR17 wrote:


Do not develop it over 20 deg C. The emulsion is very fragile and will literally start to come away from the film base at higher temperatures.


Oooops! .... I didn't read the instructions. Embarassed I dev'd at about 24 deg C as diafine works quite warm. Didn't seem to do the film any harm but I guess I was just lucky - I do always use fingers rather than a squeegee so maybe that helped keep the emulsion on. Smile

So Diafine not recommended for the Efke films.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2009 11:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Xpres wrote:
I do always use fingers rather than a squeegee so maybe that helped keep the emulsion on. Smile
So Diafine not recommended for the Efke films.


At the course the teachers also used fingers.
I was thinking that maybe the skin PH could damage the emulsion but perhaps not ?

I have bought some Efke film and also some Efke FB paper, which is very cheap compared to Ilford. I am curious about the results. I also got the Efke varifilters as apparently they are different from Ilford's.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 2:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio, the Efke 400 has convinced me that this or Adox is the way I want
to go with BW film. Have 3 rolls of 120 ISO 50 film, will see how it goes.
From what I've seen the best results are with the 25 or 50 ISO. There's
an Aussie on NikonCafe that does stand developing method with great results on Efke/Adox films.

The negs (like I said in my thread) are very thin compared to anything
else, but is also easy to scan because of it.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 6:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Xpres wrote:
I do always use fingers rather than a squeegee

I ditched my squeegee decades ago after a costly discovery of why they are not recommended. I don't use fingers either now, but I keep a bottle of distilled water (I live in a very hard water area) for final rinse, shake the excess off fairly vigorously, and then hang up to dry in the bathroom (generally the most dust-free room in the house). I now never have trouble with drying streaks or spots.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 7:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks, seems like "shake and hang" is the best way.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 10:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
alex wrote:
for final rinse, shake the excess off fairly vigorously, and then hang up to dry in the bathroom


I just had a vision of a ribon of film flying vigorously around the room Laughing , but presumably you shake it while still on the reel?

Distilled water as a final is a good idea, in fact a good idea to mix your chemicals with it too. I have to admit to using a drop of rinse aid in the final wash ( of tap water) for everyday stuff which, with the fingers, leaves clean negs that last.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Xpres wrote:
GrahamNR17 wrote:


Do not develop it over 20 deg C. The emulsion is very fragile and will literally start to come away from the film base at higher temperatures.


Oooops! .... I didn't read the instructions. Embarassed I dev'd at about 24 deg C as diafine works quite warm. Didn't seem to do the film any harm but I guess I was just lucky - I do always use fingers rather than a squeegee so maybe that helped keep the emulsion on. Smile

So Diafine not recommended for the Efke films.


You'll be fine. Diafine specify anywhere between 70 and 85 deg F (21 to 29 deg C). Given how the stuff works, I just give everything 5+5 mins at ambient, which is often at 18 or 19 deg C. The nature of the brew means it's basically safe at anything up to 15 mins in each bath with zero observable change in neg characteristics Wink


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks Graham - That's good news. Very Happy

I've always warmed up the Diafine - and everything else - before using it, but I'll try the next one at room temp'.



GrahamNR17 wrote:
Xpres wrote:
GrahamNR17 wrote:


Do not develop it over 20 deg C. The emulsion is very fragile and will literally start to come away from the film base at higher temperatures.


Oooops! .... I didn't read the instructions. Embarassed I dev'd at about 24 deg C as diafine works quite warm. Didn't seem to do the film any harm but I guess I was just lucky - I do always use fingers rather than a squeegee so maybe that helped keep the emulsion on. Smile

So Diafine not recommended for the Efke films.


You'll be fine. Diafine specify anywhere between 70 and 85 deg F (21 to 29 deg C). Given how the stuff works, I just give everything 5+5 mins at ambient, which is often at 18 or 19 deg C. The nature of the brew means it's basically safe at anything up to 15 mins in each bath with zero observable change in neg characteristics Wink


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 5:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Xpres,

Try the slow ones with Neofin Blue, or home-made Beutler. Make sure you expose carefully and see if you prefer it to Diafine. Acutol would have been good too.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2009 11:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Xpres wrote:
but presumably you shake it while still on the reel?

I could have phrased it more unambiguously! Yes, I give it a good shake on the reel, then unfurl it, peg it at each end, and hang it up.

Quote:
Distilled water as a final is a good idea, in fact a good idea to mix your chemicals with it too.

Yes indeed, that's how I do it. Normally, the only time tap water comes into contact with the emulsion is in the post-fix wash, and that's followed by the distilled water rinse with a few drops of wetting agent. When I lived in Scotland (which is home), I never bothered with distilled water, because the water where I lived there was very soft indeed, virtually no lime, but where I am now, the lime content is very high, and kettles develop remarkably thick coatings of limescale relatively quickly, even when filtering the tap water. I learned the lesson quickly after my first roll of film processed in chalky tap water, which left noticeable streaks and spots on drying, and called for a re-wash.

Film processing is still fun, and I have never tired of it.


PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2009 1:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I created this thread by splitting the Efke films thread to which this discussion didn't belong anymore.
Better also for future searches.
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