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Auto Revuenon 55mm F1.4
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PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 6:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hello Stephan! Can you expand on the concept of outperforming the CY 1.4/50mm Zeiss. I am specially interested in how these both lenses compare.

Thanks.
Pablo.


stevemark wrote:


Once seviced and fully functional again, I am pretty sure the newer Auto Revuenon with its "space age" focusing rubber grip will outperform both the Canon 1.2/50mm L as well as the Zeiss CY 1.4/50mm. It clearly outperforms lenses wuch as the Minolta MC-II 1.4/58mm.

S


PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 8:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Internet lore says that the 55/1.4 Tomioka is a Japanese version of the Carl Zeiss Jena Pancolar 55mm 1/1.4. This came out of the cooperation between Zeiss and Yashica (who owned Tomioka and in fact Tomioka probably lives on today as the optics division of Kyocera (acquired Yashica in 83)).

Here is a comparison between Pancolar, Rikenon and Takumar. (but sadly the Rikenon seems to be a bit different so it doesn't say al lot even though bokeh looks similar. The Pancolar does have a clearly larger front element than the other ones so it is not a 1:1 copy if it is a true story.


PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
D1N0 wrote:
Internet lore says that the 55/1.4 Tomioka is a Japanese version of the Carl Zeiss Jena Pancolar 55mm 1/1.4. This came out of the cooperation between Zeiss and Yashica (who owned Tomioka and in fact Tomioka probably lives on today as the optics division of Kyocera (acquired Yashica in 83)).


Well, that's the Internet where a lot of nonsense is spread and repeated all over. Please note that cooperation was active between Carl Zeiss Oberkochen (RFA) and Yashica, Carl Zeiss Jena (RDA) actually had nothing to do with that so that Pancolar part is pure fiction Wink


PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 10:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The internet is a bitch indeed. There is a Diagram for the Porst 55/1.4 on allphotolenses. It is a 7/6 design. The Pancolar is a 7/5 design. But is it really 7/6?



The diagram is the same one as the Super-Takumar 50mm 1.4 from Pentaxforums. They just ripped it... So is it an 7/6 or a 7/5? I guess i'll have to take my Porst apart :p


PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Another interesting video comparison between a Chinon Tomioka and Cosinon 55/1.4 Clearly different lens mechanics, but nothing definitive about the optics:

https://youtu.be/86zqNQJTNy4


and here is an example of a Tomioka branded revuenon that clearly has the Cosina design (lollipop, silver mount part front facing aperture blades) Compare it with the Cosina in the video.

https://www.marktplaats.nl/v/audio-tv-en-foto/fotocamera-s-analoog/m1795634389-tomioka-revuenon-55mm-f1-4-m42-mount




PostPosted: Sat Apr 16, 2022 10:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
D1N0 wrote:
The internet is a bitch indeed. There is a Diagram for the Porst 55/1.4 on allphotolenses. It is a 7/6 design. The Pancolar is a 7/5 design. But is it really 7/6?


I think that's a misinformation. According to my research already some years ago only the 55mm/1.2 with different brandings such as Yashica or Porst are 7/6 designs whereas all the 55mm/1.4 are 7/5.
Different story for 50mm lenses, here some of the F1.4 ones are 7/6 (Pentax, Minolta MD II/III, Zeiss, Canon, Yashica, maybe more).


PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
pabeu wrote:
Hello Stephan! Can you expand on the concept of outperforming the CY 1.4/50mm Zeiss. I am specially interested in how these both lenses compare.

Thanks.
Pablo.


Sure! However I'll first have to clean the aperture of the "space age" Revuenon (Tomioka-made, according to others). It's stuck wide open right now ... Wink

S


PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
well,

was that Tomi 50/1.4 lens design from somewhere early/mid '60 ?
even before aquired by Yashica?

If YES then all that Zeiss fairytale drops like it's hot,
cause C / Y collab went ahead in mid '70,
thus enter the ML series.


PostPosted: Sun Apr 17, 2022 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
alex_d wrote:
well,

was that Tomi 50/1.4 lens design from somewhere early/mid '60 ?
even before aquired by Yashica?

If YES then all that Zeiss fairytale drops like it's hot,
cause C / Y collab went ahead in mid '70,
thus enter the ML series.


I think that "Zeiss fairytale" may have its origins in the "taunusreiter.de" website. Around 2005 (or even earlier) Frank Mechelhoff had written that the Rolleinar 1.4/55mm (produced by Mamiya) was in fact based on the Zeiss Oberkochen Planar 1.4/55mm. It seems his information came from Tronnier himself, but Mechelhoff's writing isn't especially precise.

In later years the "1.4/55mm / Zeiss / Tomioka" story became more and more abundant, but I have no idea whether it's true or not. Mechelhoff has been writing that Zeiss didn't renew their patent on the Zeiss 1.4/55mm, and therefore from about 1972 on the Zeiss Oberkochen 1.4/55mm could be produced (copied) by other companies.

S
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