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Nelson
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 234
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 Posted: Mon May 12, 2008 6:54 pm Post subject: 300mm battle |
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here is a battle with
Tamron 670au, 54B, Tair 3S and Sigma 70-300 AF APO
I am not satisfied with this test. I will try to find a better subject.
http://323i.e30.free.fr/galerie/MF/300/
_________________
DSLR : EOS 350D
Pentacon 50 f1.8, 135 f2.8, 200 f4; TAIR 3S ; Helios 44/2 ; Rollei Planar 50 f1.8, Distagon 35 f2.8; Meyer Optik Orestegor 200 f4 Orestegor 300 f4; Tamron 24mm f2.5 01B, 300mm f5.6 670Au, 300mm f5.6 SP 54B, 500mm f8 SP 55B; Yashica 55mm f2.
Canon 100macro f2.8 ....USM  |
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voe
Joined: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 75
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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| Posted: Thu May 15, 2008 6:21 am Post subject: Re: 300mm battle |
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WOW, the Tair-3S looks so much better than the rest.
_________________
Body: Pentax K10D Prime lenses: Mir-1, Pentax-A 50mm f/1.7,Mamyia Secor 55mm f/1.8, MC Pentacon 50mm 1.8, Helios-77M-4, Helios-44-2, Volna-9, Vivitar 55mm f/2.8 Macro (1:1), Jupiter-9, Jupiter-37A MC, Tair-3S. |
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luisalegria
Joined: 07 Mar 2008
Posts: 821
Location: San Francisco, USA
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| Posted: Fri May 16, 2008 8:34 pm Post subject: |
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Ditto on the Tair.
I have 7 300mm lenses myself, though none of them are "quality".
I might give this a try. |
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Sandie
Joined: 05 May 2008
Posts: 147
Location: Austria
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| Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 1:40 pm Post subject: |
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How do you think about Pentacon 300/4 and CZJ 300/4 compared with above lenses?
_________________
Canon 350D + Pentax MZ10 + Pracktica BX20 + Mamiya 1000TL + Yashica TL Electro X + Yashica FR1 + Pentax ES II
Carl Zeiss Jena: Flektogon 20/f4, Flektogon 35/f2.4, Pancolar 50/f1.4, Pancolar 50/f1.8, Tessar 50/f2.8, Pancolar 80/f1.8, Sonnar 135/f3.5, Sonnar 135/f4, Sonnar 180/f2.8;
Pentacon: 50/f1.8, 135/f2.8, 200/f4, 300/f4;
Meyer: Orestegon 29/f2.8, Lydith 30/f3.5, Domiplan 50/f2.8, Trioplan 100/f2.8, Orestor 100/f2.8, Telemegor 250/f5.5;
Revuenon: 24/f4(Ennalyt), 28/f3.5(Ennalyt), 200/f3.5(Tomioka);
Yashica: 28/f2.8; 55/f1.2;
Soligor 135/f2.8; 35/f2.8;
Misc: Schacht 50/f2.8; Steinheil 135/f3.5; Mamiya 55/f1.4; Fujinon 135/f3.5; Tokina 70-220/f3.5; Tamron 28/f2.5; Helios 58/f2; Kiron 28/f2; Volna 80/f2.8; Mir 24M 35/f2;Carenar 85-210/f4.5; Olympus 50/f1.8; Chinon 35-80/f3.5-4.9; Pentax 55/f2; |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 14695
Location: Budapest,Hungary
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| Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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I have almost all lenses from above, every lens has different benefits.
My order is:
1) Tamron SP 300mm , Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 300
2) Pentacon 300mm , Tair 3s
_________________
Olympus E-1,Nikon FA,Pentax MX,Praktica VLC3,Olympus-OM2N,Yashica Eletro 35 GN,Exakta Varex IIb,BESA L,Yashica MAT 124G
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Carl Zeiss Jena:Flektogon 2.8/20mm,4/25mm,2.4/35,2.8/65mm,4.5/4cm Tessar, 8/500mm Fernobjektiv
Pancolar 1.4/55mm,1.8/50mm,1.8/80mm,Tessar 2.8/50mm,Biotar 2/58mm,1.5/75mm,1.5/7,5cm
Carl Zeiss: Sonnar 2.8/135,2.8/180mm,Tessar 4/135mm
Nikon: 3.5/20mm,2.8/28mm,1.4/35mm,1.4/50mm,1.2/50mm,2/50mm,1.8/105mm,2.5/105mm,4/200mm macro,4.5/300mm
Pentax: Pentax 1.2/50mm,1.8/85mm,4/200mm
Helios: Helios-40 1.5/8,5cm,Helios-44-1 2/58mm,Helios-44-2 2/58mm
Olympus OM: 3.5/18mm,3.5/21mm,1.4/50mm,3.5/55mm macro,2.8/135mm,2/90mm macro,35-70mm,60-250mm
Meyer: 4.5/35mm Primagon,Primoplan 1.9/58mm,1.9/75mm,2.8/100mm,Orestegor 2.8/135mm,4.5/40 Helioplan
Leica: 4/100 Macro Elmar,2.8/90 Elmarit last version
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Rob Leslie
Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 667
Location: UK Swindon
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| Posted: Fri May 30, 2008 10:47 pm Post subject: |
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| Attila wrote: | I have almost all lenses from above, every lens has different benefits.
My order is:
1) Tamron SP 300mm , Carl Zeiss Jena Sonnar 300
2) Pentacon 300mm , Tair 3s |
I have to go along with Attila.
1) Tamron SP f5.6 300mm.
Somebody once wrote this is the lens I judge all other 300mm lenses by. I agree.
I have owned/ or own the Tair, Pentacon, the Adaptall 1 Tamron 300mm Sigma APO 75-300 and Sigma APO 70-300 and Sigma APO 70-300 macro. The Tamron LD Di 70-300 + many. many others. I have tested all with the SP 300mm in real conditions and none come near it.
# 2) On my list would be the Tamron SP 60-300mm zoom at 300mm. A zoom that is better than many primes.
When it comes to the Tair I do believe one has to consider that for a lens to perform it has to be usable?
The Tair 300 Ps has many quality problems, internal flare not being the least of them. A real drop in quality if the light is anything but bright and clear with lots of contrast and then one comes to actually using it. The aperture control !!! The focus control !!! The weight and balance of the lens!!! No. This lens is great for doing a test from the window with but to take out and use !!!
Mine has been in the back of the cupboard for two or three years and that is were it will stay unless somebody wants to offer me £20 + about £15 P&P for it. Or collect from Swindon for £20 cash.
Our last 300mm lens test. The Pentacon f4 300mm, Sigma f4 100-300mm and the little Sigma f6.3 100-300mm, on that day we also had the SP f5.6 300mm and the SP 60-300mm.
After the test my friend Mike (Sigma f4 100-300mm) went straight onto ebay and got himself a Tamron SP 300mm. I hardly see it off his camera.
Both my friends on this picture are Nikon users and both now use Tamron Adaptall lenses although their Nikons can’t meter manual lenses.
I'm the scruffy guy picture right.
_________________
Pentax K10D & K100D. Many Tamron Adaptall SP lenses, Fujinon f4.5 400mm. A loved Lens Baby 2, Lubitel triplet +++ and many many film cameras. Mainly a Digital user.
http://roblesliephotography.blogspot.com |
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Richard_D
Joined: 21 Oct 2007
Posts: 2388
Location: Faversham Kent UK
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| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 1:08 pm Post subject: |
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Having used both the nikon ais 300mm (non-ED) and the Tamron SP I:zd say the Tamron has the slight edge at the loss of half a stop.
_________________
Richard
The interesting bit:
Nikkors: 20mm f2.8 AIS, 24mm f2.8 AIS, 28mm f2.8 AIS, 35mm f2 AIS, 50mm f1.4 AI, 50mm f1.48AI, 50m f2 AI,
55mm f3.5 AI'd, 105mm f4 AI, 135mm f2.8 AI'd, 135mm f3.5 AI'd, 200mm f4 AI'd .
Nikon E Series: 100mm f2.8 .
Soviet Nikon Mount: Zenitar 16mm f2.8, Arsat/arax/photex 85mm T&S f2.8 .
Other: Asahi Super Takumar 55 mm f2 (M42) ,Tamron 300mm f5.6 SP, Tamron 500mm f8 SP.
DSLR: Nikon D700. 35mm SLRsNikon FE, Pentax S1a.
TLR: Rolliecord II.
Sub-Minature: Pentax Auto 110, 18mm f2.8, 24mm f2.8, 50mm f2.8.
More to come... |
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LucisPictor
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 7222
Location: Oberhessen, Germany / Maidstone ('95-'96)
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| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 2:03 pm Post subject: |
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I only know the Tair and all I can say is that I think this lens rocks.
Your test seems to confirm that. But I do not know the SP300, though.
_________________
There are two kinds of people in the world: those who divide the world into two kinds of people, and those who don’t.
"Schnäppchenjäger" | "KAPCTEH" | "Karusutenu" | "Carsten" | T-shirt?
Cams in use: EOS 40D, EOS 350D, EOS500, Spotmatic SPII, Yashica-24, EXA I & 1c, Zenit EM; Oly 35RC,Minolta Hi-Matic E & F, Ricoh 500RF, Yashica Electro 35 GS, FED-3b and some others...
Lenses in use: Asahi Pentax: 2.8/28;3.5/35;1.4/50;1.7/50;2.8/105;28-80 | Canon (AF):1.8/50;17-85;75-300 | Former GDR: Pentacon 3.5/30; Pentaflex 1.8/50; CZJ 2.8/50; CZJ 4/135; Pentacon 4/200 | Fujinon: 43-75 | Hanimex: 3.5/23; 4/100;80-200 | Hoya: 25-42;80-205 | Kiron: 2/28;70-210 | Leica: Elmarit-R 2.8/35 | Mamiya: 1.8/55 | Minolta: 1.7/50 | Nikkor: 2.8/24;2/35;2/50;1.2/55;1.8/85;3.5/135 | West German: Ludwig 2.9/50; Meyer 2.8/100; Will 4.5/105; Schneider 3.5/135;Enna 3.5/135; Zeiss 4/135;Isco 4/135; Enna 4.5/240 | Olympus: 3.5/28;1.4/50;3.5/135 | Rikenon: 1.7/50;35-70 | Rollei/Voigtländer: 1.4/55;1.8/50 | Russian: Peleng3.5/8; Zenitar2.8/16; MIR2.8/37; Volna2.8/50; Industar3.5/50; Industar3.5/5cm; Helios2/50; Helios2/58; Volna2.8/80; Jupiter2/85; Kaleinar2.8/100;Tair2.8/135; Jupiter3.5/135; Jupiter4/135; Telear3.5/200; Jupiter4/200; Tair4.5/300;RF: Jupiter2.8/35;Industar2.8/53 | Sigma: 28-85;28-105(AF);17-70(AF) | Soligor: 28-105;35-200;70-220 | Tamron: 2.5/24;2.5/135;2.8/135;60-300;70-210 | Tokina: 28-105;80-200;12-24(AF);70-210(AF) | Vivitar: 3.5/17;2/24;2/28;2.5/28;2.8/28 | Yashica: 1.7/50;2/5cm | Other Japanese: Cosina3.8/20; Petri2.8/28; Albinar2.8/28; Porst1.8/35; 2.8/135; Weltblick3.5/135; Beroflex 8/500; Spiratone28-200; Maginon70-210
Green are the lenses I shoot the most.
More? http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=65
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 14695
Location: Budapest,Hungary
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| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 3:28 pm Post subject: |
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Tamron SP 300 in every feauture is lot better than Tair 300 as Rob said. If you think Tair is rock. Try one times better glasses, like Tamron SP 300mm or Nikkor 300mm f4.5 ED-IF or Carl Zeiss Tessar 300mm f4. Difference is really, really huge.
_________________
Olympus E-1,Nikon FA,Pentax MX,Praktica VLC3,Olympus-OM2N,Yashica Eletro 35 GN,Exakta Varex IIb,BESA L,Yashica MAT 124G
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl Zeiss Jena:Flektogon 2.8/20mm,4/25mm,2.4/35,2.8/65mm,4.5/4cm Tessar, 8/500mm Fernobjektiv
Pancolar 1.4/55mm,1.8/50mm,1.8/80mm,Tessar 2.8/50mm,Biotar 2/58mm,1.5/75mm,1.5/7,5cm
Carl Zeiss: Sonnar 2.8/135,2.8/180mm,Tessar 4/135mm
Nikon: 3.5/20mm,2.8/28mm,1.4/35mm,1.4/50mm,1.2/50mm,2/50mm,1.8/105mm,2.5/105mm,4/200mm macro,4.5/300mm
Pentax: Pentax 1.2/50mm,1.8/85mm,4/200mm
Helios: Helios-40 1.5/8,5cm,Helios-44-1 2/58mm,Helios-44-2 2/58mm
Olympus OM: 3.5/18mm,3.5/21mm,1.4/50mm,3.5/55mm macro,2.8/135mm,2/90mm macro,35-70mm,60-250mm
Meyer: 4.5/35mm Primagon,Primoplan 1.9/58mm,1.9/75mm,2.8/100mm,Orestegor 2.8/135mm,4.5/40 Helioplan
Leica: 4/100 Macro Elmar,2.8/90 Elmarit last version
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Nelson
Joined: 06 Jan 2008
Posts: 234
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| Posted: Sat May 31, 2008 8:24 pm Post subject: |
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I am agree the Tair is heavy, but i was able to use it like any other lens.
But for a long photoshoot, it is sure the SP is better to use.
I found lots of chromatic aberation with 300SP, it is unbelievable since this lense has specific lense to avoir CA!
During my photoshoots SP has more CA than TAIR.
Moreover, i do not think than SP is sharper than TAIR.
I will show you, how i focus with tair 3S, it is not complicated. That is not the case for aperture, but i must admit than i use it at F4.5 most of the time.
I love SP 54B, but if i had to choose between all my 300s, i will choose the TAIR.
Today i bought a Meyer Optik 300 f4. It looks fine and may be heavier than TAIR
_________________
DSLR : EOS 350D
Pentacon 50 f1.8, 135 f2.8, 200 f4; TAIR 3S ; Helios 44/2 ; Rollei Planar 50 f1.8, Distagon 35 f2.8; Meyer Optik Orestegor 200 f4 Orestegor 300 f4; Tamron 24mm f2.5 01B, 300mm f5.6 670Au, 300mm f5.6 SP 54B, 500mm f8 SP 55B; Yashica 55mm f2.
Canon 100macro f2.8 ....USM |
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Rob Leslie
Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 667
Location: UK Swindon
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| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:27 am Post subject: |
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I have to agree 100% with Attila.
If I had never tried anything else I would also think the Tair was great. I might also think it was great if I didn’t recognise its obvious optical faults.
I have found the opposite to Nelson.
CA on the Tamron SP 300 (And most of the Tamrons) is very well controlled. If under extremes it does occur it is easily dealt with.
CA on the Tair is uncontrollable and can often when shooting even slightly into the light be a blanket effect of red and blue CA which can’t be dealt with. When shooting into the light the Tair always suffers internal flair. This at best only shows as a lack of contrast, at worse it become a CA Haze.
Buy a Tair cheap (£10-20) only use in bright conditions with the sun behind you and avoid any highlights that might flair and it will give fantastic results. However most people want a lens that will perform in most conditions without problems.
I did hear that the photographer David Hamilton used a Tair 300mm for many of his high key ‘Romantic Glowing’ outdoor nudes he became famous for.
I must admit the lens was ideal for that.
_________________
Pentax K10D & K100D. Many Tamron Adaptall SP lenses, Fujinon f4.5 400mm. A loved Lens Baby 2, Lubitel triplet +++ and many many film cameras. Mainly a Digital user.
http://roblesliephotography.blogspot.com |
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Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 11793
Location: West Emilia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 8:26 am Post subject: |
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| Rob Leslie wrote: |
I did hear that the photographer David Hamilton used a Tair 300mm for many of his high key ‘Romantic Glowing’ outdoor nudes he became famous for. |
Then I must have bought the copy that he used.
Someone must have inverted the front element by design. Every damned photo that I take looks like one from Hamilton calendars.
I was about to throw the lens in the bin. Now I should perhaps try with some young aaa models and make a lot of money out of that (to buy me a Schneider large format system!) 
_________________
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ХОРИОС-61 ( ώρεος ) : Lens sana in corpore sano
Main Tools:
LENSES: Carl Zeiss, Leitz, Soviet, old Nikkors, others.
DSLR: Canon EOS 5D, 50D. SLR: Contax AX, RX, 167MT; Voigtländer Bessaflex TM; Praktica FX2; Nikon FM2, F70.
RANGEFINDERS: Contax G2, Kiev-4, Voigtlaender Bessa-T, Canonette QL17. MEDIUM FORMAT: Pentacon 6, Zeiss Super Ikonta, Agfa Record II.
Read Full List HERE
www.timelessphotography.eu
www.oriofoto.net
"Freedom is the right to tell people what they do not want to hear. " (George Orwell)
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Rob Leslie
Joined: 20 Mar 2007
Posts: 667
Location: UK Swindon
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| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 9:35 am Post subject: |
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| Orio wrote: | | Rob Leslie wrote: |
I did hear that the photographer David Hamilton used a Tair 300mm for many of his high key ‘Romantic Glowing’ outdoor nudes he became famous for. |
Then I must have bought the copy that he used.
Someone must have inverted the front element by design. Every damned photo that I take looks like one from Hamilton calendars.
I was about to throw the lens in the bin. Now I should perhaps try with some young aaa models and make a lot of money out of that (to buy me a Schneider large format system!) |
I am so pleased to read your post.
My true opinion of the Tair 300 ps is 'Throw it in the bin' or make good use of it as a door stop.
I just can't understand how people rate it highly.
I have been trying to get £25 for mine but nobody will even offer me £10.
PS. I have 3 f4.5 300mm lenses. All cheapo.
The Tair-3 PhS. Rubbish
A Sankor f4.5 300mm. Also rubbish but slightly better than the Tair
The Rubinar f4.5 (True about f5.6) 300mm. An excellent lens. Very sharp and nice to use BUT a mirror lens which does have rather big donuts if you get it wrong.
There are simple ways to get round the donuts the simple way is to only use the lens when background are OK (No highlights etc) The other is to do an extra shot for the background and blend it in.
_________________
Pentax K10D & K100D. Many Tamron Adaptall SP lenses, Fujinon f4.5 400mm. A loved Lens Baby 2, Lubitel triplet +++ and many many film cameras. Mainly a Digital user.
http://roblesliephotography.blogspot.com |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 14695
Location: Budapest,Hungary
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| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 10:31 am Post subject: |
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Seems you had bad copy from Tair, mine Tair had very good optical quality. It was very unconvience for me only.
http://www.mflenses.com/gallery/v/russian_lens/tair/tair_3s-300mm_f4_5/
_________________
Olympus E-1,Nikon FA,Pentax MX,Praktica VLC3,Olympus-OM2N,Yashica Eletro 35 GN,Exakta Varex IIb,BESA L,Yashica MAT 124G
-------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Carl Zeiss Jena:Flektogon 2.8/20mm,4/25mm,2.4/35,2.8/65mm,4.5/4cm Tessar, 8/500mm Fernobjektiv
Pancolar 1.4/55mm,1.8/50mm,1.8/80mm,Tessar 2.8/50mm,Biotar 2/58mm,1.5/75mm,1.5/7,5cm
Carl Zeiss: Sonnar 2.8/135,2.8/180mm,Tessar 4/135mm
Nikon: 3.5/20mm,2.8/28mm,1.4/35mm,1.4/50mm,1.2/50mm,2/50mm,1.8/105mm,2.5/105mm,4/200mm macro,4.5/300mm
Pentax: Pentax 1.2/50mm,1.8/85mm,4/200mm
Helios: Helios-40 1.5/8,5cm,Helios-44-1 2/58mm,Helios-44-2 2/58mm
Olympus OM: 3.5/18mm,3.5/21mm,1.4/50mm,3.5/55mm macro,2.8/135mm,2/90mm macro,35-70mm,60-250mm
Meyer: 4.5/35mm Primagon,Primoplan 1.9/58mm,1.9/75mm,2.8/100mm,Orestegor 2.8/135mm,4.5/40 Helioplan
Leica: 4/100 Macro Elmar,2.8/90 Elmarit last version
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voe
Joined: 19 Apr 2008
Posts: 75
Location: Melbourne, Australia
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| Posted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 11:54 am Post subject: |
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We all know that most old lenses are not sharp wide open, but this baby gets sharp enough when stopped down from f/5.6 to f/8. Actually I don't think mine is soft wide open.
For those of you who are not happy with you Tair-3S I believe you maybe have a bad copy. You know how it was with QC in old USSR, or may be the lens was mistreated by the previous owner, who knows..
Anyway the following links are 100% photos no resize or sharpening taken with my Tair-3S.
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2310/2507916967_9bff487bd7_o.jpg
http://farm3.static.flickr.com/2390/2508731650_20e53b7916_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3033/2508720514_631b4aa512_o.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3226/2508033781_c0f4b78609_o.jpg
Yes, the lens is not lightweight at 1.2kg but for the money I can't complain.
I also think it has an interesting rendering.
_________________
Body: Pentax K10D Prime lenses: Mir-1, Pentax-A 50mm f/1.7,Mamyia Secor 55mm f/1.8, MC Pentacon 50mm 1.8, Helios-77M-4, Helios-44-2, Volna-9, Vivitar 55mm f/2.8 Macro (1:1), Jupiter-9, Jupiter-37A MC, Tair-3S. |
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