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Take a stab at the Super Takumar 50mm F1.4 pair?
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PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Last edited by wildlight images on Sat Sep 13, 2014 5:31 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 7:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Last edited by wildlight images on Sat Sep 13, 2014 5:01 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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Last edited by wildlight images on Sat Sep 13, 2014 5:29 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Fri Sep 12, 2014 9:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
wildlight images wrote:
kuuan wrote:
There are reports of copies that have signs of both and 8 and 7 element version, I once presented such a case here in this forum: http://forum.mflenses.com/hybrid-3rd-version-of-super-takumar-f1-4-50mm-t55617.html
That 'hybrid' has most of the signs of the 8 element, though the IR mark looks distinctive to that of other 8 element version copies it is located like on an 8 element version, only the rear glass looks more like that of a 7 element. To find out what it really was, a element, I I had to open it up and compare it's lens elements to those of obvious 8 and 7 element versions ( photos had been lost, I just updated the most important ones, hopefully can show the others later, once I have access to them, again too )
xxx

Thanks very much for this bit of info. I looked at your link and thread; and my #164xxxx appears to fits between the hybrid and the 7 element version. It has the red line to the left side of the 4 although an A and M not a Auto and Man, and it still has a 2 and not a dot. What about aperture blades? When does the 8 aperture blade version kick in on these?


Was there ever an 8 aperture blade version?
That certainly applied to versions of the 2.5/135 but not sure about the 1.4/50
OH


PostPosted: Sat Sep 13, 2014 2:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
wildlight images wrote:
Both samples of my 2 lenses here are equally "convex" (if that's what you meant and not concave) and I used a piece of copying paper as a sort of straight edge, so neither is flat and neither curve inwardly (concave). I think that larger protective ring/collar distorts perceptions and it is too small for my large hands to easily remove, if I could twist that off I could better show that the rear elements on my 2 samples are both convex curves and the same exact sizes in diameter and in the length they protrude.

The difference perceived is an optical illusion created by a bigger and more protective like ring/collar.


I use the same method as you and turned both lenses to infinity and for sure that one is flat and other not. Anyway, as we now there are different versions of those lenses out there and yours are simply different than mine...

Short story you have one 8-element and one 7-element.

I was not able to see the difference between them, but also did not test them properly as well and if they exist I think that they are not marginal. Cool


PostPosted: Sat Sep 13, 2014 6:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
kuuan wrote:
Lightshow wrote:
Did you ever open it up to count the elements?


that's exactly what I did, check the photos in the linked thread ( some photos there still 'lost', but the one showing the cemented groups, only the one of the 8 element being 'thicker' pointing at consisting of 3 elements, the others being 'thinner' indicating that they must consist of 2 elements, I just updated and can be seen ( last post on page 2 )

Interesting, I missed the last half of the thread.
I'd have to say it seems to be a transition lens, possibly a test run with the IR marking done to resemble the 8 but in the new body, then the optical block was further refined in the final version.
Some controlled tests would be interesting, MFD, bokeh, flare, resolution.


PostPosted: Sat Sep 13, 2014 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I too have actually 2 of the 7 element and 1 of the 8 element super tak 50 1.4. I "hunted down" the 8 element via photo analysis after learning on here about the IR marking to avoid paying the premium sought by purveyors. It worked and I notice a dramatic difference in the bulge of the rear element, so much so that it has been damaged (fortunately not badly damaged, but unfortunately the only thing keeping the lens from mint condition) by a previous owner who must have set it down on rear element at some point. I have not done any serious comparos with them but hand held snaps I could not tell any difference.


PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 3:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I am new to the forum, having just purchased a Super Takumar 50/1.4. My lens is a V2 7-element based on the IR indicator being to the left of the 4, and also because of the flat rear element. The serial number is 1646801. Of note, though, is that it has the M and A, rather than manual and auto, indicators. It also has the f2 instead of the dot on the aperture ring. The M/A tab has 37800 on the underside. Given the rather low serial number, maybe it has a mix of parts? I found the lens sitting with original rear cap, aftermarket front cap, and original case, at an antique mall. I paid $25 for it. it appears to be in excellent shape. I plan to buy adapters to use it with my Fuji XE-2 and also my Canon EOS-M (attached to the EF-S to EF converter).


PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
M6hm wrote:
...The serial number is 1646801...

Welcome, M6hm.

I find curious the serial number of your Supertak. Mine is a 8 elements and has a serial number higher than yours, 1648626. This proves that the numbering is not a decisive data to determine, so a Super Takumar 8 elements, which must have:

Mark IR on right 4 diafragm scale.
About 1 mm protuberance in the rear element, without metal protection around.
Letters A and M in selector diaphragm.
Weight 245 grams exactly.

Please, someone correct me if I'm wrong Very Happy
And now a few pictures made with Supertak 8 elements:

At f/1.4







And others at f/4-5.6, infinity focus:







Happy shots!


PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 5:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thank you for the welcome, Anktonio. Glad to see there are 8-element lenses with a serial number higher than mine. I will try to post a couple photos of my lens in a separate post, so you can see if you agree my lens is a bit of a mix!


PostPosted: Mon Feb 16, 2015 6:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote




PostPosted: Tue Feb 17, 2015 1:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The job done by the member Kuuan has an historical quality.

It's a must to read before to buy a takumar 50/1,4 lens.


PostPosted: Thu Feb 19, 2015 5:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'd just like to add that you really can't go ONLY by the infrared mark. You have to take into account the serial number and look for the protruding rear element. Once the serial number gets high enough you may find 8-element style infrared marks but no protruding rear element (using up leftover part on the new optical design).

Here is an interesting case that I had. (May still have it somewhere... will have to look.)


Look closely. It is NOT an 8 element.
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