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dekiller
Joined: 04 Jun 2008 Posts: 133 Location: Macao
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 4:29 pm Post subject: Tair-11 or Tair-11A? |
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dekiller wrote:
For the same price, which to choose? Who performs better?
To be used on DSLR, Thanks. |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
They are pretty different lens for artistic pictures I vote old silver finish Tair-11. Tair-11A is a modern contrasty sharp lens. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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dekiller
Joined: 04 Jun 2008 Posts: 133 Location: Macao
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 5:36 pm Post subject: |
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dekiller wrote:
From your gallery, I feel Tair-11 is better, too. Since those pictures came from different scence, it is really hard to compare.
BTW, doyou have one for sale. |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:13 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
Currently I don't have any on sale.Might be I sell my old one if you willing to pay higher price than average I won't sell this old beauty on low price. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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themoleman342
Joined: 21 Oct 2007 Posts: 2190 Location: East Coast (CT), U.S.A.
Expire: 2013-01-24
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:17 pm Post subject: |
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themoleman342 wrote:
There are several things to just keep in mind. The tair 11 is a zenit m39 mount while the 11A is m42. They have slightly different register distances (about .3mm) but it is often enough to throw off infinity focus, at least on my zenit B. I can't really speak about the qualities of the 11 but despite what Attila said, and this obviously can just be my copy, the 11A does not have high contrast. I've heard many others make similar comments. But it is surprisingly sharp. It gives a wavy bokeh when wide open and the 20 blade aperture gives beautiful circular highlights when stopped down.
~Marc |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
Tair 11A has T-Mount I saw already with Nikon, M42 and M39 mount. Tair-11 133mm f2.8 has M39 mount only. They are all lovely lens I suggest to take both. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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dekiller
Joined: 04 Jun 2008 Posts: 133 Location: Macao
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 10:14 pm Post subject: |
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dekiller wrote:
They are both expensive, or not cheap nowadays. At least higher than Jena, Meyer, and Takumar. |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Sat Jul 19, 2008 10:22 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
Yes it is depend , but not too high. _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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Riku
Joined: 23 May 2007 Posts: 1059 Location: Finland
Expire: 2017-04-30
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Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:10 am Post subject: |
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Riku wrote:
I have both. My two best lenses Silver version doesn't quite focus infinity on K100D.
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dekiller
Joined: 04 Jun 2008 Posts: 133 Location: Macao
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Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:21 am Post subject: |
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dekiller wrote:
Beautiful pictures |
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Riku
Joined: 23 May 2007 Posts: 1059 Location: Finland
Expire: 2017-04-30
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Posted: Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:03 am Post subject: |
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Riku wrote:
Thanks! Both lenses are great, I don't see any difference in pictures. 11A is recommended because possible infinity focus problems with 11. |
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rayatphonix
Joined: 24 Mar 2008 Posts: 28
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 1:44 pm Post subject: Infinity Focus Question |
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rayatphonix wrote:
I've got the Tair 11 (silver) and I use it on an EOS body. I feel that I get infinity focus, but how do I confirm? I know this is a dumb question, but I usually (OK always) use this as a portrait-type lens and assumed infinity focus. Is the obvious answer to turn the barrel all the way to it's stop and pixel peep? I can focus on something 100' or so away and I get good focus and I'm awfully close to the end of the rotaion. Should I take a picture at both and compare?
I went with the Tair 11 as I was trying to get the "look" of my Helios-40 with a longer focal length. I'm very happy with my lens although I've not had the chance to use it as much as I'd like. |
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themoleman342
Joined: 21 Oct 2007 Posts: 2190 Location: East Coast (CT), U.S.A.
Expire: 2013-01-24
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:07 pm Post subject: |
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themoleman342 wrote:
Quote: |
I went with the Tair 11 as I was trying to get the "look" of my Helios-40 with a longer focal length. |
Has the lens meet with your expectations in that sense? I'm curious only for the fact that they follow very different lens designs (sonnar-tair vs. double gauss-helios) and this often dictates at least some of their characteristics. |
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rayatphonix
Joined: 24 Mar 2008 Posts: 28
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 2:46 pm Post subject: Tair 11 performance |
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rayatphonix wrote:
I'm very happy with the lens. I've not been able to match the extreme bokeh of the old Helios but I've not really tried. I'm still learning the ins and outs of my Helios and have yet to get the bokeh effects the Helios is known for on every shot. I am getting closer though. I expect my Tair to come with a learning curve too.
Research on the net and comparisons of photos others had taken made me believe that the Tair 11 would come closer the the Helios bokeh than the 11A and it would be my better choice. The price was excellent (less than $50) so I thought I'd give it a shot. I've got the Canon 135L, so I wasn't after a sharp lens; I was after one with different effects.
At lunch time I plan on taking my camera, lens, tripod, etc to do an informal test for infinity focus. I'll bring my most willing subjects, my dogs, and test for bokeh.
FWIW, I took a picture with an Olympus 50mm 1.4 that had this astounding, unusual bokeh. I struggled to duplicate it and I began searching the web for answers. I didn't get a good answer, but I learned about the Helios as part of my research; the effect was startlingly similar. I love the look for certain subjects and want the ability to duplicate it as needed. I'm still learning but as I do this as a hobby, it's taken me a while. |
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rayatphonix
Joined: 24 Mar 2008 Posts: 28
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 5:05 pm Post subject: |
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rayatphonix wrote:
I did a very quick test for infinity focusing a few minutes ago. The basics:
EOS 5D, iso 200, tripod & cable release Tair 11, F 8.0 Conditions were overcast. I shot RAW.
It appears that I may indeed have difficulty with infinity focus. It only becomes visable between 300 & 400% blow-up and at smaller magnifications is undetectable on my laptop. My 50 year old eyes could also contribute.
I'll run a better/more accurate test later this week after I figure out exactly how I want to do it. At that time I'll attach the photos for those that are interested. Sorry for the statement that I made concerning infinity focus. For my photography it's not an issue, for others it may be. |
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rayatphonix
Joined: 24 Mar 2008 Posts: 28
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 5:07 pm Post subject: |
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rayatphonix wrote:
To the moleman - I didn't run a bokeh test. I'll try that later in the week. |
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Riku
Joined: 23 May 2007 Posts: 1059 Location: Finland
Expire: 2017-04-30
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 6:02 pm Post subject: |
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Riku wrote:
themoleman342 wrote: |
Quote: |
I went with the Tair 11 as I was trying to get the "look" of my Helios-40 with a longer focal length. |
Has the lens meet with your expectations in that sense? I'm curious only for the fact that they follow very different lens designs (sonnar-tair vs. double gauss-helios) and this often dictates at least some of their characteristics. |
Tair is sharper and has smoother bokeh. Helios is only sharp at the center (even on a crop camera) and bokeh highlights are oval shaped on the corners. Helios is much faster and perfect for portraits if you place your subject at the center. |
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patrickh
Joined: 23 Aug 2007 Posts: 8551 Location: Oregon
Expire: 2011-11-18
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Posted: Mon Jul 21, 2008 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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patrickh wrote:
These are very good descriptions of the lenses as I know them too. I love both and each has it's peculiar characteristics as described by the previous posters.
patrickh _________________ DSLR: Nikon D300 Nikon D200 Nex 5N
MF Zooms: Kiron 28-85/3.5, 28-105/3.2, 75-150/3.5, Nikkor 50-135/3.5 AIS // MF Primes: Nikkor 20/4 AI, 24/2 AI, 28/2 AI, 28/2.8 AIS, 28/3.5 AI, 35/1.4 AIS, 35/2 AIS, 35/2.8 PC, 45/2.8 P, 50/1.4 AIS, 50/1.8 AIS, 50/2 AI, 55/2.8 AIS micro, 55/3.5 AI micro, 85/2 AI, 100/2,8 E, 105/1,8 AIS, 105/2,5 AIS, 135/2 AIS, 135/2.8 AIS, 200/4 AI, 200/4 AIS micro, 300/4.5 AI, 300/4.5 AI ED, Arsat 50/1.4, Kiron 28/2, Vivitar 28/2.5, Panagor 135/2.8, Tamron 28/2.5, Tamron 90/2.5 macro, Vivitar 90/2.5 macro (Tokina) Voigtlander 90/3.5 Vivitar 105/2.5 macro (Kiron) Kaleinar 100/2.8 AI Tamron 135/2.5, Vivitar 135/2.8CF, 200/3.5, Tokina 400/5,6
M42: Vivitar 28/2.5, Tamron 28/2.5, Formula5 28/2.8, Mamiya 28/2.8, Pentacon 29/2.8, Flektogon 35/2.4, Flektogon 35/2.8, Takumar 35/3.5, Curtagon 35/4, Takumar 50/1.4, Volna-6 50/2.8 macro, Mamiya 50/1.4, CZJ Pancolar 50/1,8, Oreston 50/1.8, Takumar 50/2, Industar 50/3.5, Sears 55/1.4, Helios 58/2, Jupiter 85/2, Helios 85/1.5, Takumar 105/2.8, Steinheil macro 105/4.5, Tamron 135/2.5, Jupiter 135/4, CZ 135/4, Steinheil Culminar 135/4,5, Jupiter 135/3.5, Takumar 135/3.5, Tair 135/2.8, Pentacon 135/2.8, CZ 135/2.8, Taika 135/3.5, Takumar 150/4, Jupiter 200/4, Takumar 200/4
Exakta: Topcon 100/2.8(M42), 35/2.8, 58/1.8, 135/2.8, 135/2.8 (M42), Kyoei Acall 135/3.5
C/Y: Yashica 28/2.8, 50/1.7, 135/2.8, Zeiss Planar 50/1.4, Distagon 25/2.8
Hexanon: 28/3.5, 35/2.8, 40/1.8, 50/1.7, 52/1.8, 135/3.2, 135/3.5, 35-70/3.5, 200/3.5
P6 : Mir 38 65/3.5, Biometar 80/2.8, Kaleinar 150/2.8, Sonnar 180/2.8
Minolta SR: 28/2.8, 28/3.5, 35/2.8, 45/2, 50/2, 58/1.4, 50/1.7, 135/2.8, 200/3.5
RF: Industar 53/2.8, Jupiter 8 50/2
Enlarg: Rodagon 50/5,6, 80/5,6, 105/5.6, Vario 44-52/4, 150/5.6 180/5.6 El Nikkor 50/2,8,63/2.8,75/4, 80/5,6, 105/5.6, 135/5.6 Schneider 60/5.6, 80/5.6, 80/4S,100/5.6S,105/5.6,135/5.6, 135/5.6S, 150/5.6S, Leica 95/4 |
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dekiller
Joined: 04 Jun 2008 Posts: 133 Location: Macao
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 6:31 am Post subject: |
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dekiller wrote:
M39 and M42 USSR lenses have the same register distance. |
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themoleman342
Joined: 21 Oct 2007 Posts: 2190 Location: East Coast (CT), U.S.A.
Expire: 2013-01-24
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Posted: Fri Aug 08, 2008 1:28 pm Post subject: |
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themoleman342 wrote:
Quote: |
M39 and M42 USSR lenses have the same register distance. |
Actually they don't. M42 - 45.5 M39 - 45.2. It is enough to throw off infinity focus, at least on my zenit.
~Marc |
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