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revers
Joined: 13 May 2010 Posts: 574 Location: In the country just north of Toronto Canada
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:49 am Post subject: Industar 61 macro lens question. |
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revers wrote:
I see claims the INDUSTAR 61L/Z MC is a macro lens but I have not been able to find any information as to what the magnification ratio is. Perhaps it is only a close focus lens.
Anybody here know? _________________ Ron
Olympus OM-D E-M5, 14-42 & 45/1.8.
Panasonic G1, GF1, 14-45, 45-200 & various legacy lenses.
Canon S5, Sony 1.7 Tele-converter & Raynox DCR 150 Macro converter. |
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Bruce
Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 842 Location: Boston, Ma USA
Expire: 2014-11-22
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 2:12 am Post subject: |
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Bruce wrote:
1:3 macro
Mine seems close focus 6" _________________ Digital: Canon 40d & 5DmkII, Film: Hasselblad 203fe/Zeiss 80/2.8 cfe
Adapters for EOS: Cy; M42; Zenit39; Exakta; LeicaR; OlympusOM; PK; Nikon; Rollei35; Retina; Adaptal; P-6 |
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aoleg
Joined: 22 Feb 2008 Posts: 1387 Location: Berlin, DE
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 4:42 am Post subject: |
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aoleg wrote:
It was not meant to be a macro lens; "close focusing" would be the right designation. My copy focuses down to 0.3m (1ft). No official data on maximum magnification was provided; however, there are calculators available to provide that sort of info based on lens focal length and MFD. _________________ List of lenses |
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RioRico
Joined: 12 Mar 2010 Posts: 1120 Location: California or Guatemala or somewhere
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 7:03 am Post subject: |
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RioRico wrote:
My I-50 focuses down to ONE INCH!!
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Of course, it's on tubes for that. _________________ Too many film+digi cams+lenses, oh my -- Pentax K20D, K-1000, M42s, more
The simple truth is this: There are no neutral photographs. --F-Stop Fitzgerald |
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vulko
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 8:54 am Post subject: |
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vulko wrote:
For magnification either use ext. rings or turn it over and attach with a couple of rubbers to the camera |
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revers
Joined: 13 May 2010 Posts: 574 Location: In the country just north of Toronto Canada
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 11:58 am Post subject: |
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revers wrote:
Thanks guys, as I suspected, it is not really a macro lens at all. _________________ Ron
Olympus OM-D E-M5, 14-42 & 45/1.8.
Panasonic G1, GF1, 14-45, 45-200 & various legacy lenses.
Canon S5, Sony 1.7 Tele-converter & Raynox DCR 150 Macro converter. |
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vulko
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:14 pm Post subject: |
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vulko wrote:
I'm not rly into macro photography, but always thought that macro lens is a lens that allows you to take pics from the range lesser than focal distance. Now you confused me. What is it than? |
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RioRico
Joined: 12 Mar 2010 Posts: 1120 Location: California or Guatemala or somewhere
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 12:51 pm Post subject: |
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RioRico wrote:
revers wrote: |
Thanks guys, as I suspected, it is not really a macro lens at all. |
No, but it's highly regarded for macro use on tubes.
vulko wrote: |
I'm not rly into macro photography, but always thought that macro lens is a lens that allows you to take pics from the range lesser than focal distance. Now you confused me. What is it than? |
Macro has to do with magnification, not working distance. We usually recognize as 'macro' a setup that will reach at least 1:2 magnification, with 1:1 preferred. 1:1 means that the image on the sensor is the same size as the subject; 1:2 means that image is 1/2 the subject's size. Virtually any lens *can* be used for macro work somehow, maybe on tubes or bellows, whether straight or reversed or stacked. A straight (non-reversed) lens CANNOT focus to less than its focal length (or so I have read); a reversed or stacked lens focuses to the register (working distance) of that lens type, which on most dSLRs is around 40-50mm. _________________ Too many film+digi cams+lenses, oh my -- Pentax K20D, K-1000, M42s, more
The simple truth is this: There are no neutral photographs. --F-Stop Fitzgerald |
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vulko
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Posted: Thu Aug 12, 2010 9:20 pm Post subject: |
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vulko wrote:
RioRico wrote: |
revers wrote: |
Thanks guys, as I suspected, it is not really a macro lens at all. |
No, but it's highly regarded for macro use on tubes.
vulko wrote: |
I'm not rly into macro photography, but always thought that macro lens is a lens that allows you to take pics from the range lesser than focal distance. Now you confused me. What is it than? |
Macro has to do with magnification, not working distance. We usually recognize as 'macro' a setup that will reach at least 1:2 magnification, with 1:1 preferred. 1:1 means that the image on the sensor is the same size as the subject; 1:2 means that image is 1/2 the subject's size. Virtually any lens *can* be used for macro work somehow, maybe on tubes or bellows, whether straight or reversed or stacked. A straight (non-reversed) lens CANNOT focus to less than its focal length (or so I have read); a reversed or stacked lens focuses to the register (working distance) of that lens type, which on most dSLRs is around 40-50mm. |
Hm... 1:1 means that object and its image on sensor are equal? You can get closer to object than and you get image on sensor bigger, won't you?
That means magnification 1:N, where N > 1. Correct?
So by making the minimum focusing distance less than the focal length of the lens you get objects magnified, or as you said macro. |
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revers
Joined: 13 May 2010 Posts: 574 Location: In the country just north of Toronto Canada
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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revers wrote:
Quote: |
Hm... 1:1 means that object and its image on sensor are equal? You can get closer to object than and you get image on sensor bigger, won't you?
That means magnification 1:N, where N > 1. Correct?
So by making the minimum focusing distance less than the focal length of the lens you get objects magnified, or as you said macro. |
If you use extension tubes longer than the focal length of the lens you will get greater magnification than 1:1. i.e. if you use 56mm of tubes on a 50mm lens you will have an image on the film/sensor larger than life size. _________________ Ron
Olympus OM-D E-M5, 14-42 & 45/1.8.
Panasonic G1, GF1, 14-45, 45-200 & various legacy lenses.
Canon S5, Sony 1.7 Tele-converter & Raynox DCR 150 Macro converter. |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 5:03 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
revers wrote: |
Thanks guys, as I suspected, it is not really a macro lens at all. |
Yes, but sharp and it has very precise focusing so I really recommend it with a simple extension rings series. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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Nordentro
Joined: 24 Jun 2010 Posts: 4713 Location: Lillehammer, Norway
Expire: 2015-01-29
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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Nordentro wrote:
Or the "big brother" Volna 9 _________________ Lars | Manuellfokus.no |
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kds315*
Joined: 12 Mar 2008 Posts: 16631 Location: Weinheim, Germany
Expire: 2021-03-09
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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kds315* wrote:
Macro per definition of our german norm is the 1:1 - 50:1 magnification range.
Unfortunately the term "macro" is used very loosely especially for marketing of lenses/cameras. _________________ Klaus - Admin
"S'il vient a point, me souviendra" [Thomas Bohier (1460-1523)]
http://www.macrolenses.de for macro and special lens info
http://www.pbase.com/kds315/uv_photos for UV Images and lens/filter info
https://www.flickr.com/photos/kds315/albums my albums using various lenses
http://photographyoftheinvisibleworld.blogspot.com/ my UV BLOG
http://www.travelmeetsfood.com/blog Food + Travel BLOG
https://galeriafotografia.com Architecture + Drone photography
Currently most FAV lens(es):
X80QF f3.2/80mm
Hypergon f11/26mm
ELCAN UV f5.6/52mm
Zeiss UV-Planar f4/60mm
Zeiss UV-Planar f2/62mm
Lomo Уфар-12 f2.5/41mm
Lomo Зуфар-2 f4.0/350mm
Lomo ZIKAR-1A f1.2/100mm
Nikon UV Nikkor f4.5/105mm
Zeiss UV-Sonnar f4.3/105mm
CERCO UV-VIS-NIR f1.8/45mm
CERCO UV-VIS-NIR f4.1/94mm
CERCO UV-VIS-NIR f2.8/100mm
Steinheil Quarzobjektiv f1.8/50mm
Pentax Quartz Takumar f3.5/85mm
Carl Zeiss Jena UV-Objektiv f4/60mm
NYE OPTICAL Lyman-Alpha II f1.1/90mm
NYE OPTICAL Lyman-Alpha I f2.8/200mm
COASTAL OPTICS f4/60mm UV-VIS-IR Apo
COASTAL OPTICS f4.5/105mm UV-Micro-Apo
Pentax Ultra-Achromatic Takumar f4.5/85mm
Pentax Ultra-Achromatic Takumar f5.6/300mm
Rodenstock UV-Rodagon f5.6/60mm + 105mm + 150mm
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vulko
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 6:40 pm Post subject: |
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vulko wrote:
Then macro lens should mean a lens with some kind of mechanism inside, that is like a tube? Am i getting this right? |
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RioRico
Joined: 12 Mar 2010 Posts: 1120 Location: California or Guatemala or somewhere
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Posted: Fri Aug 13, 2010 8:42 pm Post subject: |
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RioRico wrote:
vulko wrote: |
Hm... 1:1 means that object and its image on sensor are equal? You can get closer to object than and you get image on sensor bigger, won't you?
That means magnification 1:N, where N > 1. Correct?
So by making the minimum focusing distance less than the focal length of the lens you get objects magnified, or as you said macro. |
No, you can't focus closer than the focal length. I just tested this -- I put a standard 50mm camera lens on bellows and racked it out to 150mm. That means the total extension is 200mm, for magnification of 3:1. Then I aimed at my glowing computer screen, with a ruler to mark the distance from the lens front to the screen. The distance: just about 2 inches or 50mm. I tried it again with 100mm of extension, for 2:1 magnification, and the focus distance is: 50mm. If I added another 50mm of tubes to the bellows+lens assembly, I would get 4:1 magnification, but the close-focus point is still at 50mm.
vulko wrote: |
Then macro lens should mean a lens with some kind of mechanism inside, that is like a tube? Am i getting this right? |
There are various ways to go 'macro', to approach or pass 1:1 magnification. The simplest way is to put a lens onto bellows or extension tubes. If the lens is mounted normally (not reversed), its closest possible focus distance is equal to its focal length. If the lens is reversed (which may give a sharper image), the close-focus point is the lens' register, probably around 40-50mm.
Most 'macro' lenses have a long focusing helicoid mechanism, which moves the lens further from the sensor/film frame -- that is, it adds more extension. The further the lens is from the sensor/film frame, the greater is the magnification.
The other common macro setup uses a supplemental (add-on) lens of some sort. The cheap way is to use +diopter closeup lenses, simple meniscus glass. But these distort. Another way is to use a two-element adapter, which corrects for distortions. The popular Raynox close-up adapters are like this.
And another popular way is to 'stack' ordinary lenses. The longer lens mounted on your camera is called the 'primary'; the shorter reversed lens attached to the primary is the 'secondary'. Magnification is just the ratio of the focal lengths of primary to secondary. Suppose I put a 105mm lens on my camera, one with 49mm thread diameter. I put a 49mm reversal ring onto that lens, then reverse a 35mm lens onto that. Magnification is 105/35 or 3:1. And the working distance is the register of the secondary.
I hope I explained this clear enough. _________________ Too many film+digi cams+lenses, oh my -- Pentax K20D, K-1000, M42s, more
The simple truth is this: There are no neutral photographs. --F-Stop Fitzgerald |
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