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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3702 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:48 pm Post subject: Extremely Rare German Lens Edixagon |
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Pancolart wrote:
Click here to see on Ebay Yeah, sure. Million dollar question: German or Japan made? 2 Preisvorschläge already given, huh.
Nevertheless it is well crafted lens. I own similar Edixar 1.8/55mm. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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casualcollector
Joined: 01 Aug 2008 Posts: 749 Location: Spaced out on Florida's Space Coast
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Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 12:54 pm Post subject: |
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casualcollector wrote:
I think you are right. With enough Yashinon parts from different periods you could probably build one. _________________ In Search Of "R" Serial Soligors
Found: 135/2.8 #R407660, 200/4 #R405526, 300/5.5 #R411127 |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
Same thing here :
Click here to see on Ebay
I have one, I'm going to get rich...
The lens is said to be a Rodenstock Heligon in disguise.
Unfortunately this is probably fake but creates some fantasies in the Far East.
http://www.soupis.com/viewthread.php?tid=25479&extra=&page=1
(for example) _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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nukemall
Joined: 24 Apr 2012 Posts: 96 Location: Blagoveschensk, Russia
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Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:22 pm Post subject: |
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nukemall wrote:
It's looks like mix of Yashinon DX, Yashinon DS and Chinon barrel parts(sometimes i do the same for fun - most parts of this f/1.7-2.0 lenses interchangeable). And i don't see any "Made in Germany" on it. _________________ My blog |
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calvin83
Joined: 12 Apr 2009 Posts: 7555 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Mon Jun 24, 2013 11:55 pm Post subject: |
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calvin83 wrote:
I think the lens renders like my Retina S Rodenstock Heligon 1.9/50 but I am not sure who make it. I will perfer the QUINON or SEPTON over the Heligon. _________________ https://lensfever.com/
https://www.instagram.com/_lens_fever/
The best lens is the one you have with you. |
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Bille
Joined: 03 Jan 2013 Posts: 381
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Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 3:53 am Post subject: |
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Bille wrote:
Beautiful rendition:
http://www.flickr.com/search/?q=edixagon |
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casualcollector
Joined: 01 Aug 2008 Posts: 749 Location: Spaced out on Florida's Space Coast
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Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 12:35 pm Post subject: |
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casualcollector wrote:
Well I guess it's for real! As for who built it, I put my money on Mamiya or Yashica. _________________ In Search Of "R" Serial Soligors
Found: 135/2.8 #R407660, 200/4 #R405526, 300/5.5 #R411127 |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3702 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Tue Jun 25, 2013 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
casualcollector wrote: |
Well I guess it's for real! As for who built it, I put my money on Mamiya or Yashica. |
+1 (=Tomioka) _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 12:43 am Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
3 paths on the www :
- Rodenstock Heligon 50/2
(why ? very low probability)
(See it on a Kodak Retina II : http://www.flickr.com/photos/73360512@N04/8400216123/in/photostream/ )
- Japanese : It looks like a Yashinon/Tominon 5cm 2
(not really : here's a picture of a Tominon. Isn't it too early for a japanese lens on a german body ?)
- Pancolar 50/2 (similar ring's places on the body of the lens, is it possible ?) _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3702 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 11:14 am Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
Your Yashinon (Tomioka) is too early version to compare. Maybe it's easier to find it as Mamiya / Sekor F2 or F1.8 M42.
Plastic A/M swith is shaped round but other have it just like Edixagon.
Yashinon-DS 1.9/50mm
Yashinon-DX 1.4/55mm
Check also those topics:
http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=31605
http://forum.mflenses.com/mamiya-sekor-yashinon-huh-t30375.html
http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=22116
http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=10400[url=http://forum.mflenses.com/userpix/20136/big_403_m2_1.jpg] _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:37 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
I really don't understand the fuss, it's just a Japanese lens with a fake German name, hardly worth 4.50eu rather than 450! _________________ I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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calvin83
Joined: 12 Apr 2009 Posts: 7555 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 1:58 pm Post subject: |
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calvin83 wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
I really don't understand the fuss, it's just a Japanese lens with a fake German name, hardly worth 4.50eu rather than 450! |
The seller can sell the lens for much more if they say it is a rare lens make from well known maker. I cannot see any point a German made lens do not stamp "Made in Germany" if they are made in Germany.
The coating of this lens is different from my Heligon with pale orange/violet reflection. I agrees this lens is very similar to the Mamiya/Sekor 50mm which is very good 50mm. _________________ https://lensfever.com/
https://www.instagram.com/_lens_fever/
The best lens is the one you have with you.
Last edited by calvin83 on Sun Jun 30, 2013 7:31 am; edited 1 time in total |
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nukemall
Joined: 24 Apr 2012 Posts: 96 Location: Blagoveschensk, Russia
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Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 2:19 pm Post subject: |
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nukemall wrote:
Pancolart wrote: |
Your Yashinon (Tomioka) is too early version to compare. Maybe it's easier to find it as Mamiya / Sekor F2 or F1.8 M42.
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It's not Tomioka at all. It's Cosina.
Tomioka-made Mamiya-Sekor looks like this:
It much smaller(Cosina barrel unified for f/2 - f/1.4 lenses) and different design. _________________ My blog |
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Mos6502
Joined: 20 Jun 2011 Posts: 960 Location: Austin
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Posted: Thu Jun 27, 2013 6:08 pm Post subject: |
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Mos6502 wrote:
I'm fairly certain the lens is related to Mamiya. If you compare the results from the Edixagon to the results from a Mamiya Sekor 2/50, they are indistinguishable. I don't believe it is related to the Yashinon 2/50, as the bokeh is noticeably different between the two.
I don't think there is any chance it could be German. When ISCO withdrew from the M42 market it left Edixa without a low cost lens supplier. Schacht was already gone, as was Steinheil. Aside from not looking like any Rodenstock product that I know of, why would Edixa go to Rodenstock for a cheap lens? They already had the Schneider Xenon for the top of the line lens. Regula was stuck in the same situation and they turned to Cosina to make the Regulon 1.8/50 for them. It seems pretty reasonable that Edixa also went to Japan looking for a good cheap lens at the same time. And let us not forget the Japanese made Exaktar and "pancolar" 2/50 of the same era. |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:06 am Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
Mos6502 wrote: |
I'm fairly certain the lens is related to Mamiya. If you compare the results from the Edixagon to the results from a Mamiya Sekor 2/50, they are indistinguishable. I don't believe it is related to the Yashinon 2/50, as the bokeh is noticeably different between the two.
I don't think there is any chance it could be German. When ISCO withdrew from the M42 market it left Edixa without a low cost lens supplier. Schacht was already gone, as was Steinheil. Aside from not looking like any Rodenstock product that I know of, why would Edixa go to Rodenstock for a cheap lens? They already had the Schneider Xenon for the top of the line lens. Regula was stuck in the same situation and they turned to Cosina to make the Regulon 1.8/50 for them. It seems pretty reasonable that Edixa also went to Japan looking for a good cheap lens at the same time. And let us not forget the Japanese made Exaktar and "pancolar" 2/50 of the same era. |
Nice to hear you.
I'll try to come back with pictures Mamiya/Sekor (f1.4 I don't have f2) / Edixagon / Pancolar
Can we date the lens in 1968 ?
Sylvain Halgand shows it here on a 1968 camera (Prismaflex LTL), and I got mine on a Prismat TTL(edit), camera of the same year.
http://www.collection-appareils.fr/x/html/page_standard.php?id_appareil=1471 _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1
Last edited by Phenix jc on Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:52 am; edited 1 time in total |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3702 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 10:42 am Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
Talking about rare Wirgin Edixa lenses see Edixar 1.8/55mm: http://www.ebay.com/itm/EDIXA-MAT-REFLEX-Mod-C-L-M42-Edixar-1-8-55-FINDER-Good-Condition-/260980033419
One possible explanation: lens production was partially transferred to Japan. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:11 pm Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
#1 EDIXAR 55/1.8
#2 EDIXA 50/1.8
This last one seems undoubtedly Japanese _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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taunusreiter
Joined: 20 Mar 2007 Posts: 127
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 12:47 pm Post subject: |
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taunusreiter wrote:
The reason why this stuff is so rare is simply that almost nobody wanted it when it was new, with a reason.
That's true for other 60's German stuff too.
Go for a good Takumar. Better in terms of optics, mechanics, size and (small) price _________________ My flickr Gallery
My Classic Camera Website |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 1:11 pm Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
taunusreiter wrote: |
The reason why this stuff is so rare is simply that almost nobody wanted it when it was new, with a reason.
That's true for other 60's German stuff too.
Go for a good Takumar. Better in terms of optics, mechanics, size and (small) price |
50 years after the victory of the Japanese photographic industry, collectors give a revenge to the 60's German stuff
(and probably asian collectors...) _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 6:18 pm Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
Phenix jc wrote: |
Mos6502 wrote: |
I'm fairly certain the lens is related to Mamiya. If you compare the results from the Edixagon to the results from a Mamiya Sekor 2/50, they are indistinguishable. I don't believe it is related to the Yashinon 2/50, as the bokeh is noticeably different between the two.
I don't think there is any chance it could be German. When ISCO withdrew from the M42 market it left Edixa without a low cost lens supplier. Schacht was already gone, as was Steinheil. Aside from not looking like any Rodenstock product that I know of, why would Edixa go to Rodenstock for a cheap lens? They already had the Schneider Xenon for the top of the line lens. Regula was stuck in the same situation and they turned to Cosina to make the Regulon 1.8/50 for them. It seems pretty reasonable that Edixa also went to Japan looking for a good cheap lens at the same time. And let us not forget the Japanese made Exaktar and "pancolar" 2/50 of the same era. |
Nice to hear you.
I'll try to come back with pictures Mamiya/Sekor (f1.4 I don't have f2) / Edixagon / Pancolar
Can we date the lens in 1968 ?
Sylvain Halgand shows it here on a 1968 camera (Prismaflex LTL), and I got mine on a Prismat TTL(edit), camera of the same year.
http://www.collection-appareils.fr/x/html/page_standard.php?id_appareil=1471 |
IMHO it doesn't look like a Mamiya. The Pancolar is not the opposite. _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3702 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
Phenix jc wrote: |
IMHO it doesn't look like a Mamiya. The Pancolar is not the opposite. |
Compare the rear of the lenses. While Mamiya (possibly Tomioka) is nearly the same as Edixagon, they have nothing to do with Pancolar. Moreover given Pancolar is IMHO quite older.
nukemall wrote: |
Pancolart wrote: |
Your Yashinon (Tomioka) is too early version to compare. Maybe it's easier to find it as Mamiya / Sekor F2 or F1.8 M42.
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It's not Tomioka at all. It's Cosina. |
No. See Cosina own product bellow. If you serviced it you know it's made clumsier then Mamiya / Tomioka / Yashinon.
Cosinon Edixa lens above was probably used on Wirgin Edixa SLR successors made by COSINA (EDIXA TL bellow).
While Mamiya (possibly Tomioka) made lenses like Edixagon & Edixar were used on Wirgin genuine Germany made SLR cameras. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:31 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
taunusreiter wrote: |
The reason why this stuff is so rare is simply that almost nobody wanted it when it was new, with a reason.
That's true for other 60's German stuff too.
Go for a good Takumar. Better in terms of optics, mechanics, size and (small) price |
I agree, there are loads of very good lenses that don't carry the price premium.
It just seems ludicrous to me, 'hey look at my Cosina lens that cost me 10x as much because it has a fake German name ring on it'. _________________ I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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Mos6502
Joined: 20 Jun 2011 Posts: 960 Location: Austin
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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Mos6502 wrote:
Phenix jc wrote: |
IMHO it doesn't look like a Mamiya. The Pancolar is not the opposite. |
You have a German made Pancolar. There was a Japanese made "Pancolar" that appeared in the late 1960s, which more frequently appears with the name Exaktar on it. That was the lens I was referring to, not to the genuine German Pancolar. Edit: more on this lens here: http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=54454
The Edixagon lens appears around the same time, which is not surprising considering the way German lens makers were going in that era.
As for the other Edixa lens, Edixar, etc. they may postdate Edixa camera production. The Edixa name, like the Miranda name was used on products for years after the original company called it quits.
Last edited by Mos6502 on Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:53 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009 Posts: 398 Location: France
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Posted: Sat Jun 29, 2013 11:46 pm Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
Pancolart wrote: |
Compare the rear of the lenses. While Mamiya (possibly Tomioka) is nearly the same as Edixagon, they have nothing to do with Pancolar. Moreover given Pancolar is IMHO quite older.
(...)
While Mamiya (possibly Tomioka) made lenses like Edixagon & Edixar were used on Wirgin genuine Germany made SLR cameras. |
Pancolart wrote: |
Plastic A/M swith is shaped round but other have it just like Edixagon.
Yashinon-DS 1.9/50mm
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© Sylvain Halgand :
Yes Pancolart, you were and are right, the rear is similar.
(the front and the "feeling" is not)
(the rear of the Pancolar is obviously different, rare Primotar style)
So the new trail is now for a Japanese Tomioka.
The sound "on" and not "ar", may be a sign of a better level of performance, as is the case with Schneider-Kreuznach. _________________ "Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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Mos6502
Joined: 20 Jun 2011 Posts: 960 Location: Austin
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Posted: Sun Jun 30, 2013 12:12 am Post subject: |
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Mos6502 wrote:
One more thing which has been pointed out elsewhere, German made lenses for the Edixa always retain their own branding, but with an edixa prefix. Edixa-Xenon, Edixa-Travelon, Edixa-Quinon, Edixa-Westromat, etc.
There is also something interesting to consider, that while outwardly the Edixagon shows some minor differences to major brand Japanese lenses - the differences between the Edixagon and German lenses of the same era are much more noticeable and basic. |
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