Voigtlander - which focal length, suggestions

[msteen1314]

I'm looking at purchasing a Bessa R4M or R4A down the road and as this will take a fair amount of my (none) disposable income, the question of which lenses would follow.

I already own a the 25mm Snapshot Skopar and had contemplated later picking up a 35mm and a 50mm. However in light of finances, I asked myself whether picking up one of the 40mm options may be best.

Any feedback, experiences or other suggestions would be welcomed.

Thanks

[iangreenhalgh1]

35mm - Jupiter-12 2.8/35, copy of the CZJ Biogon

50mm - Jupiter-8 2/50, copy of the CZJ Sonnar

Those two will serve you very well and are very cheap for what they are. Both are in M39 but you can use them on M-mount with the right adapter.

J-12:



http://forum.mflenses.com/kiev-ii-jupiter-12-efke-50-in-paterson-fx-39-t49803.html

http://forum.mflenses.com/kiev-ii-jupiter-12-kodak-vision2-500t-fomadon-lqr-t52976.html


J-8:



http://forum.mflenses.com/kiev-ii-jupiter-8-fomapan-100-ro9-t49292.html

http://forum.mflenses.com/kiev-ii-jupiter-8-kodak-vision2-100t-fomadon-lqr-t53200.html

[LucisPictor]

I just LOVE those lenses:

(in order of FL)

Voigtländer Ultron 2/28 (M) ---> absolutely amazing, my fav lens for the M8
Jupiter-12 2.8/35 (LTM M39) ---> great on a FED, Zorki, Barnack; hardly usable on a digital M
Jupiter-3 1.5/50 (LTM M39) ---> low contrast wide open, otherwise fantastic!
Jupiter-8 2.0/50 (LTM M39) ---> similar to the J3, just not that extreme in any aspect
Leitz Summitar 2.0/5cm (LTM M39) ---> amazing lens, swirly bokeh highlights
Leitz Elmar 4/90 (LTM M39) ---> can suffer from low contrast, but generally very good
Leitz Hektor 4.5/135 (M) ---> spectacularly sharp on film and crop (NEX), hard to use on M8, perhaps not that good on an M9

And I have the delivery of a Voigtländer Super-Wide Heliar 4.5/15 pending. So I might able to judge on that one in some days.

I have also shot with...

Zeiss 2.8/21
Zeiss 2.0/35
2/35 Cron
2/50 Cron
2.5/75 Summarit
1.4/75 Lux

They all are fantastic but too expensive for my taste.

And I think the Orion-15 6/28 is a pretty good lens if you don't need it fast.

[rbelyell]

the cv 40/1.4 is a great lens, modern rendering, compact and reasonably priced. 40mm also is imo more versatile than 50--obviously subjective, but one that has many adherents. you are entirely right, the 40 replaces both the 35 and 50, allowing you the finances to buy a third lens to use for portaits.

for about the same money, if you want a really special lens with the 'character' often lacking in modern counterparts, consider the leica sunnicron-c 40/2. just as compact, and images that are oh so beautiful. i personally traded in my cv35/1.4 for the 'cron and it was one of the best decisions i ever made. if you emd up wanting a more modern look to your photos you will always be able to easily sell it at a profit.

i,ll be honest with you, a fully complete kit that you will be eternally happy with would be your skopar, the cron 40 and either the cv75/2.5 (about $400) or the leica elmar-c 90/4 ($250-300).
tony

[msteen1314]

Thanks all for the feedback

Tony, my thoughts WERE with the Voigtlander lenses however iangreenhalgh1 and LucisPictor make an interesting argument for the Jupiter lenses as it would definitely look after the financial aspect of the decision.

I already have a Jupiter 8 although not in the M39 mount.

More food for thought...
Instead of a Bessa R4M/A and the Voigtlander 35 and Voigtlander 50, total approx $1800 Cdn before taxes and shipping
I could stick with my Bessa T and a Jupiter 8 and Jupiter 12 with a turret finder, total approx $250

Have most of you that own the Jupiter lenses been pleased with the overall sharpness and contrast

[Attila]

J-8, J-3 , I expect J-12 not works on your camera sadly.
Leica Elmar 3,5cm

[ForenSeil]

Some recommendations:

Summicron-C 40/2 (250-450€)

Elmar-C 90/4 (~200€)

Jupiter-3 50/1.5* (~150€)

(IQ of course not as good&modern as with the upper ones, but very interesting character)

Some more interesting lenses you can get for less than 500€ were I don't have any sample pics:
Jupiter-8 50/2 * (~30-50€)
Industar-50 50/3.5 (20-50€)
Industar-22 50/3.5 (20-50€)
Leitz Elmar 50/3.5 (140-XXX€, optical similar to I-22/I-50 but without the quality spreading and a little better build quality)
Leitz Elmar 3,5/3.5 (140-300€, if you like low contrast)
Leitz Summaron 35/3.5 (200-300€)
Voigtländer 35/1.4 * (?)
Voigtländer 40/1.4 * (?)
Minolta 40/2 Leica M * (?)
Minolta 90/4 Leica M * (?)
Minolta 28/2.8 Leica M (?)
Canon 50/1.4 LTM (~300€)
Carl Zeiss Biogon C 35/2.8 T* ZM (?, not easy to find a used ones because lens is new and very good)
Summicron 50mm F2 (400€ to 1400€, there a several different versions, all are very good, latest are maybe the best 50mm on the market)
Carl Zeiss Planar 50/2 T* ZM (400-550€ used, 700€ new, better than old Summicrons but not as good as the latest)
? means I have no exact clue about actual used price

J-3 and J-8 can be optically good (a little low contrast, a little soft wide open etc. but hard to beat for the price if you find a good one) and comparable very cheap, but there's a lot quality spreading in my experience (focus shift, contrast, sharpness, haptics can be very different). I already bought three M39 J-8 and only had unusable cucumbers so far. You may earn a lot frustration after getting you first rolls developed, because they are all missfocused etc..

The Voigtländer 35 1.4 and 40 1.4 have mixed reputations due a lot distortion, curved field of sharpness etc.. They are also @F2 not as good as the Summicron-C 40/2 @F2 for example. I would recommend to buy the Biogon 35/2.8 or the Summicron-C/Minolta 40mm instead for about the same money, if you don't need the speed. There are every week Voigtländers on Ebay because the owners want to upgrade to an optically better lens.

The Minolta 90/4 and 40/2 are identical to the Summicron-C and Elmar-C from the optical design and build. Only difference is that they were made in Japan and not in Germany and you sometimes have to pay an extra collectors fee because they are not as common as their Leitz counterparts. They were mostly sold on the Japanese market together with the Minolta CLE. Sometimes you can find cheap offers with two-three lenses + Leica Cl oder Minolta CLE body for 400-600€.

I have bad experience with Industar 61 and Industar 26m bye the way - my copys were both comparable soft at all apertures and extremly prone to flare (at least the last point is not only quality spreading).

[iangreenhalgh1]

I think Forenseil has been rather unlucky with his Russians. I have not had a bad copy. The quality fluctuations are really in the later lenses it seems, 1965 and earlier seem pretty safe, I've got I-50 x 3, I-22, I-26, J-8 x 3, J-9, J-11 x 2 from the 50s or early 60s and J-12 x 2 from 1967 and they are all really good, no lesser ones. My 1988 I-61 is also good too.

At the price the Russians cost, they are worth trying, you can always sell them without loss and go another route if they don't meet your needs.

[rbelyell]

couldnt agree more with FS. funny we both picked the same 2 lenses. anyway, sent you a PM.
tony

[ForenSeil]

@Tony

Did you send a PM to me?? I didn't recieve any

[rbelyell]

no FS i sent PM to the OP.

[poshfoto]

hi, I currently use a few voigtlander lenses myself and a must have is the 15mm heliar.
After that it depends on what you feel comfortable shooting be it a 35mm or 50mm. I never got used to 35mm so I would get the 50mm. Maybe the 50mm f/2 leica M mount. Can't beat leica glass. I actually have a few galleries on my site using the 15mm. Its a super sharp lens. real fun to use and cheap. I never take it off my M6

[fish4570]

color skopar 50/2.5 and 35/2.5 ...

[Orio]

Since you already have the snapshot-skopar 4/25, you only need a faster and longer lens.
I think that either a 1.4/35 Nokton or a 1.4/40 Nokton are the perfect choice.

I personally have the snapshot-skopar, the Biogon 2/35 and C Sonnar 1.5/50, and most of
the time I find the Biogon and C Sonnar sort of redundant (meaning that I could use either of
them with no real difference).

So my recipe is: one wide and slow snapshot lens (slow because you would always use it at
hyperfocal, so no speed is needed), and one slightly longer but faster lens, to use for portraits
and at night. With this set, you can do nearly everything except for real tele work.