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What do Sony have planned for the NEX range?
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 11:31 am    Post subject: What do Sony have planned for the NEX range? Reply with quote

So, now the A7 and A7r are here, and the A3000 as well, we have to ask, what is going to fall in-between the low-end pretty crappy A3000 and the high-end FF A7r?

As an owner of an aging NEX-3 I've been waiting to see what is going to come along that will be a worthwhile upgrade. The A7 and A7r are far out of my budget, and the A3000 is not attractive due to obsolete lo-res LCD and EVF.

So is Sony going to release some mid-priced NEX models or am I going to have to buy an SLT-A65?

What would people like to see, spec-wise from Sony in a mid-range NEX?

Personally, I don't see the need for 24mp, and 36mp is total overkill, the 20mp AS-C sensor of the A3000 would be more than adequate for me, but not in that crappy camera.

I only shoot RAW so I don't want or need any of the fancy processing that the A7s have such as region-based NR. I don't care about hundreds of contrast and phase AF points either.

Maybe the A7 body with 20 and 24mp APS-C sensors? A3 and A5 perhaps?

Oh, and will they please put a damn cable release socket on the NEX, that's always been a MAJOR omission.


PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 12:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just read about the A7 on the amateur photographer website and must say it sounds amazing. (Looks pretty ugly though!) Seems fairly competitively priced especially when the price drops after a few months.

Sadly my old Nikon D3000 is on the way out so I've been looking for a replacement. If I was to go full frame, the new Sony cameras look a good deal especially as I could use my old Nikkors with them.

I agree with you about megapixel overkill though. My D3000 only has 10 mp and that's always been enough to print the Japanese size "wide-yotsugiri" (10in by 14.5in) which is big enough for me.


PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Quote:
Maybe the A7 body with 20 and 24mp APS-C sensors? A3 and A5 perhaps?


Well, it's called the Nex-7 Very Happy


PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

the nex5 is still alive even if they are running out of letters Very Happy and as far I can rememeber the plan a new nex7


PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 4:22 am    Post subject: Re: What do Sony have planned for the NEX range? Reply with quote

iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
What would people like to see, spec-wise from Sony in a mid-range NEX?


I'm pretty happy with my NEX-7 and so far I'm not considering an upgrade to the new A7/A7r.
What will make me to upgrade to a new NEX-7, spec-wise , would be:

-better sensor behavior with wide angle rangefinder lenses and better IQ in low-light at high ISO
-better EVF (better low-light behavior and refreshing rate, tiltable)
-IBIS
-WIFI and the possibility to install external applications
-universal flash mount
-cable release, of course
-better electronic zooming for manual focus (zoomed image should be stabilized in software and should be of a better quality, you should be able to see both the zoomed image and the entire picture in the EVF simultaneously)
-the LCD screen should tilt horizontally too (for portrait orientation framing)
-ergonomically, I think that the distance between the hand grip and the lens mount should be a little greater.

- sensor shift auto-focus will make it a dream-camera.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 2:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Not sure te A65 is a good direction to go in as it can only take M42 lenses on top of Sony/Minolta AF mount glass (unless you buy expesnive Leitax replacement mounts or want to butcher all your lenses yourself).

How about the Nex-6?


PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 6:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, what do you want in NEX to make the update worthwhile? You can get slightly better sensor, that's already available. There won't be an earthshuttering sensor upgrade since there wasn't a huge sensor progress since nex-3/5. Personally, what I would like is the NEX in original form factor with good controls, however NEX-6/7 seems to be cameras in that direction.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 17, 2013 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ManualFocus-G wrote:
Not sure te A65 is a good direction to go in as it can only take M42 lenses on top of Sony/Minolta AF mount glass (unless you buy expesnive Leitax replacement mounts or want to butcher all your lenses yourself).

How about the Nex-6?


Well, I have 4/35-70, 4/70-210, 3.5-4.5/28-85 and 1.7/50 Minolta AF lenses, all excellent.

It's the camera that attracts me, the EVF and LCD are both fantastic and unlike the NEX, it's not tiny and hard to hold with fiddly controls. As well as the NEX-3 has served me, I've never liked it in ergonomic terms. Buying an old Nikon D50 has just reminded me how badthe NEX is ergonomically, the nice big grip on the D50, larger size, bigger less fiddly controls, it's a proper camera whereas the NEX-3 is a glorified compact.

I was hoping the A3000 would be the upgrade for me, but it's, imho, a total piece of crap, feels cheap and nasty, the controls are fiddly, the buttons feel wobbly and fragile, the EVF and LCD are obsolete lo-res rubbish, the whole thing is a disaster. The 20mp sensor and the rest of the imaging system is probably great, but that's irrelevant when it's contained in a great big turd of a camera.

Maybe Sony will produce an e-mount camera with the screen and evf of the A65 with either the 20 or 24mp APS-C sensor and good, robust build quality. If they don't, then the A65 looks like my best option. Or maybe Samsung have something interesting in the pipeline?

Anyways, I'm going to upgrade before spring, and the A65 is available for just over 400ukp body only, it's a hell of a good camera for that price, wheres the A3000 is just under 300ukp and as I said, to me, it's a turd. Samsung's NX20 is nice, but the sensor is a couple of years old now and there are other things about it I don't like.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 5:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well sorry to say, there won't be any more Nex cameras.

Sony is dropping the "Nex" name altogether.

Seriously.

In only 50 years our Nexes will be classics. I do think the classic nex-5 will go down in history as one of the true groundbreaking cameras of this era.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I would say that one of the best cameras sony has made in a long time is the A57 that is a really good camera, and will go down as a classic the sensor is splendid, and you can pick one up with lens from sony refurbish for 300


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'd suggest a NEX3N, F3, 5N, 5R, the later 3 with the optional EVF or NEX6. Amazing cameras, considering what they offer they cost very little and sensors of even newer cameras hardly offer anything more


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 6:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

While I want another e-mount camera, I don't want another NEX, too small, not enough controls, for me, the only good things about my NEX-3 are the sensor and the screen, the rest of it I don't like much. Having to go into the menus to change ISO or many other settings is really annoying. The A3000 could have been the camera for me, but it's just a NEX in a big empty plastic box and the EF and screen on it is a bad joke. I don't understand what's going on with Sony, other makers offer far nicer mirrorless cameras - Samsung produce the NX5/10/11/20 series that is more like a 'real' camera, Panasonic hav a series of M4/3 modes that are camera-like too, even Olympus have two camera-like models.

Realistically, the A7 and A7r are far beyond my budget and the A3000 is a turd, so I want to see if there is anything from Sony before spring that will suit me. What I want is a mirrorless camera that handles like a DSLR. My old Nikon d50 is far, far more pleasurable to use than my NEX-3, it fits in my hands far better, the controls are far better.

Basically, I would like a version of the SLT-A65 without the mirror and an E-mount, that was in the same pricing range as the A65. Please don't tell me the NEX-7 is that camera, it isn't, it hasn't got the size, ergonomics and controls I want.

I'm going to upgrade in spring, if Sony hasn't released something closer to what I want by then, then it will be an A65, or maybe Samsung will produce something I like, the NX20 is a very nice camera, but it costs as much as the A65 and is inferior in sensor, EVF and a few other areas. I worry that Sony has lost the plot, the A3000 ad A58 are cheap and nasty quality, good sensors in rotten bodies, I've never been impressed with Sony's SLR bodies, ever since I owned an A100 and A200, the A65 isn't all that great in build quality either, but it's not too bad, the A58 and A3000 are unacceptably cheap and nasty for me, which is a shame because their 20mp sensor seems like a good sensor handicapped by poor cameras.


Last edited by iangreenhalgh1 on Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:39 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
...Having to go into the menus to change ISO ..is really annoying...


are you sure that this really is necessary Ian?
that would really annoy me too. On my NEX5N I have ISO programmed to be accessed with the biggest button, the one in the center of the wheel. Layout and access to settings on my Ricoh I think are pretty much as good as it gets, but when using manual lenses I actually have access to the settings I really need ( shoot mode, ISO, drive mode, enlargement + 4 more programmed to be accessed through hard buttons ) on the NEX5N too, pretty much never need to go into the menu


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a NEX-3, as far as I know, you have to go into the menu to change ISO, I'm not aware of any other way of doing it.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 8:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
I have a NEX-3, as far as I know, you have to go into the menu to change ISO, I'm not aware of any other way of doing it.


now that kind of shocked me, so I had a go at google and found this:
If I understand right with the original firmware of the first two NEX, NEX3 and NEX5, it really was necessary to go into the menu for changing ISO, but that Sony soon corrected this by offering a firmware update that allows hard buttons to be programmed also for direct ISO access, please have a look:
http://www.luminous-landscape.com/reviews/cameras/sony_nex_firmware_update.shtml

in case your firmware really is the original, here the update: http://www.sony.co.uk/support/en/product/NEX-3/updates


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kuuan, you are right (as always). SONY made a software update, and now you can set up your NEX so that the central button gives access to ISO, WB, and DR/HDR. Still, if you do so, you have to go through menu in order to change the shooting mode. NEX control system is rotten, I can go on forever about all the annoyances that I have with it. It is certainly not conceived as a serious photographic tool. On the other hand, it has a number of advantages that are hard to get elsewhere.

I think the form factor of NEX-5 is brilliant: easily pocketable body with a great grip, LCD is great, sensor is great, the price is ridiculously low especially if one buys second hand. The only thing it lacks (for me) are the control dials and proper hot shoe.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fermy wrote:
kuuan, you are right (as always)....


thank's Laughing

fermy wrote:
SONY made a software update, and now you can set up your NEX so that the central button gives access to ISO, WB, and DR/HDR. Still, if you do so, you have to go through menu in order to change the shooting mode. NEX control system is rotten, I can go on forever about all the annoyances that I have with it. It is certainly not conceived as a serious photographic tool. On the other hand, it has a number of advantages that are hard to get elsewhere.

I think the form factor of NEX-5 is brilliant: easily pocketable body with a great grip, LCD is great, sensor is great, the price is ridiculously low especially if one buys second hand. The only thing it lacks (for me) are the control dials and proper hot shoe.


after the update, isn't it the same with the NEX3 and NEX 5 than with the NEX5N?
on my 5N I have set the button to the right of the central button to access the shooting mode. Sure I'd prefer the dedicated wheel as on NEX6, but find it reasonably well useable as it is


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian, you need to set the central wheel to fast access to the settings you need

Update firmware if needed

then go to menu, setup
Soft key c setting change to custom
I have mine set to white balance, ISO, and metering mode
But you can choose
AF area, WB , Metering Mode, FLASH COMP, DRO /AUTO HDR, CREATIVE STYLE

Once set press the middle button on the wheel and left and right to go to the options turn wheel to select them


PostPosted: Fri Oct 18, 2013 10:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cheers guys, I'll check if I hve that update, I did update my firmware ages ago to get focus peaking.

fermy wrote:
kuuan, you are right (as always). SONY made a software update, and now you can set up your NEX so that the central button gives access to ISO, WB, and DR/HDR. Still, if you do so, you have to go through menu in order to change the shooting mode. NEX control system is rotten, I can go on forever about all the annoyances that I have with it. It is certainly not conceived as a serious photographic tool. On the other hand, it has a number of advantages that are hard to get elsewhere.

I think the form factor of NEX-5 is brilliant: easily pocketable body with a great grip, LCD is great, sensor is great, the price is ridiculously low especially if one buys second hand. The only thing it lacks (for me) are the control dials and proper hot shoe.


This sums things up really, my NEX has a great screen, great IQ, it's very cheap, it fits in my pocket with certain lenses attached.

However, I find it very limiting as a serious photographic tool, just simple things like no cable release, poor control system.

It was buying a Nikon D50 that did it for me, it reminded me how much I prefer a 'proper' camera,I just find the D50 so much more pleasurable to use, it feels so much better in my hands, the controls are so much easier to use. Of course, it's obsolete, the screen is tiny and lo-res, the sensor is ancient etc etc. But I really enjoy using it.

My big problem with most DSLRs is that they have terrible, small, dim, crappy reflex systems. The D50 is actually quite good, it's quite a decent size and quite bight, the screen is matte enough to focus with and the electronic range finder really does work.

What I'm not liking about the new Sony consumer level cameras is the flimsy, low quality build, and the cost-cutting in key areas. The A58, they have put on a crappy 430k screen and a ridiculous flimsy plastic mount, the A3000 is even worse, I've already ragged on that camera at length.

Of course, it's not just Sony, Canon have been guilty of producing their fair share of flimsy crap, the EF II 1.8/50 primarily, just look how many of them are on ebay where the optical block has just fallen out, the EF-S 18-55 is junk too, had three of them, AF died on all three, I've seen cheap children's toys that put them to shame in terms of robustness and build quality.

I'm just not going to spend my money on this sort of flimsy junk, so maybe I'm going to have to settle for buying a secondhand, several years old semi-pro camera just because it's well built. I don't get why Sony has to make their new cameras so crappy when they were able to build the NEX-3 to be robust and nice quality. I've used mine a hell of a lot, I've dropped it on rocks three times, it still works fine, all the buttons still work as they should, it's well made.

What I want is for Sony to produce an e-mount equivalent of the Samsung NX20 or the Lumix GH-3, is that too much to ask? The A3000 could have been that camera,but they made it flimsy, poor quality and put very obsolete crappy screen and EVF on it.


PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 3:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kuuan wrote:


after the update, isn't it the same with the NEX3 and NEX 5 than with the NEX5N?
on my 5N I have set the button to the right of the central button to access the shooting mode. Sure I'd prefer the dedicated wheel as on NEX6, but find it reasonably well useable as it is


No, it's not entirely the same, unless they've made another update that I am not aware of. The buttons around the wheel are not programmable on NEX-3/5, so you have to press the menu button and then change the mode in the menu. By itself this is not a tragedy (although annoying) since most of the time, when you press the menu button you have the shooting mode menu active. However, you also need to do various other things via menu, like delete pictures from the card and select "Sunny weather" LCD brightness or switch between jpeg and RAW if you want to do HDR. Bottom line, it's an idiotic interface for someone who uses the full camera functionality.

PS. Ian, if you want a cable release, NEX-5 has a wireless remote. The swap NEX-3 -> 5 would probably cost you next to nothing.


PostPosted: Sat Oct 19, 2013 7:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fermy wrote:
kuuan wrote:


after the update, isn't it the same with the NEX3 and NEX 5 than with the NEX5N?
on my 5N I have set the button to the right of the central button to access the shooting mode. Sure I'd prefer the dedicated wheel as on NEX6, but find it reasonably well useable as it is


No, it's not entirely the same, unless they've made another update that I am not aware of. The buttons around the wheel are not programmable on NEX-3/5, so you have to press the menu button and then change the mode in the menu. By itself this is not a tragedy (although annoying) since most of the time, when you press the menu button you have the shooting mode menu active. However, you also need to do various other things via menu, like delete pictures from the card and select "Sunny weather" LCD brightness or switch between jpeg and RAW if you want to do HDR. Bottom line, it's an idiotic interface for someone who uses the full camera functionality.

PS. Ian, if you want a cable release, NEX-5 has a wireless remote. The swap NEX-3 -> 5 would probably cost you next to nothing.


thank you very much fermy for the clarification.
Yes, NEX interface is amazingly bad. I feel great resistance against pressing the menu button. If I have to I try to take it as a sport and to feel amused Wink I am rather successful at that because gratefully, the way I set up my 5N, I very rarely have to use it.