Berthiot Paris 5.7/260 and some other questions

[Frunobulax]

Hello, friends of The Glass.

I recently came into posession of diverse old photographic equipment that belonged to my grandfather.
Among other things, I have a medium format SLR, that is identical to this one here Click here to see on Ebay, only labeled "Braun Studio". It comes with the Meyer Görlitz Primotar 3.5/80, and is a very nice camera.

This camera has a 60mm thread mount, just like a m42 mount, but larger. Is this a well known mount? Meaning, are there many lenses utilizing this screw mount?

Further, among the stuff is the mentioned Berthiot lens. It reads "Bte S.G.D.G. Berthiot Paris OLOR Serie IIª F 5.7 F=260 53926".
The diaphragm works very well, the glass looks clear, but there are some larger particles inside.
Here are some pictures: (excuse the bad quality, the only good cameras I own don't have a USB port )







Ok. Now the strange thing is, this lens fits the screw mount of the aforementioned Braun Studio Camera. It screws right on.
But it is not useable, because it lacks a focusing ring. So I thought, why wouldn't it have a focusing ring, maybe because it was originally for a camera with bellows. Am I right?

Also, it seems very small for a lens with a focal lenght of 260. Is this perhaps a lens for a large format camera? But why does it have this screw mount then?!

Can anybody shine some light on the subject? How old is this lens probably? Is it worth more than 5 bucks? I'd be glad for any info regarding this lens, the screw mount and even the Braun camera.

Peace, and thanks for reading.

[Spotmatic]

From the Lens Vademecum:

"Olor
This was a long running trade name, for several series.
f5.7-f6.8Large format lens, Q15 but with a 3-glass rear cell. These were used on
aerial survey cameras in WW1 and the 1920's on, eg as f5.7/260mm for 13x18cm on cameras by Demaria-
Lapierre, Richard, and so on. A Olor No4 Series II f6.8/200mm No62,22x was noted on a Thornton-Pickard
reflex."

[patrickh]

Welcome, and what a surprising and interesting beginning. I am sure others will give you more information too.


patrickh

[Frunobulax]

Thank you. That Lens Vademecum seems to be an excellent resource indeed.
Now I'd really like to know more about the screw mount, and If I can get some bellows for it. Because I also have a Schneider Kreuznach Xenar 4.5/165 that was adapted from what I guess was an old Large Format that works very well, look here:





This looks like a pretty cool homemade adaptation, because it looks like it originally had a Compur lens shutter, so it probably was part of a plate camera, yes?

Like the pictures show, it now has these tubes wich screw right on to the camera, and I can focus screwing the actual lens more or less onto the grey tube. It works very well, but I have yet to develop the first pictures taken with it. But It would be even better with a bellows attachement, so I could focus even closer, and try out the Olor.

[luisalegria]

The Reflex Korelle is a very well-known and historic camera, and there were many different lenses provided for that screw mount of 40.5mm.

But I think only the Korelle III used this larger screw mount of 60mm, so that seems to be your camera, possibly rebranded for export. I would say that the mount is not at all common, as these lenses can only be used on this one model of Korelle.

You are right, that Berthiot was designed to go on a lens board on a large format camera. All these large format lenses had screws that went on a flange or ring to attach to a lens board. There was no standard size for the screw as these were usually sold with the proper ring or flange. I think its just luck that yours fits the Korelle.

Of course over the years many of these have been lost, so there is now a little industry making custom rings/flanges for old large format lenses. Look for S.K.Grimes in the US as one business that makes these.

The Berthiot lens is worth a great deal more than 5 bucks. More like over $200 I expect.

[luisalegria]

Any SLR bellows can be used with these old lenses, as long as you can adapt the thread.

My present usual method is to use a "reverse adapter", with the lens mount on one side (M42 for my bellows) and a filter thread on the other. These meant to mount lenses backwards for macro work.

I then add a F-F filter thread adapter.

Then I use filter thread adapter rings to fit the screw on the lens if I can find one to fit.

There are many other ways.

[Frunobulax]

Thanks, luisalegria. I want to get a m42 bellows anyway, so maybe I'll figure out a way to use it with old lenses.
Thank you for your help.