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Pentax and full frame
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PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orio wrote:
AhamB wrote:

You can easily get banding out of a 5D or 40D, even at ISO 100, if you push the exposure one or two stops. The horizontal banding in dark areas can become very obvious.


Just to avoid misunderstandings: I was talking of noise banding, not colour banding (=posterization)


An interesting fact about posterisation is that is isn't really ever visible unless one increses the contrast in the area in question and uses relatively heavy noise reduction! Without noise reduction the natural fluctuations of photon shot noise hides posterisation well. The banding (the horizontal and/or vertical stripes with non-symmetric noise) on the other hand do not appear or disappear with conventional noise reduction. One can use FFT-tools, like the one in ImageJ, to reduce this problematic sensor behaviour, and often quite well.

Anyhow, I haven't followed the thread at all, but since camera sensors are of interest to me, I also want to comment on the banding, which is a strong feature of Canon non-professional cameras as well as many Pentax-cameras. The new K-5 is basicly totally free from banding though making it an excellent tool for very high ISO imaging (ISO 100k+).

Regarding the Canon banding, I have read that it at least on some models, is strongest on the lowest ISOs and mildest on the highest ones. This indicates that the source of it is rather late in the system - also it would explain why the pro-level Canons do not suffer from similar amounts of banding.


PostPosted: Mon Nov 29, 2010 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orio wrote:
@ Cooltouch:
banding is something that I see only in the latest Canon cameras. All digital cameras have high ISO noise, but only the latest Canons (amongst the cameras that I know) seem to have banding; for instance, the first 5D has bad 3200 ISO noise, but uniformly distributed. WHile the 5DII has less noise at 3200 ISO, but it tends to appear with banding shape. Which makes me think that banding is the result of the in camera noise reduction algorhythms, more than something like a "feature" of digital noise. If it was such a thing, it would show up in all cameras and brands.


AFAIK Canon banding is because of relatively cheap support electronics. This is the same reason why their dynamic range at the lower ISOs in much less than it could be. The sensor itself is good, but what happens outside of it pollutes the signal.

You also mentioned about seeing banding only n Canon's - try shooting with Pentax K20D and you'll have nightmares Smile Otherwise I really like K20D, but both the read noise and the banding do occasionally make me want to yell, especially when shooting indoors... maybe I'll win in the lottery in order to get the K-5...