Help needed: Wider than 24 on full frame?

plasticmotif · Joined: 17 Feb 2010 Posts: 55 Location: Tennessee

Hello all!

I've been searching and searching for a quality full frame lens to go wider than 24mm on my Canon 5d. I had the 16-35, 17-40 and the corner to corner sharpness left something to be desired.

The obvious answer is the 21 CZ or 14-24, however, I don't have the funding to afford either at the moment(new daughter). I guess the budget restriction knocks out 17-35 AIS, 18 2.8D, the two wide Zuikos too.

I don't care about speed as I will be using this as a landscape only lens. f8 to f16 superior sharpness would be dandy. (however, if i had a faster lens, of course I'd use it)

I'm not the least bit interested in the Sigma 12-24.

How are the Tamron 17/3.5, Tokina 17/3.5, Flektogon 20/2.8, CV 20/3.5? I've seen those selling for decent prices.

Also, I won't be buying until the review of the Samyang 14 comes out, it looked pretty decent over at lenstip.

tl;dr
Looking for MF glass wider than 24MM that's sharp corner to corner on full frame - under $700.

Thanks in advance - I know this question has been asked many times before, but I'm having difficulty selecting.

ManualFocus-G · Expire: 2014-11-24

Hmm, I think you'll struggle for sharp corner to corner TBH. I've seem C/Y Carl Zeiss 18mm primes go for £450.00, which is just about the top end of your budget.

I've also seen an Olympus 21/3.5 for £300.00 and Nikon 18/3.5 going for under £200.00, not sure if anyone knows about those two? I was under the impression that the Olly was pretty good...

ChrisLilley · Joined: 01 Jan 2008 Posts: 1767 Location: Nice, France

Nikon 18/3.5 is not going to please someone looking for edge to edge sharpness full frame.

I have the CV Skopar 20/3.5 but use it on DX, where the moustache distortion is not apparent, becoming just a barrel.

I have the Nikon 20/4, which I like, though I like the CV better.

Orio posted some great pics with Contax Zeiss 18mm MM; and said it was a 400 euro lens. I checked just now and there are not many on sale; which means the few that are, are from known 'higher-priced' merchants.

plasticmotif · Joined: 17 Feb 2010 Posts: 55 Location: Tennessee

I'm really thinking about trying the CV 20/3.5 APO. It's priced right and I've seen great pics come out of it. Seems to be very good stopped down to f8-f16.

I'd have stuck with the canons if they weren't so poor in the corners on full frame.

I forgot to mention I have the Tokina 11-16 now. It's fantastic-but has weird ghosting/CAs in the corner on full frame.

F16SUNSHINE · Expire: 2011-11-18

For landscapes take the Flek 2.8/20 or Zuiko 3.5/21 The Zuiko is so sweet and very small. Fit's easily inside of your budget.
All indicaters are that the Samyang 14mm will be more than acceptable.
The thing is. Do you want that wide. It's so far away from everything.
here is couple from 15mm on film. It's great for perspective and close in details but does it really give you the mid-far field details.
Below is a sample from a Zuiko 3.5/21 one of the absolute best values at 21mm as it's performance from 3m-infinity is superb. Super colors from this lens.

plasticmotif · Joined: 17 Feb 2010 Posts: 55 Location: Tennessee

Thanks for the replies! I'm on the lookout for a zuiko 3.5! I'm excited for the samyang!

All I've got to say is damn my eyes! Everyone I shoot with thinks 24 is wide enough on full frame...I perfer 18-20!

Pancolart · Expire: 2013-11-18

I can confirm sharpness on those:
ZENIT MIR-20M MC 3.5/20mm
VIVITAR (Kiron) 3.8/20mm
CARL ZEISS JENA FLEKTOGON (black version) 4/20mm
SOLIGOR Wide-Auto 3.8/21mm

kds315* · Expire: 2021-03-09

excellent examples Andy!

dab63 · Posted: Thu Feb 18, 2010 11:45 am Post subject:

I've same need too .. Smile

Anyone knows new Cosina-Voigtlander 20mm f/2.5 Color Skopar SL II ?

It comes in Canon mount too, and it is priced 500 EUR brand new

Of course the myth is Zeiss 21mm ZE mount .. but too expensive (at present Wink

)

BenediktW · Joined: 24 Jan 2008 Posts: 336 Location: Solingen, Germany

Esox lucius · Expire: 2011-11-18

BenediktW · Joined: 24 Jan 2008 Posts: 336 Location: Solingen, Germany

There are 2 types of the 20mm F4 Nikkor. Optically they´re identical. As a Canon user, it doesn´t matter, which version you buy.

One is the K-version (black, looks like Ai except for the clearance at the inner side of the aperture ring), and one is the Ai version.

Photosynthesis says:

K 20/4 103001 - 125156 - Aug74 - 1977 10/8 0.3 1:11 52 63.5 35.5 210 HN-14
Ai 20/4 130001 - 140763 - 1977 - Jan78 10/8 0.3 1:11 52 63.5 35.5 210 HN-14, HK-3

justtorchit · Joined: 12 Oct 2009 Posts: 269 Location: St. Louis, MO

Esox Lucius makes good points! I can confirm the Tokina 17mm will also leave you something to be desired in the corners even at smaller apertures. It's not a bad lens by any stretch, but in terms of what you are looking for, it certainly won't be much better than the lenses you've been using.

Boomer Depp · Expire: 2011-12-04

For those who like Nikkor....

The Nikkor 20/2.8 AI-S which probably one of the better wide Nikkors,with better contrast and a bit warmer and a hard lens to beat for the price.There are so many styles of shooting where it does well...and a big plus is the close range correction for closeups.

If you like shooting intense extreme sunny conditons the 20/3.5 AI-S is better corrected for ghosting and flaring then the 20/2.8 AI-S...plus it has CRC as well...for those who like a little distortion,this lens gives dramatic images...it's main drawback is it needs to be stopped down to f8 for corner sharpness.

The Nikkor 20/4 non-AI and AI has it's following and for what it does,it's a neat little lens...but needs to be stopped down for sharpness in the corners.

The Nikkor 18/3.5 AI-S is actually a favorite of mine...it does have soft corners wide open,but this improves quite nicely a stop or two down.

When I first shot the lens,I compared it to the Nikkor 20/2.8 and found the lens to be sharper with better color rendition.What surprised me was it had a less distortion then the Nikkor 20/2.8...

The lens also has a close range correction and will shoot as close as about six inches.The lens is quite sharp when shooting closeups with an awesome depth of field.

For close up shooting this lens should not be overlooked,especially with a crop sensor DSLR.

The lens is noted for some CA when shooting on film.

Unfortunately the lens does not shoot well on a full frame with vignetting wide open which was still barely visible stopped down to f11....but this could be corrected in lightroom...for this reason only,I wouldn't recommend for full frame DSLR's...

visualopsins · Expire: 2025-04-11

less expensive non-fisheye options include:

M42 Asahi Super- and Super-Multi-Coated Takumar 4/20

Tamron 3.5/17 either version (with or without built-in filters)

Spiratone 3.2/18 and 3.5/18

supahmario · Joined: 18 Mar 2009 Posts: 615 Location: Berlin, Germany

here two samples of the tokina 3.5/17. for me sharpness is not the main problem with this lens. flaring and CA is. i am shooting a lot of night shots... that's the reason i think about a CZ Distagon 4/18.

as far as i remember it was f8 or f11 for both shots

100% crop no sharpening applied

100% crop (edge left down)

even if i run into danger to make nonsense of my own post, i must admit that your budget allows you to get a real high performer in mf.

ChrisLilley · Joined: 01 Jan 2008 Posts: 1767 Location: Nice, France

supahmario · Joined: 18 Mar 2009 Posts: 615 Location: Berlin, Germany

wow... impressive how the scopar handles the lights in last shot. can you show a shot with the sun in the picture?

plasticmotif · Joined: 17 Feb 2010 Posts: 55 Location: Tennessee

lensrentals.com in the States has the Skopar 20/3.5 for renting. I'll probably try it out, see how it fares on my 5D....

I've got it narrowed down to Skopar 20/3.5, Samyang 14, Flektogon 20, Zukio 21(whichever one I can find for a decent price!)

I'll probably end up getting the 14 either way(I'm sold on samyang after owning the rokinon 85 1.4). Lenstip's review showed how good it was before they fixed it's 'issues'. For a price of 330 euro, you can't beat it.

Thanks for your help!

ChrisLilley · Joined: 01 Jan 2008 Posts: 1767 Location: Nice, France

supahmario · Joined: 18 Mar 2009 Posts: 615 Location: Berlin, Germany

WOWOWOW...

thanks for the examples. can you or anybody else point out, how it compares to the 4/18 distagon? i mean in sharpness, colors etc.!

Attila · Expire: 2025-11-18

Incredible samples Chris !

plasticmotif · Joined: 17 Feb 2010 Posts: 55 Location: Tennessee

wow is right.

i want that lens.

cooltouch · Joined: 15 Jan 2009 Posts: 9096 Location: Houston, Texas

I don't have any other lens of an equivalent focal length to my Tokina-made Vivitar 17mm f/3.5, so I can't offer a comparison. Plus, it's in Canon FD mount, so I don't have a DSLR to use with it, either. But that doesn't stop me from using it. I find that, for what it is, it does a good job.

Here's a digital duplicate of a slide I took back in December -- Kodak Elite Chrome 100. Taken with a Canon F-1, exposure unrecorded, but I'm figuring the aperture was most likely between f/8 and f/11.

To compare center-to-corner sharpness, here's a 100% crop of the center:

And a 100% crop of the top right corner.

The only post processing I did was use the clone brush to remove a few dust specks. A digital photo would show more detail, I'm sure, but this slide is sharp enough to show decent detail, I think.

CA is pretty well controlled, I think, although there is some evidence of flare in the corner image. As for sharpness fall-off toward the corner, yes it's noticeable, but not all that bad, really. For the money, I feel this lens is a good performer.

martinsmith99 · Expire: 2013-11-18

I recently bought a Vivitar 19mm in M42 mount for 21gbp. On my APS-C camera it looks pretty good at F5.6 and not bad wide open. As soon as the film is scanned I'll see how it performs in the real edges.