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Panorama and panorama
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PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 3:52 pm    Post subject: Panorama and panorama Reply with quote
I was with a friend recently that was frusterated because they couldn't get the scene into one picture. I suggested panorama and I just got back a blank stare. This is someone that has been shooting pictures for years.

Sometimes we forget the posibility of panorama. We forget the panorama and buy a wide angle lens instead.

I just want to remind people about panoramas. They are easy to make and software to put pictures togather has gotten very good and it's usually free.

I have gotten good results with no tripod, nothing but a few simple steps.
Use manual exposure set to the most important part of the picture.
Leave some overlap, more is better than not enough.
Shoot frames vertically to give you more room to crop.
Rotate your body around your camera, not the camera around your body.
Panorama isn't just for scenery. It can work all the way down to macro too.
Avoid real wide angle lenses until you really know how to correct them.


I wanted to shoot some rifles at FULL scale. Panorama was the answer.
I wanted a water tower pic that was too tall. Panorama was the answer.

Panorama can be made from vertical as well as horizontal subjects. Get out there and try a few, maybe you'll become a panorama addict like me.

Here are a few examples.
Click the image for LARGER images only if you have a fast connection!

traditional 5 image panorama


3 HDR images stitched:


closeup 3 images


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for nice tips and captures...

For trying, its OK of not having tripod and Pano head. But texture/detailed oriented captures as well as the scenes where perspective plays a critical role, these 2 are must.

The rifle shot is perfect example, by magnifying, you can easily find the not so smooth (at 2 point, very harsh) merge of pics.


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I actually used a tripod on the rifle but not the scenes. Problem on the rifle was lens distortion and trying to correct it.. Still works well for the rifle, not the weave of the cloth behind it.

Here's another rifle that stitched better but my focus wasn't as good. Handheld but a different lens.



PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I am seeing artifact in rifle only.... But again, its a very good job done.. I am not able to do anywhere near to this...

I was talking about this...


I am finding the panorama of these (indoor material stuff) most difficult. Distortion control and movements are critical factor and I am finding (myself), capturing light blue sky in panorama almost impossible (fall off issue).

Thanks for thread... I am planning to do some panos in next few days..


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Arlon wrote:

Here's another rifle that stitched better but my focus wasn't as good. Handheld but a different lens.


I think you edited the thread Wink...

This is good... and I like the direction of barrel much better than earlier (I dont why)...


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ballu wrote:
Distortion control and movements are critical factor and I am finding (myself), capturing light blue sky in panorama almost impossible (fall off issue).

Thanks for thread... I am planning to do some panos in next few days..


One thing I found with the rifle that helped was to use a longer lens that got me further away.

I haven't had to many sky problems but I'm always in manual mode, auto ISO OFF, etc.

Biggest issue I have with sky is from moving clouds. I'm learning to use burst mode and just rotate and snap as fast as the camera will allow.

Find the busted clouds here:



PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 5:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3217/3007055603_240476533b_o.jpg



This was an ad-hoc, spur of the moment panorama, handheld, using a SMC Takumar 55/1.8 lens on a digital camera. The thing about making reduced size copies is you end up losing a bunch of detail...

You make an excellent point about doing these - they are fun and sometimes the only thing that does justice to the scene


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 6:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Agree there are just situations where nothing else will do justice.

This is at Mesa Verde, 3 pictures. This is also my favorite example of why to shoot most scenes vertical. This would have been a lot better with 4-5 vertical panels.

CLick for the LARGE version




Post up some more of your panos.


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
"Fall off" (extension of vignetting) phenomenon can not be avoided. Its just the scenario where it becomes prominent....

Try to get a panorama with open blue sky... most of the lenses (take all, frankly) will create ugly sky... I will try to post some examples...


PostPosted: Wed Nov 12, 2008 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Don't have much for blue sky..

This was shot with a tokina ATX 12-24, 4-5 panels. Definate change in sky color from side to side. Also a big bust in one of the tree reflections..




This 5 or 6 panel "smogarama" was shot offhand with my canon A530 P&S and also suffered from changing exposure from panel to panel. I think the real culprit was the sun was setting and changing the light almost from second to second. Might also have had auto white balance on which I always forget to change to a manual setting.



PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 8:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hello Gentleman, I´m reading thru this forum and came across this topic.
I understand how to make such a pictures, but how to connect them together? Any software recommended? Many thanks


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 9:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Milanos wrote:
Hello Gentleman, I´m reading thru this forum and came across this topic.
I understand how to make such a pictures, but how to connect them together? Any software recommended? Many thanks



If you wanna go the free-way, go for Hugin

http://hugin.sourceforge.net/

If you wanna go the pro-way, go for PTGui

http://www.ptgui.com/

You can also just try out PTGui.


I use PTGui to create most of my 360 panos:







Using a tripod without a panorama head really isn't a smart thing to do, because the problem isn't steady hands, it's parallax; you want to swing the camera while you keep the NPP (No Parallax Point a.k.a. Nodal Point, etc.) stationary. Therefore, if you don't have a panohead, it's actually better to shoot handheld.

Search for "nodal point" "Panorama" and read up on what people have to say. E.g.,


http://archive.bigben.id.au/tutorials/360/photo/nodal.html


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Arlon wrote:
Find the busted clouds here:


Sorry for late reply, but that must be either the Golar Freeze or the Golar Frost Shocked


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rawhead
how do you make these 360° panoramas, please?


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
Rawhead
how do you make these 360° panoramas, please?



You have to create a full 360 degree circular panorama, or something very close to it. Here's how I do it, roughly, but you don't have to have/use the same equipment/technique:


1. Use wide fisheye (I recently got a Sunex 5.6mm Super Fisheye, which is a circular fisheye with 185deg FOV), and take how ever many shots you need horizontally to cover 360deg. With the Sunex, I technically need only 2 shots (FOV>180deg), but for IQ purposes, I take 3 shots @ 120 deg rotation.

2. Take zenith (straight up) and nadir (straight down) shots --> nadir is especially important if you use a tripod, because you need to get rid of the tripod from the pic to make it look nice Wink


3. Stitch them all in PTGui to create a 360deg (horizontal) x 180deg (vertical) circular panorama, using Equirectangular projection;


4. After that's done, I'll usually export a .psd with the unstiched layers, so that I can retouch the stiched layers getting rid of ghosting artifacts; e.g., if a person walks in front of your frame during exposure, you might have half a person in the pano; if you have the original picture left in a photoshop layer, you can just clone over the rest of that person onto the final pano. When everything looks clean, I export as .jpg

5. Open .jpg in Hugin (for some reason, Hugin does this better) as an Equirectangular photo, and reproject it as a "Stereographic projection". The pitch or the roll or one of those parameters has to be set to 90 degrees in order for the final product to become like these little planets.




There's a bit of a learning curve, but once you get the hang of it, it's wicked fun Wink


If you want to get into this without spending hundreds of dollars on equipment (I bought a $700 fisheye, $350 Canon EOS, and a $100 pano head just to do this; and I'm currently looking at a $300 pano head... yes, I'm crazy Wink, you can easily by buying a Peleng 8mm and using the Philopod technique mentioned in the link I gave above


http://archive.bigben.id.au/tutorials/360/photo/nodal.html



If you have an APS-C, you can create a 360˚ pano with just 4 shots using what's called the "Pitch Variation method"






Not as clean as the two I put up there, mainly because this was the first time ever that I tried this pitch variation method using an 8mm fisheye. This was with a Peleng on my EOS Kiss F (Rebel XS), with just 4 shots.


If you get good at it, you can probably take shots that are almost as clean as the ones I have above. All for just $300 Wink)


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thank you very much!
What about nadir shot, how do you get rid of your feet/legs?


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Very impressive the 360° pieces. I have to try to get the soft somewhere and start playing with it Very Happy


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
Thank you very much!
What about nadir shot, how do you get rid of your feet/legs?



You have to step away and extend your arms as far as you can Laughing


PTGui's most recent version has a great feature that will compensate for change in perspective, so you can actually really step away, take the final nadir shot at an angle, and stitch that together with the rest of the pano shots. Thats what I did with the second shot that says Boston University. See how the nadir is perfect Wink


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
rawhead wrote:
Orio wrote:
Thank you very much!
What about nadir shot, how do you get rid of your feet/legs?

You have to step away and extend your arms as far as you can Laughing
PTGui's most recent version has a great feature that will compensate for change in perspective, so you can actually really step away, take the final nadir shot at an angle, and stitch that together with the rest of the pano shots. Thats what I did with the second shot that says Boston University. See how the nadir is perfect Wink


Thanks, I figured that you did something like that. Smile

Is it possible with PTGui to save the final image in HDR format?


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes it is, and PTGui will actually do basic tonemapping for you if you want as well. You can just throw all your bracketed photos at it; it's actually great because it has better alignment engine that e.g., Photomatix, so you can actually do handheld HDR no problem Smile


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
rawhead wrote:
Yes it is, and PTGui will actually do basic tonemapping for you if you want as well. You can just throw all your bracketed photos at it; it's actually great because it has better alignment engine that e.g., Photomatix, so you can actually do handheld HDR no problem Smile


Great!
What about the head? I read about the Manfrotto 303SPH
http://services.manfrotto.com/303SPH/
but heck it costs 500 Euros Sad


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:

Great!
What about the head? I read about the Manfrotto 303SPH
http://services.manfrotto.com/303SPH/
but heck it costs 500 Euros Sad



Jeebus! If you wanna really go pro, perhaps, but Manfrotto is just out of this world expensive.

Much more reasonable: Nodal Ninja

http://www.nodalninja.com/

Both 3 and 5 are supposed to be good. I'm looking at the NN180, as I now have a 180˚ circular fisheye Wink


Or, if you want to start by playing around, you can buy what I bough a year ago: Panosaurus

http://gregwired.com/pano/Pano.htm

$75 Wink


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
thanks for the suggestions, I did not know of these heads.


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
rawhead wrote:




Your shots nicely proves, that the Earth is really round Smile


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 3:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
Great!
What about the head? I read about the Manfrotto 303SPH
http://services.manfrotto.com/303SPH/
but heck it costs 500 Euros Sad


The Manfrotto 303SPH is a heavyweight, well build (italy) but hard to carry and too expensive. The problem is that the added weight of the 303sph+cam+lens requieres a rockstable tripod. And if you shoot with a 180° spherical lens, you'll see the upper arm in the left corner of every frame - known problem with the 303sph.
I would suggest the nodal ninja too. A friend of mine is very happy with it.
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