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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
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 Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:44 am Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
The Sigma Super-Wide I had was nowhere near the level of the Nikon and Konica 24mms I have, it wasn't as good as my Hoya (Tokina) 24mm either.
Maybe this says more about Sigma's QC than anything else, it would explain how some people can think it's a great lens and others think it's not very good.
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I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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guardian
Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 1746
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 2:58 pm Post subject: |
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guardian wrote:
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The Sigma Super-Wide I had was nowhere near the level of the Nikon and Konica 24mms I have, it wasn't as good as my Hoya (Tokina) 24mm either.
Maybe this says more about Sigma's QC than anything else, it would explain how some people can think it's a great lens and others think it's not very good. |
I think you make an excellent point, and it is very well taken. While it's fun for us to opine here regarding the various MF lenses, too often we pay scant heed to variations lens to lens. Add to that the fact many of our lenses are acquired in used condition, with unknowable provenance. It's no wonder our experiences, with the very same lens brand and model, can vary so widely!
Finally, and especially with a (primarily) third party manufacturer such as Sigma, there is an added consideration:
Sigma made the "Wide" series lenses (for example) to be fitted to many different camera bodies having a variety of register distances. So how did the splendid designers at Sigma pull this off? Did they mess with the lens barrels/mounts? Did they alter the optical parameters because doing so was less expensive than changing barrels? Or did they use a combination of the above-mentioned solutions? While I don't know the answer to that, not having been at Sigma "back in the day", I can understand that such lens-to-lens differences, mandated by need to achieve (whatever) register distance, could have resulted in lenses within the same series providing nevertheless a different photographic experience. |
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guardian
Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 1746
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:08 pm Post subject: |
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guardian wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
Why are you guys surprised the Sigma super wide II is a good lens  3-4 years ago, here and at other forums they were saying it's a hidden gem....so I got mine for £8  |
MF lens aficionados need to pool their money and hire a scientist to create for us a time machine. With time travel we could go back, even ten years, and clean up!!
Your £8 lens sells routinely today for north of £60 . . . . at least here in North America they do. 
Congratulations! You are a winner in life's lottery.
http://www.ebay.com/csc/i.html?_sacat=0&_nkw=sigma+super+wide&LH_Complete=1&LH_Sold=1&rt=nc
Last edited by guardian on Thu May 23, 2013 3:14 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:09 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The Sigma Super-Wide I had was nowhere near the level of the Nikon and Konica 24mms I have, it wasn't as good as my Hoya (Tokina) 24mm either.
Maybe this says more about Sigma's QC than anything else, it would explain how some people can think it's a great lens and others think it's not very good. |
Well true about QC, but did you try the Sigma on a film camera 
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:12 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
| guardian wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
| Why are you guys surprised the Sigma super wide II is a good lens 3-4 years ago, here and at other forums they were saying it's a hidden gem....so I got mine for £8 |
MF lens aficionados need to pool their money and hire a scientist to create for us a time machine. With time travel we could go back, even ten years, and clean up!!
Your £8 lens sells routinely today for north of £70 . . . . at least here in North America they do.
Congratulations! You are a winner in life's lottery. |
The secret is to have a film camera as a Canon FD Sigma wasn't popular back then. 
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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guardian
Joined: 18 Mar 2009
Posts: 1746
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:17 pm Post subject: |
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guardian wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
| guardian wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
| Why are you guys surprised the Sigma super wide II is a good lens 3-4 years ago, here and at other forums they were saying it's a hidden gem....so I got mine for £8 |
MF lens aficionados need to pool their money and hire a scientist to create for us a time machine. With time travel we could go back, even ten years, and clean up!!
Your £8 lens sells routinely today for north of £70 . . . . at least here in North America they do.
Congratulations! You are a winner in life's lottery. |
The secret is to have a film camera as a Canon FD Sigma wasn't popular back then. |
Yup. I did go back and amend my (earlier) post just a bit. And I added a reference. |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The Sigma Super-Wide I had was nowhere near the level of the Nikon and Konica 24mms I have, it wasn't as good as my Hoya (Tokina) 24mm either.
Maybe this says more about Sigma's QC than anything else, it would explain how some people can think it's a great lens and others think it's not very good. |
Well true about QC, but did you try the Sigma on a film camera |
Makes no difference whether on film or digital, that is a spurious point.
I bought the Sigma brand new in 1994, it did the job but I was never happy with it.
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I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 3:25 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The Sigma Super-Wide I had was nowhere near the level of the Nikon and Konica 24mms I have, it wasn't as good as my Hoya (Tokina) 24mm either.
Maybe this says more about Sigma's QC than anything else, it would explain how some people can think it's a great lens and others think it's not very good. |
Well true about QC, but did you try the Sigma on a film camera |
Makes no difference whether on film or digital, that is a spurious point.
I bought the Sigma brand new in 1994, it did the job but I was never happy with it. |
Well are you saying any old lens gives the same results no matter what digital camera you use (like for like)
This member seems to like his Sigma
http://forum.mflenses.com/comparison-pentax-24mm-sigma-super-wide-ii-24mm-t23367,highlight,%2Bsigma+%2B24mm.html
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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Brian Y
Joined: 06 Mar 2013
Posts: 6
Location: Calgary, Canada
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 4:29 pm Post subject: |
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Brian Y wrote:
I should add more on my own experience with the Sigma Super Wide 2. I got it initially for my Pentax since Pentax does not have too many affordable 24's. It was a AF version (Pentax KAF) and I love it. I also have Pentax 21, 43, 50 and 77. I also have other prime lens from Zeiss, Canon, Nikon, Konica and others. So I am familiar with good lenses.
The IQ of the Sigma SW2-24 matched those of my other good lenses. It became my favourite since I like 24 focal length in digital. Unfortunately I lost it in one of my trips. I missed it so much I replaced it with another one at about $200 about 2 years ago, also KAF. The IQ is similar but my feeling was it was just not quite as good as the first one but very close. It was this second one that I tested with the other 24mm lenses on a Nex5N (manual focused) and it still came out ahead. Please note that both my Sigma24 are the later AF and coated versions. I have no experience with the older manual focus versions.
My surprise was not with the Sigma but that the Nikon did not come out ahead and that the Miranda came out second, just ahead of the Nikon and others. I don't know who made the Miranda (a KA mount). I got it by accident since it came with an old film camera and other lenses I bought as a package for about $75. Now I mainly use the Miranda on my Nex5N (manual focus) and the Sigma on my Pentax 5 (AF). the Miranda is smaller and lighter than the Nikon and others.
Brian |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 4:46 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
Well are you saying any old lens gives the same results no matter what digital camera you use (like for like)
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No, of course not. I'm saying that a crap lens is a crap lens, whether you put it on a film camera or a digital camera.
However, sometimes 35mm film, particularly C41 colour print film, can hide some of the flaws of a lens, particularly in sharpness.
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I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
Well are you saying any old lens gives the same results no matter what digital camera you use (like for like)
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No, of course not. I'm saying that a crap lens is a crap lens, whether you put it on a film camera or a digital camera.
However, sometimes 35mm film, particularly C41 colour print film, can hide some of the flaws of a lens, particularly in sharpness. |
Well we agree on Hexanon lenses
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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fermy
Joined: 17 Feb 2012
Posts: 1974
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 5:06 pm Post subject: |
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fermy wrote:
Well, I think it's pretty obvious that 24mm f2.8 Sigma has no place in the "The best 24mm lens ever" thread, even though it might be a very good lens. I would be very much surprised if any Sigma belongs to "best ever" thread (unless it's "best ever Sigma" thread) and that's coming from someone who likes his Sigma 90mm f2.8 macro very much and confessed to using it more than Contax G Sonnar.
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Many lenses and some film bodies for sale here: http://forum.mflenses.com/canon-fd-minolta-md-c-mounts-m42-pentax-and-more-t50465.html
Flickr http://www.flickr.com/photos/96060788@N06/ |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 5:27 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
| fermy wrote: |
| Well, I think it's pretty obvious that 24mm f2.8 Sigma has no place in the "The best 24mm lens ever" thread, even though it might be a very good lens. I would be very much surprised if any Sigma belongs to "best ever" thread (unless it's "best ever Sigma" thread) and that's coming from someone who likes his Sigma 90mm f2.8 macro very much and confessed to using it more than Contax G Sonnar. |
Well I suppose not, but the thread drifts because how many members have the experience of owning a selection of the fabulous, expensive, 24mms in the world.
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 5:34 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
| fermy wrote: |
| Well, I think it's pretty obvious that 24mm f2.8 Sigma has no place in the "The best 24mm lens ever" thread, even though it might be a very good lens. I would be very much surprised if any Sigma belongs to "best ever" thread (unless it's "best ever Sigma" thread) and that's coming from someone who likes his Sigma 90mm f2.8 macro very much and confessed to using it more than Contax G Sonnar. |
Finally, the voice of reason.
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I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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Phenix jc
Joined: 19 Dec 2009
Posts: 398
Location: France
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| Posted: Thu May 23, 2013 11:29 pm Post subject: |
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Phenix jc wrote:
| TSherman wrote: |
| 16:9.net did an amazingly thorough 24mm comparison the "24mm world cup" crowning the zuiko. Its a beautiful little lens, definitely the smallest of the full frame 24s. It even stacks up pretty well against canon's 24 1.4 That said I recently sold my copy because I hated the ultra short focus throw so much. |
Yep : "The Olympus is astoundingly good at f5.6-8 at distance, and produced the highest resolution captures of anything shot thus far at 24mm"
and
"Centre frame, the Olympus just outresolves the Sigma and Yashica" (f2.
Well, my copy is not astounding at f2.8...
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"Plonger les choses dans la lumière, c'est les plonger dans l'infini" Léonard De Vinci
f/1.2 club Zuiko : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Rokkor : 50/1.2, 58/1.2 Nikkor : 50/1.2, 55/1.2 Third Party : Porst(Fujinon-X) 50/1.2, Porst 55/1.2 Canon : S 50/1.2, nFD 50/1.2, FL 55/1.2, R 58/1.2, nFD 85/1.2 Hexanon : 57/1.2 Nokton : 50/1.1 |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:27 am Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/24mmcup/final/24mm_final13.html
Ok thread ends as the Canon 24mm f1.4 L is the best in the world
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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hoanpham
Joined: 31 Jan 2011
Posts: 2575
Expire: 2015-01-18
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:44 am Post subject: |
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hoanpham wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/24mmcup/final/24mm_final13.html
Ok thread ends as the Canon 24mm f1.4 L is the best in the world |
and they compare these lenses agains each other: Canon 24mm f1.4 L v Nikon 17-35mm f2.8 v Olympus 24mm f2.8
what an unfair world!  |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 6:54 am Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
| hoanpham wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/24mmcup/final/24mm_final13.html
Ok thread ends as the Canon 24mm f1.4 L is the best in the world |
and they compare these lenses agains each other: Canon 24mm f1.4 L v Nikon 17-35mm f2.8 v Olympus 24mm f2.8
what an unfair world! |
It would be unfair if someone paid about £1000 for the Canon 24mm F1.4L and it wasn't the best in the world 
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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Rick1779
Joined: 17 May 2013
Posts: 1207
Location: Italy
Expire: 2014-06-06
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 9:05 am Post subject: |
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Rick1779 wrote:
Thank you for all the comments and suggestions
Anyway that's the Pentax A-24/2.8 just yesterday on the nex5
and here the link to the full res versions
http://www.telltale.it/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/DSC1967.jpg
http://www.telltale.it/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/DSC1968.jpg
http://www.telltale.it/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/DSC1969.jpg |
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fermy
Joined: 17 Feb 2012
Posts: 1974
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:33 am Post subject: |
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fermy wrote:
| Excalibur wrote: |
http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/24mmcup/final/24mm_final13.html
Ok thread ends as the Canon 24mm f1.4 L is the best in the world |
There was a test showing that FD 24mm f2 beats 24mm f1.4 L. Ahh here it is. http://home.comcast.net/~starka/24mm/24mmIntro.htm As all similar tests, it's just one copy v another copy, so the results must be taken with a grain of salt...
_________________
Many lenses and some film bodies for sale here: http://forum.mflenses.com/canon-fd-minolta-md-c-mounts-m42-pentax-and-more-t50465.html
Flickr http://www.flickr.com/photos/96060788@N06/ |
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ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011
Posts: 2726
Location: Kiel, Germany.
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 11:56 am Post subject: |
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ForenSeil wrote:
Carl Zeiss Biogon 25/2.8 ZM T* is the best 
_________________
I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language) |
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hoanpham
Joined: 31 Jan 2011
Posts: 2575
Expire: 2015-01-18
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 12:16 pm Post subject: |
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hoanpham wrote:
| ForenSeil wrote: |
| Carl Zeiss Biogon 25/2.8 ZM T* is the best |
I found out that it costs the same (or more) as Zeiss 1.8/24 E-mount.
| Rick1779 wrote: |
| ...I was just wondering a bit on different possibilities excluding the espensive AF Zeiss in E-Mount |
This Zeiss lens 1.8/24 E-mount, might be the best I have used so far - consider image quality, small size, light weight, and AF. |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009
Posts: 5017
Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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| Posted: Fri May 24, 2013 1:05 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
Well that saves me spending out £1000 for the L lens
_________________
Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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DanielT74
Joined: 01 Apr 2011
Posts: 204
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| Posted: Sat May 25, 2013 6:06 am Post subject: |
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DanielT74 wrote:
| ForenSeil wrote: |
| Carl Zeiss Biogon 25/2.8 ZM T* is the best |
I understand that the new Zeiss 25/2 is much improved over the old biogon. But it also depends what one is shooting on. On Nikon D800E one may see a lot of difference, but on NEX-3C a lot less. |
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sammo
Joined: 04 Jan 2012
Posts: 223
Location: CH and SI
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| Posted: Sun May 26, 2013 12:27 pm Post subject: |
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sammo wrote:
| fermy wrote: |
| Excalibur wrote: |
http://www.16-9.net/lens_tests/24mmcup/final/24mm_final13.html
Ok thread ends as the Canon 24mm f1.4 L is the best in the world |
There was a test showing that FD 24mm f2 beats 24mm f1.4 L. Ahh here it is. http://home.comcast.net/~starka/24mm/24mmIntro.htm As all similar tests, it's just one copy v another copy, so the results must be taken with a grain of salt... |
I read one test where somebody compared his 24mm f1.4L to samyang 24mm 1.4 (for use in aurora photography), and after the test he sold the L lens and kept the samyang, because the samyang was so way much better. |
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