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Sony a7(r) versus a n other FF camera
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 8:59 am    Post subject: Sony a7(r) versus a n other FF camera Reply with quote
I see there are lots of examples shots shared using the new Sony a7(r) with mf lenses, which is great and nice to see. The a7(r) looks to be a really good camera and the advantages of it's smaller size will be very handy for some people/situations.

But has anyone yet compared the performance of these cameras to another FF camera, while using the same lens?

eg: the a7 + Planar 50/1.7 compared to Canon 5D Mkll + Planar 50/1.7
These two cameras are both full frame, have similar megapixel count, so can anyone compare them like this?


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
edited

Last edited by bernhardas on Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:08 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
bernhardas wrote:
Check out the lens rental blog.

A7r beats any other cam with same lens. In the center by a clear margin of about 10-15%. At the corners with a very small improvement.

Tests are ongoing.

Thanks, I looked at the blog and yes, the numbers all look better with the a7.

But, I would still like to see how the cameras compare 'out in the wild', especially with some of our exotic glass Wink


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have a 6D and a7. I find the 6d easier to focus and is cleaner at high iso.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
ManualFocus-G wrote:
I have a 6D and a7. I find the 6d easier to focus and is cleaner at high iso.

That's interesting, thanks for that G Very Happy

Have you ever tried shooting with the same lens and the two bodies, side by side?


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have a Canon FTb but haven't pitted it against the A7 yet.
I'll have to wait until I get an A7 Laughing


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
ManualFocus-G wrote:
I have a 6D and a7. I find the 6d easier to focus and is cleaner at high iso.

What, exactly, do you mean by "easier to focus"?


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 2:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Steve Huff compares Nikon D800 against A7R, but not with the same lens.

http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2013/12/16/the-sony-a7r-vs-the-nikon-d800e-by-andrew-paquette/


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nordentro wrote:
Steve Huff compares Nikon D800 against A7R, but not with the same lens.

http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2013/12/16/the-sony-a7r-vs-the-nikon-d800e-by-andrew-paquette/

I don't really understand the reasoning there, two different sensors and two different lenses. What is he comparing, lenses or sensors? Either way, it's not a level playing field so the exercise seems pointless to me. Surprised


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 3:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
SonicScot wrote:
Nordentro wrote:
Steve Huff compares Nikon D800 against A7R, but not with the same lens.

http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2013/12/16/the-sony-a7r-vs-the-nikon-d800e-by-andrew-paquette/

I don't really understand the reasoning there, two different sensors and two different lenses. What is he comparing, lenses or sensors? Either way, it's not a level playing field so the exercise seems pointless to me. Surprised


I agree, it is like comparing apples and bananas Wink


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
some google results ( there are more )
http://www.cameraegg.org/high-iso-sony-a7r-vs-a7-vs-5d-mark-iii-vs-d800e-vs-pentax-645d-vs-rx1r/
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1247692/0
http://www.cameralabs.com/reviews/Sony_Alpha_A7r/verdict.shtml
http://www.digitalcameraworld.com/2013/10/18/sony-a7r-vs-nikon-d800-which-full-frame-camera-should-you-buy/


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
some google results ( there are more )
http://www.cameraegg.org/high-iso-sony-a7r-vs-a7-vs-5d-mark-iii-vs-d800e-vs-pentax-645d-vs-rx1r/
http://www.fredmiranda.com/forum/topic/1247692/0
http://www.cameralabs.com/reviews/Sony_Alpha_A7r/verdict.shtml
http://www.digitalcameraworld.com/2013/10/18/sony-a7r-vs-nikon-d800-which-full-frame-camera-should-you-buy/

Those links are all well and good in comparing cameras but not one of them answers my question.
What I'd like to see is two different ff cameras using the exact same lens, then compare the resulting photos. The photos should be taken outside of a studio environment too, just as we all would be using them.

eg, a7 v Canon 5D Mkll with both cameras using the same copy of a 'good' lens, may I suggest a Zeiss, any Zeiss, as long as the exact same lens copy is mounted to both cameras, on the same tripod, same conditions, same subject. Then, the results should be all about the camera and its sensor, which is what I'm driving at here.

One of the above links used 'high quality 35mm lenses', that doesn't tell us if both lenses were the same make, never mind the same lens copy.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The first impression I had is both cameras have the same sensor, so close the rendering of both are, even abstracting the lens diferences,

Renato


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
edited

Last edited by bernhardas on Tue Apr 26, 2016 1:08 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
bernhardas wrote:


I think the larger side by side field test will take some more time.


Only as long as it takes Graham to find the time to do a field test Wink

No rush Graham, we trust you to do a thorough job. Cool

please Razz


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 6:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The Sony looks like a verry interesting camera to me. Will be really fun to use with old lenses. Wonder which can keep up to the needs of this sensor.
Are there some better test on the web in like studio environment ?


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
As a Nikon D700 user, I've been wondering not only if switching to the Sony A7 would be an upgrade, but also if I would still be able to use my two go-to Nikon lenses (14-24 and 24-70). Both lenses look huge compared to the A7, and I wonder if the camera will be sturdy enough to support their weight when mounted on a tripod (I never shoot handheld). Neither lens has a tripod mount, of course, as they were not designed for a camera as small/light as the A7.

Another concern that I have is the use of adapters to mount my Nikon lenses on the A7. What would I be losing, if anything? Autofocus? Metering? Do these adapters even exist yet?

Finally, I do a lot of night shooting, in particular the aurora borealis. I wonder how the A7 would fare shooting the night sky at high ISOs (800 to 3200) compared to the D700.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
bernhardas wrote:
As far as I understand, the sensor of D800 e has a wired double AA filter on it that should cancel the effect out. The Sony has no AA filter at all.

it seems from lab testing that that makes a clear difference.

I think the larger side by side field test will take some more time.


Bernardas,

The "E" version of the D800 isn't the version which hasn't no AA filter, being the D800 plain coming with it? And the A7R with a "flip-flop" version, as the client wishes to use or not?

Renato


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
invisible wrote:
As a Nikon D700 user, I've been wondering not only if switching to the Sony A7 would be an upgrade, but also if I would still be able to use my two go-to Nikon lenses (14-24 and 24-70). Both lenses look huge compared to the A7, and I wonder if the camera will be sturdy enough to support their weight when mounted on a tripod (I never shoot handheld). Neither lens has a tripod mount, of course, as they were not designed for a camera as small/light as the A7.

Another concern that I have is the use of adapters to mount my Nikon lenses on the A7. What would I be losing, if anything? Autofocus? Metering? Do these adapters even exist yet?

Finally, I do a lot of night shooting, in particular the aurora borealis. I wonder how the A7 would fare shooting the night sky at high ISOs (800 to 3200) compared to the D700.


There is absolutely no concern what so ever that the camera is sturdy enough, with heavy lenses the lens functions as tripod stand and the camera hangs on the lens. This camera feels really well build even with heavy lenses.

Back on topic, from almost all sources, the Sony a7(r) has the best sensor out there. Why would real world applications with the same lens be any different. And that the a7 can't use leica glass very well is not a good point, because the 6d/5d mk3 and 600/800(e) can't use them at all. These camera's work stunning with SLR lenses. Biased and proud owner of a Sony A7 Smile


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Dogtag wrote:
There is absolutely no concern what so ever that the camera is sturdy enough, with heavy lenses the lens functions as tripod stand and the camera hangs on the lens. This camera feels really well build even with heavy lenses.

I think you misunderstood my question. My lenses have NO tripod mount. The camera would be mounted on the tripod. The lenses are big and heavy, which makes me wonder if the camera would be sturdy enough.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
You could use an adapter with a lens mount. Any Novoflex would do with the optional mount.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pontus wrote:
You could use an adapter with a lens mount. Any Novoflex would do with the optional mount.


... And to add some information, a genuine Made in China Very Happy collar for sell on ebay for telephoto lenses costs barely 8 bucks. My next Tair 300 is asking for that,

Cheers,

Renato


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 9:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
nikon 14-24 and 24-70 f2.8 might be too heavy for a cheap adapter.
I feel too risky. Why not D700 since they are natively for nikon?

Not sure if nikon AF adapter exist for E mount, but Canon does.
My reason to get a nex ff is not AF, but legacy manual lenses.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
SonicScot wrote:
Nordentro wrote:
Steve Huff compares Nikon D800 against A7R, but not with the same lens.

http://www.stevehuffphoto.com/2013/12/16/the-sony-a7r-vs-the-nikon-d800e-by-andrew-paquette/

I don't really understand the reasoning there, two different sensors and two different lenses. What is he comparing, lenses or sensors? Either way, it's not a level playing field so the exercise seems pointless to me. Surprised


Actually the sensor is exactly the same, the only difference is that the A7r has no AA filter. Throughout his comparison Steve Huff seems constantly surprised that the A7r produced sharper images than the D800 and he keeps banging that it must be a focussing problem...He seems totally oblivious to the fact no AA filter and using different apertures on each camera can easily explain the difference!


PostPosted: Fri Dec 20, 2013 10:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
invisible wrote:
As a Nikon D700 user, I've been wondering not only if switching to the Sony A7 would be an upgrade, but also if I would still be able to use my two go-to Nikon lenses (14-24 and 24-70). Both lenses look huge compared to the A7, and I wonder if the camera will be sturdy enough to support their weight when mounted on a tripod (I never shoot handheld). Neither lens has a tripod mount, of course, as they were not designed for a camera as small/light as the A7.

Another concern that I have is the use of adapters to mount my Nikon lenses on the A7. What would I be losing, if anything? Autofocus? Metering? Do these adapters even exist yet?

Finally, I do a lot of night shooting, in particular the aurora borealis. I wonder how the A7 would fare shooting the night sky at high ISOs (800 to 3200) compared to the D700.


Get a D800. There is no point in "upgrading" to the a7 at the cost of AF and possible adapter / lens mount issues.
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