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R09 Spezial dilutions
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PostPosted: Mon Oct 11, 2010 11:35 am    Post subject: R09 Spezial dilutions Reply with quote
I have a small bottle of R09 Spezial I want to try with a roll of HP5+. I haven't used it before. The Massive Dev chart for Studional says 1+15 dilution for 4 minutes at 20°. This seems a bit fierce, is it really the best formula? I'd like to give it a while longer in the tank, 8 minutes or more. What dilution should I use?

Last edited by peterqd on Mon Oct 18, 2010 12:32 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 12:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nobody? If I double the dilution to 1:30 can I double the time, or is that too simple?


PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
peterqd wrote:
Nobody? If I double the dilution to 1:30 can I double the time, or is that too simple?


I think that is worthwhile to try, Peter. If these are shots you REALLY care
about, you might want to go the safe, tried, and sure route with something
else. (If it were me I'd go with 1:50 and do 60 mins, stand dev.)

Freestyle is still out of Adonal (Adox Rodinal) till the 19th. Sad


PostPosted: Wed Oct 13, 2010 10:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Katastrofo wrote:
peterqd wrote:
Nobody? If I double the dilution to 1:30 can I double the time, or is that too simple?


I think that is worthwhile to try, Peter. If these are shots you REALLY care
about, you might want to go the safe, tried, and sure route with something
else. (If it were me I'd go with 1:50 and do 60 mins, stand dev.)

Freestyle is still out of Adonal (Adox Rodinal) till the 19th. Sad

Thanks Bill. This roll is full of shots of Montmartre district in Paris, so they are important to me. I was trying to find some of the locations in the film "Le Ballon Rouge". All the old bombsites and derelict buildings in the film have gone now, but it's still a great place for pics. Somehow my memory was that the film was shot in B&W but I was wrong. Anyway, I still think B&W will be more suitable for what I want.

I went out today and shot a roll of PanF and I'm going to cut it in two and develop each half separately in different dilutions as a test before I attempt the HP5.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2010 6:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The Massive Development Chart (MDC) is pretty accurate so I would use that as a starting point. If the shots are important I would shot a test roll of HP5 1st; I found to the expense of a roll of 3200iso Delta that the MDC is not flawless. Crying or Very sad

I tend to use 1:50 Rodinal (not special) as I like the way the tones look and it makes it easier to work with digitally. Used at 1:50 you probably have a lifetime supply so lots of experimentation.


PostPosted: Mon Oct 18, 2010 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Well, I did the test roll of PanF+ for 4 minutes at 1:15 as per the Massive Dev chart but the film was grossly underdeveloped. Glad I didn't use the HP5 Paris roll! I read that R09 Spezial is pretty useless with HP5.

I can't work out what went wrong. I was very careful with times and temperatures but the images are very thin indeed and I can only just about make out the maker's text on the edge of the film. The fixer I used is quite old, could that make a difference?

Anyway, I'm going to ditch all my chemicals and start with a new lot. This time I'm going to try Ilfotec LC29, which I think is probably going to be better suited for me as a low-volume user, rather than DD-X.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 21, 2010 6:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Peter - It just sounds as though it was not enough time. I've had positive results with HP5 & Rodinal. I'd suggest sacrificing another roll but cut it in 3 or 4 pieces so that you can run a few tests. I would suggest developing times for 1600 or 3200iso 1st and going from there (make sure you use the same camera).

Have you got a shot of a neg so I can see? Not a scan, just a sample of how thin it is.


PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 10:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
martinsmith99 wrote:
Peter - It just sounds as though it was not enough time. I've had positive results with HP5 & Rodinal. I'd suggest sacrificing another roll but cut it in 3 or 4 pieces so that you can run a few tests. I would suggest developing times for 1600 or 3200iso 1st and going from there (make sure you use the same camera).

Have you got a shot of a neg so I can see? Not a scan, just a sample of how thin it is.

Thanks Martin. Here's a pic of one of the negs.

I agree with you, it seems like insufficient time to me too, although I gave it the full 4 minutes as per the Massive chart. The Agfa pdf actually says only 3 minutes for PanF+! This was a freshly-opened 250ml bottle of Spezial but I'd had it here for a couple of months. I'm going to bin it now.

I tried the HP5+ with Ilfotec LC29 yesterday and it seems fine, although there is a bit more grain than I expected. Pics will be in the B/W gallery soon.

Last edited by peterqd on Sat Oct 30, 2010 8:51 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes, that's 3-4 stops under by my eyes and looks like my 3200Delta and DDX roll recently. I guess the MDC isn't perfect.

If you do try Rodinal again, I use the standard version and MDC has done ok for numerous films.


PostPosted: Tue Oct 26, 2010 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
martinsmith99 wrote:
If you do try Rodinal again, I use the standard version

That was the mistake I made! Smile


PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 6:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I found Pan F and Rodinal at 1:50 to be very good. The contrast is reduced to a sensible level in that dilution.

As you know, being in the UK, we can only use 50 iso film 2 or 3 days a year. Laughing


PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 1:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
martinsmith99 wrote:
As you know, being in the UK, we can only use 50 iso film 2 or 3 days a year. Laughing

Don't I know it! Smile I'm not sure if you can push PanF, the Ilford fact sheet doesn't mention it. I've tried HP5 now and I'm disappointed that it's a bit too grainy for me. I'm going to stick with FP4 for those rare days when the sun shines, and Delta400 when it doesn't.

BTW, I realised this roll of PanF was bought with another one that went the same way (too thin) when I was testing shutter speeds on a Zorki 4. I'm wondering if it could have been a bad batch.


PostPosted: Sun Oct 31, 2010 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Possibly a duff batch.

What's your usual developer? I usually shoot HP5 at 200iso, but at 400 it's not bad. I use 1:50 Rodinal and invert 3x every 60 seconds.
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