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Nikkor 20mm f/3.5 Ais
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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 3:31 am    Post subject: Nikkor 20mm f/3.5 Ais Reply with quote
Since I recently posted a few pictures from my 20/3.5 UD, I thought someone might be interested in a couple pix from one of its successors, the 20/3.5 Ais, all shot with a D700.

This lens tends to be a bit sharper than the UD up close, not so sharp at a distance. It's field curvature is noticeably worse than the UD, but really only when shooting a flat subject. It's very compact and light (at only 235g), but is bested by the 20/4 Ai and pre-Ai. I don't think its colors are as nice as th UD, but unlike the UD, you can point it right at the sun and get very little flare, ghosting, or other nasties. Can't find a pic like that right now, so maybe I'll get one tomorrow.

First pic: a close-up of a dozer. It's very detailed, though hard to see at 1024x681. I changed it to B&W and like it much better, but this is the original. Despite the extreme brightness and presence of the sun just outside the frame in the upper right*, there is no significant flare and no ghosting.



The second one is from a gravel pit. The close up sign looks great, but the image sharpness fades in the background much more so than the UD (of course, the UD was just serviced, so maybe it's not a fair comparison.)




The third picture was taken very close up of the Tron LIght cycle on display at Comic Con a few years ago.




As usual, I'd be very interested in how other people are using this lens or other 20s.
*edited: Originally and dyslexicly had "upper left".

Last edited by Arninetyes on Tue May 24, 2011 12:53 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 8:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I tried to get a 2.8er version of this lens in the past but not so common and very expensive. Since I saw your images I will think about the 3.5er version insteed. Very good IQ. Thanks for sharing.

Wink


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 9:39 am    Post subject: 20mm f3.5 ais Reply with quote
I have the 20mm f3.5 ai, so I am not exactly sure if the coating was changed. I had tried some shots directly into the sun and for some reason found the shots not really to my liking. Even though, it is supposed to be very flare resistant and all, I just found the shot to be rather washed out.
(Was shooting at f22 I think though).

As it is 52mm, it is quite easy to reverse with a br-2a, which is supposed to give some obscene magnification, but I have never tried myself.

Also, using a k1 extension ring, it is supposed to be able to give very good closeup opportunities.

I've only been testing it on DX format so far, so it hasn't given as drastic wideangle use as on FX like your D700.

I keep the 20mm f3.5 ai + k1-ring in my bag all the time, for the just in case shots into the sun or interesting closeup. It is so small it takes up little room anyway.

Is the 20mm f4 ai really that much better in field curvature ? I never had a chance to try one, even given it's reputation as one of the light favourite lens of Galen Rowell ?


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 11:46 am    Post subject: Re: 20mm f3.5 ais Reply with quote
phule888 wrote:
I have the 20mm f3.5 ai, so I am not exactly sure if the coating was changed. I had tried some shots directly into the sun and for some reason found the shots not really to my liking. Even though, it is supposed to be very flare resistant and all, I just found the shot to be rather washed out.
(Was shooting at f22 I think though).


I've shot right into the sun without getting washed out images. But, if you have significant internal dust, haze, or fungus, they can increase flare in any lens. A little dust has almost no effect, but haze and fungus can quickly become serious flare problems.

Also, f/22 may be stopped down too far with a DX. Diffraction will soften the entire image and contribute to the washed out look. On a DX, f/11 should be the limit (unless you absolutely need extra depth of field in macro and are willing to live with IQ degradation). f/8 seems to work best under most conditions with this lens. All three of the above photos were shot at f/8, and the depth of field is quite adequate.

phule888 wrote:
As it is 52mm, it is quite easy to reverse with a br-2a, which is supposed to give some obscene magnification, but I have never tried myself.

Also, using a k1 extension ring, it is supposed to be able to give very good closeup opportunities.

I have tried it and the magnification is impressive.

phule888 wrote:
Is the 20mm f4 ai really that much better in field curvature ? I never had a chance to try one, even given it's reputation as one of the light favourite lens of Galen Rowell ?


Ah, what I said comparing the two was poorly written and ambiguous. The 20/4 does not have less curvature or better image than the 20/3.5. Generally, their optical performances are quite similar, although some have reported the 20/3.5 to be slightly superior. Regardless, where the 20/4 excels is in size and weight: it weighs only 210g compared to 235g of the 20/3.5. Sorry for the misunderstanding. I've read that Galen Rowell preferred the 20/4 primarily because of its compact size and light weight; he liked to travel light.


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 12:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Great samples! Nikon made some cracking 20mm primes...I have the 20/4 AI which is ace.


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Rolf wrote:
I tried to get a 2.8er version of this lens in the past but not so common and very expensive. Since I saw your images I will think about the 3.5er version insteed. Very good IQ. Thanks for sharing.

Wink


Yeah. The 20/2.8 is often stated as 'superior', but there doesn't seem to be enough image quality difference between them to justify the premium.


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 1:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I want one too! Don't care whether it's the f4 or f3.5 version.

What did you guys pay for yours?


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Cistron wrote:
I want one too! Don't care whether it's the f4 or f3.5 version.

What did you guys pay for yours?


Mine's not a good example of price. I bought a box of Nikon gear from someone who was dumping all. I sold most of it--just enough to pay for the box, and kept the rest, including a Nikon FE, Nikkor 20/3.5 ais, 25-50/4 ais, and a 35/2 AI.

So, really, I got the 20/3.5 for free.

I did have to buy the 20/3.5 UD. I think I paid about $75 for it (can't remember for sure), but was disappointed by sharpness--turns out it had a lot of haze and debris in internal surfaces. Had it cleaned/adjusted/lubricated and now it's great.


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 3:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Arninetyes, my experience with the UD and AIS versions are the same as yours. The AIS is a nice size for hiking and such, but there's a quality to the UD's images that I really like. I've never had an f4 AI version, but here are images from the UD, f4 K version and AIS:





The problem that I find with the AIS is that it will focus past infinity, so unless I'm attentive to that, I can wind up with soft distant images.


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Arninetyes wrote:
Yeah. The 20/2.8 is often stated as 'superior', but there doesn't seem to be enough image quality difference between them to justify the premium.


Agree, I have 2.8 and I don't see any difference , stunning samples!


PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
gaeger wrote:
The problem that I find with the AIS is that it will focus past infinity, so unless I'm attentive to that, I can wind up with soft distant images.


Neither my Ais nor my UD have that problem, but my Zoom Nikkor 25-50/4 Ais does.
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