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Please recommend good mirror lens...
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PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 6:20 pm    Post subject: Please recommend good mirror lens... Reply with quote
500mm or more, ~f/8 or faster, reasonable price, M42 (or Canon EF), the best possible optical qualities Very Happy

Thanks.


PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 6:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
For a 500/8 lens, I think the Tamron 500SP is the best of common lenses. The Tokina RMC seems to be quite good, and the Sigma 600/8 too. For a 500/5.6, I would say a Rubinar, they seems to have a good quality/price rapport Wink


PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
my order on budget mirror lenses:

1) http://www.mflenses.com/gallery/v/russian_lens/3m-6a/

2) http://www.mflenses.com/gallery/v/japenese/Tamron/tamron_sp_500_f8_55bb/
3) http://www.mflenses.com/gallery/v/russian_lens/mc3m5ca/


PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Would agree with Attila, I don't know the Tamron but I do have a ZM-5A Russian mirror lens and its very good, I think the Russian mirrors are the way to go especially in terms of price


PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 9:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I own the same - 8/500 , called ZM5-CA , with MC coating . This lens shows a good contrast . I have also the MTO 8,5/550mm , non mc , but showing a similar contrast .
Both lenses can be foud in Ebay shops such as Grizzlybear33.


100% crop with ZM5-CA , distance 2km :






PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
If you found some Canon 500 L pictures from same distance I think it will be not sharper at all.


PostPosted: Mon Jan 19, 2009 9:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wheather was very clear . Telephoto pics suffers often from heath "haze" or almost invisible "fog" ... Yet this picture was made on 400 iso film and is very "grainy" . I'd better take this picture again with Dslr , to avoid this big noise .


PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 7:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I agree that the Russian mirror optics are often first rate. Not always that easy to find, though. Another good performer is the Sigma 600 f/8. I used to own one for Canon FD and took some pretty spectacular shots with that lens -- even with a 2x teleconverter.

There's a thread over at the digital Canon forum where a fellow there has one with an adapter to mount to his EOS, and who's posted some very sharp photos. See them here:

http://photography-on-the.net/forum/showthread.php?t=632388

Best,

Michael


PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 7:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
If you found some Canon 500 L pictures from same distance I think it will be not sharper at all.


I don't know about the effect of the grain on the resolution of that photo but I think I could match its quality by blowing up a section from my 70-200L to 2.5x its original size, or by increasing the output of my Sonnar 300 by 1.6 times - particularly as it can be stopped down to f8.

Where a mirror lens scores is on size and weight, not on image quality.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 2:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think the best is Zeiss Mirotar 500mm f8 and Leica Tylst 500mm f8 but I'm in love with Nikon AI 500mm f8 but I can't beat it in Ebay. Crying or Very sad

Now I use Nikkor-C 500mm f8. The lower version of AI. It's worth for all of my bucks. Laughing




Laughing



I'm sorry for the same compositions. Laughing



PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 4:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Poolhall wrote:
Would agree with Attila, I don't know the Tamron but I do have a ZM-5A Russian mirror lens and its very good, I think the Russian mirrors are the way to go especially in terms of price


No surprise, as such lenses are Soviet invention Smile
I have ZM-6A and I had ZM-5CA - both are very good, although ZM-5CA are often discussed to be risky lenses, as quality control can allow "lemon" to reach the market.
In case of this, be aware that usually such "lemon" needs about 10 minutes of Your time to become 1st class lens (my copy had reversed lenses in rear group-field corrector - and that's the worst thing which can happen in this simple construction).
BTW, in case of extreme backlight situations, when flaring occurs and contrast is reduced, it's possible to completely remove rear lens group (two lenses in ZM-5CA and one in ZM-6A), making them ca. 400/6,4 and 400/5 lenses, so with loss of magnification and with stronger field curvature, but faster, more contrasty and less prone to flaring - in most cases You will not need this corrector, except shots of architecture and reproduction (but who needs 500mm lens to reproduction? Smile )


PostPosted: Tue Jan 20, 2009 5:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
KhanX wrote:
I think the best is Zeiss Mirotar 500mm f8 and Leica Tylst 500mm f8 but I'm in love with Nikon AI 500mm f8 but I can't beat it in Ebay. Crying or Very sad

Now I use Nikkor-C 500mm f8. The lower version of AI. It's worth for all of my bucks. Laughing




Laughing



I'm sorry for the same compositions. Laughing



YES!!! Beautiful samples indeed!


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:55 am    Post subject: Vivitar Reply with quote
Maybe the vivitar 600/8 Solid Cat? those are supposed to be quite good.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 2:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lot more expensive than Tamron or Russian and lot more rare too I guess.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 4:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have a Russian catadioptric (mirror) lens: 3M-5A 500mm F/8 which I'm quite pleased with. Ebayed 9 months ago for about 50 GBP condition pretty much mint. I don't know how it compares to the 3M-5CA (anybody know?) version or for that matter any other mirror lens, but it does very well against cropped or x2 converter images from Pentacon 300mm F4/Sigma 80-300mm APO AF/CZJ 180mm F2.8 lenses., which I suppose you should consider as it is somewhat a specialised lens. Often left behind because of weight and need for tripod etc.





OK not frame very well, but I like it Laughing Still practising.

Best regards

Fergus

Last edited by fergus on Fri Aug 20, 2010 4:59 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 6:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
fergus wrote:
I have a Russian catadioptric (mirror) lens: 3M-5A 500mm F/8 which I'm quite pleased with. Ebayed 9 months ago for about 50 GBP condition pretty much mint. I don't know how it compares to the 3M-5CA (anybody know?)
(...)

3M-5CA (ZM-5CA) differs from Your ZM-5A being more compact (AFAIK letter C in the name means "compact") - it has no tripod mount at all, so the rear lens barrel is not as massive thus making it quite lightweight (0,6kg). It may have better (MC) coating than Your lens, but I bet You would not notice any differences in image quality.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 8:27 am    Post subject: Re: Vivitar Reply with quote
EdSawyer wrote:
Maybe the vivitar 600/8 Solid Cat? those are supposed to be quite good.


Not really that sharp...


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 8:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
KhanX wrote:
I think the best is Zeiss Mirotar 500mm f8 and Leica Tylst 500mm f8 but I'm in love with Nikon AI 500mm f8 but I can't beat it in Ebay. Crying or Very sad

Now I use Nikkor-C 500mm f8. The lower version of AI. It's worth for all of my bucks. Laughing


Very nice results KhanX - CONGRATS!!
Mirror lens is not that easy to use, well done!


PostPosted: Thu Jan 22, 2009 8:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The Vivitar solid cats are expensive for what they are. I don't have any experience with the 600/8, but the 800/11 is quite good.

The other approach here is to look at the telescope makers. I have a Celestron C90 that is a 500/5.6. I haven't done much with it, but my initial puttering around suggests that it's quite sharp.


PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 10:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
wariag wrote:
No surprise, as such lenses are Soviet invention Smile
I have ZM-6A and I had ZM-5CA - both are very good, although ZM-5CA are often discussed to be risky lenses, as quality control can allow "lemon" to reach the market.
In case of this, be aware that usually such "lemon" needs about 10 minutes of Your time to become 1st class lens (my copy had reversed lenses in rear group-field corrector - and that's the worst thing which can happen in this simple construction).


How did you find out the rear group was reversed? How can you know this for sure? I'm suspicious about my lens having this problem...

Just got myself a brand new looking 3M-5CA for €23,- (including caps and leather case) from a private person.

I have been trying to make one sharp picture systematically for an hour (Pentax K10D, no lenshood), but it seems not possible to get decent focus. Even the viewfinder picture looks pretty unsharp all the time...

BTW: I can turn the focus ring 1 cm further past the infinity mark, can anybody else do this with his 3M-5CA as well?


PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 11:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
sirslak wrote:


.............................

BTW: I can turn the focus ring 1 cm further past the infinity mark, can anybody else do this with his 3M-5CA as well?


Yes, I've a ZM-5A and can turn the focus ring beyond infinity mark.
I think they are projected in this way.


PostPosted: Wed Feb 18, 2009 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes they are built to focus beyond infinity and so various mounts can be used with the lens, I fitted mine with a Pentax T mount over the m42 mount which makes it about 3-4mm longer and it can still focus to infinity ok


PostPosted: Sun Feb 22, 2009 11:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tried to find some information on the so called field flatness or curvature corrector.
I think the two rear group lenses in my 3M-5CA are mounted wrongly, but theoretically there are 8 possible configurations. This is the current configuration, where the lenses are directly on top of each other in reality, separated by a very thin fragile sheet metal ring:



(picture is edited version from http://slrphoto.narod.ru/rubinar.htm)

I found these corrector principles on http://www.users.bigpond.com/pjifl/page12.html (light also falling in from the left):



Is anybody aware of the correct configuration in the MC 3M-5CA or is there any optics expert knowing about corrector principles?


PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 6:42 am    Post subject: Tokina RMC 500/8 Reply with quote
I picked up a new one of these in Konica AR mount, which works fine on my 4/3 Lumix L1.

This is a shot of a moving helicopter that i had to pan with, no IS I might add. Not perfect but I am happy with the result for $30.

100% crop resized.



PostPosted: Thu Feb 26, 2009 12:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Very nice. And 100% cropped (sharp).

Rino.
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