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tikkathree
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 755 Location: Lovely Suffolk in Great Britain
Expire: 2012-12-28
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:48 pm Post subject: 50mm MF Lens - a serious question. |
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tikkathree wrote:
This is a serious question rather than a frivolous one.
I have a Canon f/1.4 EF lens. It's sharp, it does the things which I want a 50mm lens to do. It replaced a Mk1 nifty fifty EF 50mm f/1.8 which geve lovely results but sounded like.. well, crude.
I'm developing an interest in MF lens use and have so far acquired examples in 28mm, 135mm and 200mm.
Here's my serious question then: what could I get from a 50mm MF lens which my EF f/1.4 doesn't give me? _________________ I used to think digital was fun but then I discovered film, then I found old lenses and then, eventually I found rangefinders.
EOS 5DII, loadsalenses
Canon G9 IR conv,
MF: TLR, 645 and folders
35mm: Oly OM Pro bodies 1, 2, 3 and 4; Soviet RF kit |
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ManualFocus-G
Joined: 29 Dec 2008 Posts: 6622 Location: United Kingdom
Expire: 2014-11-24
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:54 pm Post subject: |
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ManualFocus-G wrote:
Firstly, one of the reasons many people start using MF lenses is to get quality, fast lenses at low prices. Many enthusiast photographers can't afford / aren't prepared to spend £300.00 on a 50/1.4 lens.
You already have the EF 50/1.4 so the differences you should be looking at are:
* Better build quality (metal v plastic)
* Better MF ring (if that's the way you wish to focus)
* Sharpness across the plane (the EF may already do this!)
* Character
The last one is very important. Personally, I love the 3D "pop" that my Zeiss Planars produce. I have the MkII 50/1.8 EF and I don't like the character anywhere near as much. So, for me it's the clincher but of course likes vary among photogaphers and character among lenses!! _________________ Graham - Moderator
Shooter of choice: Fujifilm X-T20 with M42, PB and C/Y lenses
See my Flickr photos at http://www.flickr.com/photos/manualfocus-g |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
It is depend what you like to get from a lens, to me all modern lens with a few exception is too neutral what you see what you get lenses.
I recommend to you to try following 50mm lenses by your self.
Carl Zeiss Jena Pancolar 50mm f1.4, 1.8, f2 M42
Carl Zeiss Jena Tessar 50mm f2.8 M42
Carl Zeiss Tessar 50mm f2.8 Oberkochen M42
Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm f1.4 , 1.7 Contax
Nikkon 50mm f2, 1.8, 1.4 Nikon 50mm f3.5 macro
Olympus OM 50mm f3.5 macro, 1.4, 1.8
Nikon 50mm f1.2 , Pentax 50mm f1.2
etc etc all compatible with your camera _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:02 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
http://forum.mflenses.com/a-kea-my-favorite-parrot-in-budapest-zoo-t1134,highlight,kea.html
On above sample bird color is green, but old lens made it to brown what I like it pretty much. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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tikkathree
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 755 Location: Lovely Suffolk in Great Britain
Expire: 2012-12-28
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:41 pm Post subject: |
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tikkathree wrote:
Attila,
You'd have me buy and try over a dozen lenses there.... help like that I can barely afford
and you'd include a lens which takes a perfectly healthy green bird and turns it to a pretty but muddy brown? _________________ I used to think digital was fun but then I discovered film, then I found old lenses and then, eventually I found rangefinders.
EOS 5DII, loadsalenses
Canon G9 IR conv,
MF: TLR, 645 and folders
35mm: Oly OM Pro bodies 1, 2, 3 and 4; Soviet RF kit |
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poilu
Joined: 26 Aug 2007 Posts: 10472 Location: Greece
Expire: 2019-08-29
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:44 pm Post subject: |
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poilu wrote:
tikkathree wrote: |
what could I get from a 50mm MF lens which my EF f/1.4 doesn't give me? |
you will learn to focus and compose outside of the AF red marks
in other world, you will learn photography _________________ T* |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
tikkathree wrote: |
Attila,
You'd have me buy and try over a dozen lenses there.... help like that I can barely afford
and you'd include a lens which takes a perfectly healthy green bird and turns it to a pretty but muddy brown? |
Yes, in my opinion color changing many times better than genuine scene. As I told before if you like better to see same thing on pictures , modern lenses are good for you. If you like better to see something different old ones are better choice. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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tikkathree
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 755 Location: Lovely Suffolk in Great Britain
Expire: 2012-12-28
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 5:15 pm Post subject: |
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tikkathree wrote:
poilu wrote: |
tikkathree wrote: |
what could I get from a 50mm MF lens which my EF f/1.4 doesn't give me? |
you will learn to focus and compose outside of the AF red marks
in other world, you will learn photography |
Ah yes. With my new MF lenses I'm doing all kinds of thinking rather than just dialling in shutter speed or aperture and having a quick peep at ISO.
My question sought to identify any shortcomings in my EF 50 f/1.4: foolish me for thinking the answer might be a simple this or that. It's anything but!!!
Thanks _________________ I used to think digital was fun but then I discovered film, then I found old lenses and then, eventually I found rangefinders.
EOS 5DII, loadsalenses
Canon G9 IR conv,
MF: TLR, 645 and folders
35mm: Oly OM Pro bodies 1, 2, 3 and 4; Soviet RF kit |
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Chris Watson
Joined: 12 Apr 2010 Posts: 168 Location: Fort Worth
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 6:28 pm Post subject: |
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Chris Watson wrote:
I think if you want to explore why so many folks like the MF lenses, you should pick up a Helios 40 in any of its varieties. After that, you'll be hopelessly hooked! _________________ Chris Watson
Watson Videography
www.dallasweddingfilms.com
blog: www.dallasweddingfilms.net |
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Big Dawg
Joined: 28 Jan 2009 Posts: 2530 Location: Thach Alabama
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 6:43 pm Post subject: |
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Big Dawg wrote:
For me the thing that convinced me to get manual focus lenses is trying to photograph birds while they are perched among the branches of a tree. The auto-focus would invariably focus on the leaves and limbs instead of the bird. Manual focusing solved this but that can also be done with a auto-focus lens, but it just feels different with them. I love the feel of a good manual focus lens as I twist the focus ring. A well dampened manual lens just screams quality to me as I turn it. But back to the reasons...one good one is the ability to vary the focus point for different effects. You can use the select focus but to me....I repeat to me...it is just easier with a manual focus lens. _________________ Big Dawg |
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Rusty
Joined: 06 Nov 2008 Posts: 435 Location: Mosselbay, South Africa
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:08 pm Post subject: |
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Rusty wrote:
The canon 50/1.4 is a bit soft wide open MF zeiss planar 50/1.7 is not.... maybe the zeiss 50/1.4 will give the canon a go....if you want the extra light
It has better color for skin tones anyway ,and micro contrast _________________ Daniel |
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tikkathree
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 755 Location: Lovely Suffolk in Great Britain
Expire: 2012-12-28
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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tikkathree wrote:
Rusty wrote: |
The canon 50/1.4 is a bit soft wide open MF zeiss planar 50/1.7 is not.... maybe the zeiss 50/1.4 will give the canon a go....if you want the extra light
It has better color for skin tones anyway ,and micro contrast |
If I'm really picky I use mine at 1.8 and cut myself on the image. 1.6 is okay but 1.4 I prefer not to use. _________________ I used to think digital was fun but then I discovered film, then I found old lenses and then, eventually I found rangefinders.
EOS 5DII, loadsalenses
Canon G9 IR conv,
MF: TLR, 645 and folders
35mm: Oly OM Pro bodies 1, 2, 3 and 4; Soviet RF kit |
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tikkathree
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 755 Location: Lovely Suffolk in Great Britain
Expire: 2012-12-28
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:35 pm Post subject: |
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tikkathree wrote:
No-one is mentioning the
Asahi Pentax SMC Takumar 50mm f/1.4
I take it there's good reason for this. _________________ I used to think digital was fun but then I discovered film, then I found old lenses and then, eventually I found rangefinders.
EOS 5DII, loadsalenses
Canon G9 IR conv,
MF: TLR, 645 and folders
35mm: Oly OM Pro bodies 1, 2, 3 and 4; Soviet RF kit |
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ersatz
Joined: 29 May 2010 Posts: 45
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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ersatz wrote:
better tonal gradation (Leica lenses tend to excell in this category)
micro contrast (zeiss)
sharpness throughout the frame
color rendition
bokeh (crazy swirly type of biotars/helios, painterly brush stroke type bokeh, watercolor blotchy, etc)
This all culminates in character or the unique finger print of how they render a scene. Now, I'm not going to say you can see these differences in every pic taken with a certain lens. But once you understand the characteristics of the lens you can create a situation or condition that brings these unique characteristics to the forefront. There are many fine examples here and you can see the diversity of rendering amongst various 50/58mm lenses with the pics people have posted. |
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hinnerker
Joined: 17 Aug 2009 Posts: 929 Location: Germany near Kiel
Expire: 2015-08-09
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:06 pm Post subject: |
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hinnerker wrote:
Nobody can answer this questions for you !!!
Your eyes, your needs, your feeling about handling and the way you are taking pictures will make the difference in one or the other direction.
The only think we can do, is to give informations what a good lens could be in our opinions and some terms.. not more.
The best way... try to find a cheap Zuiko 1.4/50mm
try to find a cheap SMC Takumar 1.4/50mm
or as much 1.4/50mm lenses from older days.. and compair them against your Canon EF 1.4/50mm...
You will find some important differences.. in terms of sharpness, bokeh, Handling, 3D, color rendering..
Buy some good MF lenses and make clear for you, what you prefer.. you will see big differences.. for sure. And sell the lenses, which not fit to your needs..
Cheers
Henry _________________ some light-painting lens stuff..
... and an EOS 5D MKII
www.digicamclub.de |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
hinnerker wrote: |
Nobody can answer this questions for you !!!
Your eyes, your needs, your feeling about handling and the way you are taking pictures will make the difference in one or the other direction.
The only think we can do, is to give informations what a good lens could be in our opinions and some terms.. not more.
The best way... try to find a cheap Zuiko 1.4/50mm
try to find a cheap SMC Takumar 1.4/50mm
or as much 1.4/50mm lenses from older days.. and compair them against your Canon EF 1.4/50mm...
You will find some important differences.. in terms of sharpness, bokeh, Handling, 3D, color rendering..
Buy some good MF lenses and make clear for you, what you prefer.. you will see big differences.. for sure. And sell the lenses, which not fit to your needs..
Cheers
Henry |
+1 _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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revers
Joined: 13 May 2010 Posts: 574 Location: In the country just north of Toronto Canada
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 11:23 pm Post subject: |
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revers wrote:
No one has mentioned Minolta. Some of you may remember a trial I did with several 50 something lenses & the Minolta 50/1.4 was the best performer. I have yet to test it against two Russian lenses I have only recently acquired & I am guessing the Helios 44-2 will be stiff competition. _________________ Ron
Olympus OM-D E-M5, 14-42 & 45/1.8.
Panasonic G1, GF1, 14-45, 45-200 & various legacy lenses.
Canon S5, Sony 1.7 Tele-converter & Raynox DCR 150 Macro converter. |
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francotirador
Joined: 17 Sep 2009 Posts: 894
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Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2010 11:42 pm Post subject: |
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francotirador wrote:
tikkathree
Post photos with your 50 1.4 compare to other interesting lenses.
I primarily use a 58/1.2 Rokkor. And the picture is very different to me. And use it professionally. _________________ Canon 5D II-Sony nex 6
Canon L 80-200 f 2.8 - Canon L 135 f2 - Canon FD 135/2.5 convert to EOS - Yashica 50 1.4 ML - Canon FD 50 1.2 - Distagon 35mm 2.8 T AEJ - Minolta MC 24mm f 2.8 - Canon LTM 85 1.9- Canon LTM 85mm 1.9 convert to EOS - Rodenstock Heligon 50 1.9 - Color Skopar 50 2.8 & MAte Box & filters 4X4
Contax RTS II y Minolta SRT 303 - 28-135 3.6 Tokina - Minolta MD 45 f2.0 - Minolta Zoom 80 200 4.5 (Leica)
www.isgleasphoto.com
The life is more easy with this forum ....
Last edited by francotirador on Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Blue
Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 304
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 4:57 am Post subject: |
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Blue wrote:
Attila wrote: |
It is depend what you like to get from a lens, to me all modern lens with a few exception is too neutral what you see what you get lenses.
I recommend to you to try following 50mm lenses by your self.
Carl Zeiss Jena Pancolar 50mm f1.4, 1.8, f2 M42
Carl Zeiss Jena Tessar 50mm f2.8 M42
Carl Zeiss Tessar 50mm f2.8 Oberkochen M42
Carl Zeiss Planar 50mm f1.4 , 1.7 Contax
Nikkon 50mm f2, 1.8, 1.4 Nikon 50mm f3.5 macro
Olympus OM 50mm f3.5 macro, 1.4, 1.8
Nikon 50mm f1.2 , Pentax 50mm f1.2
etc etc all compatible with your camera |
This list will lighten a bank account. You left out the Nikkor 58mm f1.2. _________________ Pentax: K, H2, H3, S3, SV (late & early), SV black, Spot F, K2 chrome, K2 black, ME F, SuperProgram, 6x7, Auto 110, Asahiflex IIB late
Pentax "modern": MZ-3, *istD, K200d, K20d
Mamiya: C3 TLR, NC1000
Canon: EOS 10s, AE-1
Chinon: CP-7m
IKON: Contax D, Praktiflex FX & Victar 50mm f2.9
Contessa-Nettel Piccolette - 7.5 cm Tessar & Compur shutter
Rangefinders: Argus C4 and Ricoh Five-One-Nine |
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tikkathree
Joined: 19 Jun 2010 Posts: 755 Location: Lovely Suffolk in Great Britain
Expire: 2012-12-28
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:02 am Post subject: |
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tikkathree wrote:
Blue wrote: |
This list will lighten a bank account. You left out the Nikkor 58mm f1.2. |
Just checked the price of that one: I wouldn't have a bank account!!
_________________ I used to think digital was fun but then I discovered film, then I found old lenses and then, eventually I found rangefinders.
EOS 5DII, loadsalenses
Canon G9 IR conv,
MF: TLR, 645 and folders
35mm: Oly OM Pro bodies 1, 2, 3 and 4; Soviet RF kit |
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Blue
Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 304
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:32 am Post subject: |
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Blue wrote:
tikkathree wrote: |
Blue wrote: |
This list will lighten a bank account. You left out the Nikkor 58mm f1.2. |
Just checked the price of that one: I wouldn't have a bank account!!
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I could only afford the shade for one. I use it on my Pentax A 50mm f1.2. _________________ Pentax: K, H2, H3, S3, SV (late & early), SV black, Spot F, K2 chrome, K2 black, ME F, SuperProgram, 6x7, Auto 110, Asahiflex IIB late
Pentax "modern": MZ-3, *istD, K200d, K20d
Mamiya: C3 TLR, NC1000
Canon: EOS 10s, AE-1
Chinon: CP-7m
IKON: Contax D, Praktiflex FX & Victar 50mm f2.9
Contessa-Nettel Piccolette - 7.5 cm Tessar & Compur shutter
Rangefinders: Argus C4 and Ricoh Five-One-Nine |
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aoleg
Joined: 22 Feb 2008 Posts: 1387 Location: Berlin, DE
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 5:45 am Post subject: |
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aoleg wrote:
tikkathree wrote: |
No-one is mentioning the
Asahi Pentax SMC Takumar 50mm f/1.4
I take it there's good reason for this. |
Yep, it'll hit the mirror of your 5D when focused beyond about 7-10m. Other than that, it's a character lens; not necessarily as sharp wide open as the Canon, but quite interesting in rendering.
I tried quite a few 50mm lenses. If you're interested in f/1.4, Contax Planar 50/1.4 is your best bet. Lots of "pop" and huge contrast. Yashica ML 50/1.4 gives about 80% of its performance at about 1/3 of the price. Nikkor 50/1.4 (Ai and AIS versions) is nice and sharp with lots of "pop", just like the Planar, but its bokeh is quite ugly wide open, and still dubious at f/2. Olympus Zuiko 50/1.4 (past 1,000,000 serial numbers) is a nice character lens with lots of "glow" and a very special bokeh wide open. Whether you like the way it draws or not is up to you, but it's a character lens for sure. _________________ List of lenses |
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alex
Joined: 18 Apr 2009 Posts: 561 Location: UK
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 10:17 am Post subject: |
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alex wrote:
I'd have to add plus one to the tally for the CZ Planar 1.7 or 1.4 (have 'em both). _________________ Alex |
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revers
Joined: 13 May 2010 Posts: 574 Location: In the country just north of Toronto Canada
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 10:48 am Post subject: |
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revers wrote:
Here is a link to the post Franco.
http://forum.mflenses.com/four-50s-compared-t28276.html _________________ Ron
Olympus OM-D E-M5, 14-42 & 45/1.8.
Panasonic G1, GF1, 14-45, 45-200 & various legacy lenses.
Canon S5, Sony 1.7 Tele-converter & Raynox DCR 150 Macro converter. |
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djmike
Joined: 01 Apr 2009 Posts: 930 Location: Taiwan
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Posted: Mon Jul 05, 2010 2:50 pm Post subject: |
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djmike wrote:
One thing I am sure that you will have a batch of 50mm lenses soon..... _________________
DSLR: Canon 400D
SLR: Nikon FM2 + Canon A-1 + Canon AE1-P + Praktica MTL-5B + Pentax Spotmatic F + Fujica ST801 + Voigtlander Bassematic + Voigtlander Vito + Rollei 35S + Rolleiflex SL35 ME + Canon QL17 GIII + Olympus Pen EE-3
Lenses
M42: CZJ Flektogon 35/2.4 + CZJ Flektogon Zebra 35/2.8 + CZJ Pancolar 50/1.8 + CZJ Sonnar 135/3.5 + CZJ Tessar 50/2.8 Chrome + Pentacon 135/2.8 + Pentacon 50/1.8 + SMC Takumar 50/1.4 + SMC Takumar 55/2 + SMC Takumar 135/3.5 + Fujinon 55/1.8 + Jupiter-9 85/2 + Jupiter-37A 135/3.5 + Helios 44-6 58/2
Nikor: Nikkor 50/1.4 + Nikkor 28/3.5 + Nikkor 35-105 Zoom + 36-72 Series E Zoom
Canon: Canon FD + 28/2.8 + 50/1.8 + Canon 35-105 Macro Zoom
Other: Rollei Planar HFT 50/1.8
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