| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011
Posts: 2726
Location: Kiel, Germany.
|
 Posted: Fri Mar 23, 2012 8:00 pm Post subject: CeWe Photo CD VS Epson V500 VS Homemade *Update |
 |
|
ForenSeil wrote:
Judge yourself 
Lens was Carl Zeiss Biogon T* 28/2.8 on Contax G1 and film was Elitechrome 100 ->
For everyone who does not know CEWE - it's an european megalab which is developing films for many european supermarket-chains, drugstore chains, photo-stores and some photo-store chains.
Epson V500 is a cheap scanner (but compared to other scanners in that price class very good) which has an inlay for scanning negatives and slides up to 6x6.
CEWE original without any PP
Epson V500, standard settings, except resolution set to 2400 dpi, no further external PP
(you can get a little more quality with manual settings and PP)
Apo Rodagon R, Bellows, NEX-5N, in-cam-HDR, AWB
(you can get much more out with slightly modified technique and stronger dynamic range with stronger HDR)
_________________
I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language)
Last edited by ForenSeil on Thu May 17, 2012 5:57 pm; edited 7 times in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
bob955i
Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Posts: 2495
|
| Posted: Sat Mar 24, 2012 2:51 pm Post subject: |
|
|
bob955i wrote:
Illustrates perfectly why I opted to go DIY for scanning. I have my own experience with this also with a major lab here in the UK. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011
Posts: 2726
Location: Kiel, Germany.
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 8:35 pm Post subject: |
|
|
ForenSeil wrote:
| bob955i wrote: |
| Illustrates perfectly why I opted to go DIY for scanning. I have my own experience with this also with a major lab here in the UK. |
CeWe is working in 24 countrys for more than 45.000 stores - so I would nearly bet that your UK major lab is also an arm of CeWe
Luckily their prints and E6/C41 developments are much better than their scans 
_________________
I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 57865
Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 8:59 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Attila wrote:
If you would get signficantly better scan than V500 on 35mm need spend 500-600 USD+ on better scanner.
Until that try to get maximum flatness of strips, scan to .tiff and sharpen it on computer.
_________________
-------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:17 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Excalibur wrote:
h'mm the first scan looks better (sharper and more sparkle) than the 2nd (V500)... I must be missing something. 
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bob955i
Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Posts: 2495
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 10:21 pm Post subject: |
|
|
bob955i wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
| h'mm the first scan looks better (sharper and more sparkle) than the 2nd (V500)... I must be missing something. |
It does indeed look sharper but appears noisier in the sky portion at the top RH corner and especially in the shadows in the bottom LH corner at least on my monitor anyway. I've not used E100 film myself but would expect things to be much better than this especially if a single scan is costing the OP 4 euros. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
|
| Posted: Sun Apr 22, 2012 11:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Excalibur wrote:
| bob955i wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
| h'mm the first scan looks better (sharper and more sparkle) than the 2nd (V500)... I must be missing something. |
It does indeed look sharper but appears noisier in the sky portion at the top RH corner and especially in the shadows in the bottom LH corner at least on my monitor anyway. I've not used E100 film myself but would expect things to be much better than this especially if a single scan is costing the OP 4 euros. |
Sharpen the V500 scan to equal the Cewe scan and you get worse noise  but agree 4 euros is expensive for one slide and it's cheaper to get the V500.
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
bob955i
Joined: 15 Apr 2007
Posts: 2495
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 11:59 am Post subject: |
|
|
bob955i wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
| Sharpen the V500 scan to equal the Cewe scan and you get worse noise but agree 4 euros is expensive for one slide and it's cheaper to get the V500. |
I'm sure you do get worse noise if you sharpen the Epson scan but then that wasn't really my point. The 4 euro scan should have been better for the price and more so if it was a print. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
skida
Joined: 02 Mar 2012
Posts: 1826
Location: North East England
|
| Posted: Mon Apr 23, 2012 1:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
skida wrote:
No 2 seems to have sharpening halos at the edges of the tower and on the cable to the left, which are absent from the commercial scan. The colours and range are better with no 2 though. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
|
| Posted: Tue Apr 24, 2012 6:38 am Post subject: |
|
|
Excalibur wrote:
| skida wrote: |
| No 2 seems to have sharpening halos at the edges of the tower and on the cable to the left, which are absent from the commercial scan. The colours and range are better with no 2 though. |
Well the scanners used in Germany are probably the same as used in the Asda supermarket in the UK, so it's a V500 versus a £20,000 Fuji frontier and what's also involved?........a human 
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011
Posts: 2726
Location: Kiel, Germany.
|
| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 7:13 pm Post subject: |
|
|
ForenSeil wrote:
Update, now with comparision with my DIY method with Apo Rodagon R 75/4 @ F5.6 and 1:1,5 magnification on Bellows on NEX-5N, set to AWB and in cam HDR automatic.
CEWE 100%
Epson V500 100%
"DIY method" 100%
In the crop the CEWE might look best in the first moment but if you scale to the same size as the Epson V500 or especially to the result of me DIY method it looks not as good (especially colors).
I wonder why CEWE does not use such a method!? A scan with the DIY method takes less than 1s
_________________
I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 29545
Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
|
| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 10:47 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Orio wrote:
The DSLR method has made your photo lose two zones in the highlights and two zones in the shadows.
_________________
Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
visualopsins
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 11061
Location: California
Expire: 2025-04-11
|
| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:24 pm Post subject: |
|
|
visualopsins wrote:
Scan loses more stops.....
Film's enduring strength is a dynamic range which no scanner or sensor can equal.
_________________
☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮ like attracts like! ☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮
Cameras: Sony ILCE-7RM2, Spotmatics II, F, and ESII, Nikon P4
Lenses:
M42 Asahi Optical Co., Takumar 1:4 f=35mm, 1:2 f=58mm (Sonnar), 1:2.4 f=58mm (Heliar), 1:2.2 f=55mm (Gaussian), 1:2.8 f=105mm (Model I), 1:2.8/105 (Model II), 1:5.6/200, Tele-Takumar 1:5.6/200, 1:6.3/300, Macro-Takumar 1:4/50, Auto-Takumar 1:2.3 f=35, 1:1.8 f=55mm, 1:2.2 f=55mm, Super-TAKUMAR 1:3.5/28 (fat), 1:2/35 (Fat), 1:1.4/50 (8-element), Super-Multi-Coated Fisheye-TAKUMAR 1:4/17, Super-Multi-Coated TAKUMAR 1:4.5/20, 1:3.5/24, 1:3.5/28, 1:2/35, 1:3.5/35, 1:1.8/85, 1:1.9/85 1:2.8/105, 1:3.5/135, 1:2.5/135 (II), 1:4/150, 1:4/200, 1:4/300, 1:4.5/500, Super-Multi-Coated Macro-TAKUMAR 1:4/50, 1:4/100, Super-Multi-Coated Bellows-TAKUMAR 1:4/100, SMC TAKUMAR 1:1.4/50, 1:1.8/55
M42 Carl Zeiss Jena Flektogon 2.4/35
Contax Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* 28-70mm F3.5-4.5
Pentax K-mount SMC PENTAX-A ZOOM 1:3.5 35~105mm, SMC PENTAX ZOOM 1:4 45~125mm
Nikon Micro-NIKKOR-P-C Auto 1:3.5 f=55mm, NIKKOR-P Auto 105mm f/2.5 Pre-AI (Sonnar), Micro-NIKKOR 105mm 1:4 AI, NIKKOR AI-S 35-135mm f/3,5-4,5
Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (51B), Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (151B), SP 500mm f/8 (55BB), SP 70-210mm f/3.5 (19AH)
Vivitar 100mm 1:2.8 MC 1:1 Macro Telephoto (Kiron)
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 29545
Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
|
| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 11:34 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Orio wrote:
| visualopsins wrote: |
| Scan loses more stops..... |
compare the church door in the DSLR copy and in the home scane
The home scan shows detail where the DSLR copy shows none.
_________________
Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011
Posts: 2726
Location: Kiel, Germany.
|
| Posted: Tue May 15, 2012 8:47 am Post subject: |
|
|
ForenSeil wrote:
The dynamic range of the DSLR method could be impoved much by PP or by a stronger HDR level.
Maybe I should also try to make a pseudo-HDR from RAW or DRO.
_________________
I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language) |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
visualopsins
Joined: 05 Mar 2009
Posts: 11061
Location: California
Expire: 2025-04-11
|
| Posted: Tue May 15, 2012 3:37 pm Post subject: |
|
|
visualopsins wrote:
| Orio wrote: |
| visualopsins wrote: |
| Scan loses more stops..... |
compare the church door in the DSLR copy and in the home scane
The home scan shows detail where the DSLR copy shows none. |
Thanks! That's pretty obvious. I agree with you, however, I think those shadow details are present in NEX photo raw; those details would be shown if the shadows were boosted in PP.
My answer was not specific to these examples, but in general -- scanners have less dynamic range than the NEX.
_________________
☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮ like attracts like! ☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮
Cameras: Sony ILCE-7RM2, Spotmatics II, F, and ESII, Nikon P4
Lenses:
M42 Asahi Optical Co., Takumar 1:4 f=35mm, 1:2 f=58mm (Sonnar), 1:2.4 f=58mm (Heliar), 1:2.2 f=55mm (Gaussian), 1:2.8 f=105mm (Model I), 1:2.8/105 (Model II), 1:5.6/200, Tele-Takumar 1:5.6/200, 1:6.3/300, Macro-Takumar 1:4/50, Auto-Takumar 1:2.3 f=35, 1:1.8 f=55mm, 1:2.2 f=55mm, Super-TAKUMAR 1:3.5/28 (fat), 1:2/35 (Fat), 1:1.4/50 (8-element), Super-Multi-Coated Fisheye-TAKUMAR 1:4/17, Super-Multi-Coated TAKUMAR 1:4.5/20, 1:3.5/24, 1:3.5/28, 1:2/35, 1:3.5/35, 1:1.8/85, 1:1.9/85 1:2.8/105, 1:3.5/135, 1:2.5/135 (II), 1:4/150, 1:4/200, 1:4/300, 1:4.5/500, Super-Multi-Coated Macro-TAKUMAR 1:4/50, 1:4/100, Super-Multi-Coated Bellows-TAKUMAR 1:4/100, SMC TAKUMAR 1:1.4/50, 1:1.8/55
M42 Carl Zeiss Jena Flektogon 2.4/35
Contax Carl Zeiss Vario-Sonnar T* 28-70mm F3.5-4.5
Pentax K-mount SMC PENTAX-A ZOOM 1:3.5 35~105mm, SMC PENTAX ZOOM 1:4 45~125mm
Nikon Micro-NIKKOR-P-C Auto 1:3.5 f=55mm, NIKKOR-P Auto 105mm f/2.5 Pre-AI (Sonnar), Micro-NIKKOR 105mm 1:4 AI, NIKKOR AI-S 35-135mm f/3,5-4,5
Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (51B), Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (151B), SP 500mm f/8 (55BB), SP 70-210mm f/3.5 (19AH)
Vivitar 100mm 1:2.8 MC 1:1 Macro Telephoto (Kiron)
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Search
Memberlist
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
