From the ground up: The T2i, Rokkors and a set of primes.

Papapishu · Joined: 26 Feb 2010 Posts: 38 Location: Bushwick, Brooklyn

I love this board. I mean it.

I know this is my first post. But you guys know your stuff. Every google search comes back here, so I thought it would behoove me to start posting.

I've been looking through the posts, and it's been an education. I'm a film guy new to photography, swayed and converted by my roomate's 7d. It's a fantastic camera, but looking into the internet I didn't imagine there would be so many options in terms of MF lenses.

He shoots with a set of Nikkor Primes. He loves them, swears by them. I'm almost certain I'm going to take the plunge and start building a collection. But I'd love some advice regarding some lenses.

So far, Rokkor's seem to be coming up a lot as a very fast lens that is sharp at wide apertures. How do they compare to Nikkors of the same focal length and apature? Would a well maintained Rokkor-X do favorably against a Nikkor? I imagine there are some exceptions (The Noct versus the f/1.2), but overall, do they compare? Are there any problems? (Rokkor Files only compares other rokkors to each other, so it's hard to tell)

I also heard that Rollei's HFT Planars compare favorably (albiet not the same, obviously) to Zeiss lenses, due to the company's history but that the mount crashes against the Canon mirror. Is that true across the board for Rollei lenses with cannon products? If so, are there any other lenses with similar build that don't?

Yashinons seem to be coming up a lot in my searches, although with a mixed opinons. Are they decently built?

Would anyone shooting on a Canon have any suggestions for a long time film guy trying to build up a set of lenses? Are there any dark horses that mire in attics yet show their stuff on the street?

Thanks in Advance, Appologies if this is a redundant thread.

Chris

ManualFocus-G · Expire: 2014-11-24

Welcome!

Minolta manual lenses won't mount on Canons, so unless you are considering a different manufacturer, I'd discount them.

For pure great quality images on a Canon, I'd stick to the fantastic Takumars in M42 mount, Zeiss lenses in Contax / Yashica (you'll need to spend a bit more!), Olympus lenses in OM mount or Nikon lenses in any Nikon F mount. Personally, I'm in love with Zeiss lenses!

Or, you could just get addicted like the rest of us and buy them all Confused

I hope you have a great stay and good luck with your purchases!

Esox lucius · Expire: 2011-11-18

Due to large volumes and big popularity opinions about fast 50mm lenses will differ from photographer to another. You will most likely be satisfied with almost any you pick. If not, you can get rid of yours by selling it for the same amount of money as you paid for a used one.

If f/1.2 is what you're looking for, I come to think of these to consider. Price differences are greater than IQ differences (if sharpness is your only measure):

Pentax SMC 50mm f/1.2
Nikon Nikkor 50mm f/1.2
Canon FD 55mm f/1.2
Minolta MD Rokkor 50mm f/1.2
Canon FD 55mm AL f/1.2
Yashica ML 55mm f/1.2
Olympus Zuiko 55mm f/1.2
Nikon Nikkor 55mm f/1.2
Konica Hexar 57mm f/1.2
Nikon Nikkor 58mm f/1.2

I'm a Nikon man so I don't know squat about adaptability to other bodies.

The Nikkor 58/1.2 is a lens for shooting wide open or at f/2. It is great wide open, but when stopped down detail is same with 50/1.2 Ai-S (Noct bokeh is better, IMO). Stopped down to f/4 or f/5.6 the 58/1.2 detail is less than with Nikkor 50/1.4 Ai-S same aperture.

Björn Rörslett mentioned somewhere in his site how the "Noct" 58/1.2 design applies to use like astrophotography, but due to strong field curvature close-ups will likely always have soft corners at wide open settings. Brick walls or newspaper test shots are not what that lens was designed for.

natebarnz · Expire: 2013-01-23

I have a Rokkor-PG 58mm 1.2 and a Nikkor-S 55mm 1.2 and the Rokkor is my absolute favorite lens. Of course this is just personal preference but these old Rokkors really have great character and colors. I would never discount my Nikkor-S though as it's a great and sharp lens. Both are always in my bag.

I have a 500D and have the Rokkor natively adapted to my EOS by Jim Buchanan http://www.jimbuchananspace.com/Camera_Services.html.

I recently got an 85mm 1.7 Rokkor thats heading to Jim soon too. Totally worth it in my opinion.

Attila · Expire: 2025-11-18

Welcome to aboard! Thank you for joining us!

peterqd · Expire: 2014-01-04

natebarnz · Expire: 2013-01-23

Here is a shot I took with my Rokkor-PG 58/1.2. This was before I got the mount converted and was taken with a BIG_IS adapter (w/ additional glass). I don't have any examples w/o the adapter yet but its much nicer, especially in higher light situations.

http://cgi.ebay.com/EMF-AF-Confirm-Minolta-MD-MC-Lens-To-Canon-EOS-Adapter_W0QQitemZ370329378734QQcmdZViewItemQQptZLens_Accessories?hash=item563959dfae

natebarnz · Expire: 2013-01-23

And here is a shot with my Nikkor-S 55/1.2. This is such a great lens and actually does much better than my Rokkor in very low light. It's not the Noct but its my Noct Smile

I couldn't get the fog this good with any other lens I have. Granted I don't have the ultimate collection but I do have a couple goodies.

dnas · Joined: 14 Nov 2008 Posts: 488 Location: Japan

I have a lot of all sorts of lenses (Rokkor, Nikon, Canon FD, Pentax K, Takumar, Konica Hexanon, Tokina AT-X, Olympus OM, etc), and there are some stand out Rokkors.

My favorite lens is the MD Rokkor 85mm F2. It is superb, better than the Nikon 85mm F1.8 that I have.

http://www.rokkorfiles.com/85mm%20Page%201.htm

peterqd · Expire: 2014-01-04

dnas, from your collection what is your favourite 35 lens?

bogolisk · Expire: 2011-11-18

I have the following 50mm

Rokkor-X 50mm 1.4
Rokkor-X 50mm 1.7
Minolta MD 50mm 1.4
Minolta MD 50mm 1.7
Minolta MD 50mm Macro 3.5
Rokkor-PG 58mm 1.4
Zuiko OM 50mm black-nose 1.4
Zuiko OM 50mm MIJ 1.8
Rokkor-X 45mm 2.0
Yashica ML 50mm 2.0
Yashica ML 50mm 1.7 (bidding on a 1.4)

My favorite is the Rokkor-X 50mm 1.7. It's not really special but some how it's such a reliable workhorse. It was also cheap, USD$7.00 (+ 8.00 for shipping.)

Minolta glass is (used to be) usually cheaper than m42 or yashica because they cannot be used on Canon bodies. Now that m4/3 is so popular, prices start going up.

Papapishu · Joined: 26 Feb 2010 Posts: 38 Location: Bushwick, Brooklyn

Thanks for welcoming me aboard.

Oh no, let me clarify: I'm new to still photography. I have an HVX, and I'm a videographer and editor by trade, but handling DSLR bodies is new to me. I've shot on a Bolex and edited on a steenbeck, but all this is sorta nerdy stuff I havent yet sorted through.

So, even with an adaptor the Minoltas don't work? I'm sort of confused, because of things like this http://vimeo.com/7281896 and this http://vimeo.com/9080446. Why specifically don't they work? Does it have to do with the mirror, the availability of adaptors or is it something stupid that I'm overlooking due to my stupid ignorance in the field? (Again, I'm seriously new to all of this).

Speaking of the M42's, is there a compatibility guide for EOS cameras? I'd love to get a few good Russian lenses, but I was labouring under the impression that the rear elements of the old russian screw mounts messed up the inner workings of the camera.

And to clarify; I'm not just interested in 1.2 50mm lenses. I'm interested in a fast set of fixed lenses of various focal lengths. Fisheye, Telephoto, wide; you name it. I just want a comprehensive set going.

ManualFocus-G · Expire: 2014-11-24

The Minoltas will only work with 4/3rds cameras due to ther short register distance (I think I got that the right way round!). They CAN be adapted to Canon EOS by experts who will change the mount physically and re-work the focusing setting, but it will likely be expensive. The other option is to use an optical adapter, but this will increase the crop factor and likely lower image quality across the plane.

For info, a 50mm lens on a crop sensor Canon EOS (like the 7D or 450D) will result in a lens with an effective focal length of 80mm. Great tor getting fast portrait lenses cheap, but annoying for wide angle usage. The only alternative is to buy a full frame Eos 5D or 5D mark II which has a full 35mm sized frame, so 50mm = 50mm Smile

peterqd · Expire: 2014-01-04

Chris, let me explain.

When you use a camera and lens combination of different brands there are two issues to overcome. The first is how to physically mount the lens on the camera. Generally, each manufacturer has its own individual system (and sometimes more than one). If the size of the bayonet mount on a lens is smaller than on the camera then it is feasible to make a separate adapter with male and female ends which will fit on the lens and fit into the camera mount. The Canon EOS mount is larger than most, so many other brands of lenses can be physically mounted.

The second issue is the register distance, also known as the back focus distance. Each brand has its own particular distance at which the lens must be mounted from the film or sensor surface in order that the focus scale is correct. If a lens has a longer back focus than the camera, infinity focus will be achieved before the lens hits the infinity stop - it will actually focus "beyond infinity". At the other end, it won't be possible to extend the lens away from the film and the distance the lens will focus on will be greater than the focus scale indicates. This can be corrected by designing the adapter to have a thickness which mounts the lens at the correct distance from the film plane. Conversely, if the lens has a smaller back focus than the camera, it will never be able to focus on infinity unless it is mounted closer to the film than the camera allows.

The back focus distances for different manufacturers are listed here:
http://www.markerink.org/WJM/HTML/mounts.htm

The Canon EOS back focus distance is 44.0mm. This means that an M42 lens with 45.5mm distance will be correctly mounted if the adapter is 1.5mm thick.

Rokkor lenses with a back focus of 43.5mm will not achieve infinity focus on a Canon unless either some way is found to bring the lens 0.5mm closer to the sensor, which means pysically altering either the camera or the lens. I've tried holding a Rokkor lens against the Canon mount and it won't focus beyond about 6m distance. The reason you can use Rokkors on 4/3 cameras is because the 4/3 back focus is 38.67mm, which allows an adapter flange thickness of 4.83mm.

The videos you posted were shot with Rokkor lenses that had been physically altered to suit the EOS mount using a kit. I've heard of a kit by Jim Buchanan costing around $70 on Ebay, but I haven't tried it. http://www.jimbuchananspace.com/Camera_Services.html
Our member koji has some converted lenses I believe, he might be able to help you more than me. Here's his page:
http://www.takagitechnology.com/minolta/id2.html
and this one http://www.takagitechnology.com/minolta/id2.html

About the mirror issue with M42 lenses, this only affects the 1D and 5D full frame cameras with larger mirrors and only a few lenses. There are a few threads about it in the forum. I've never heard of any problems using M42 lenses on the APS-C Canons like the 450D or the 7D, which have smaller mirrors.

walter g · Joined: 20 Feb 2010 Posts: 2463 Location: NC, USA

We talked about this recently on another thread. You can change the mount out. Easy to do and no mods to the camera.But it only works witb certain model Canon's.

If you have alot of Minolta lenses this is a good option.
I provided links with testing results ans where to buy in this thread.
http://forum.mflenses.com/new-member-new-question-t25650.html

peterqd · Expire: 2014-01-04

Thankyou Walter - I missed that!

Papapishu · Joined: 26 Feb 2010 Posts: 38 Location: Bushwick, Brooklyn

Thanks to everyone! My knowledge is semi-patchy, but I'm getting there.

In terms of the effect of the sensor size on focal length, believe me I already know all about that. In fact, coming from a film background, where a 35mm or so is a normal, it ends up working out kinda similar for me.