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Lens comparision technique recommendation needed :)
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:23 pm    Post subject: Lens comparision technique recommendation needed :) Reply with quote
Hi I've spent an hour for 135mm comparision including:
# Carl Zeiss Tele-Tessar 4/135
# Rolleinar 2.8/135 MC
# Canon Ef 3.5-5.6/28-135 @135mm

My technique is like this:
1- Mount the Canon to 5D which is on tripod set ISO100, f:5.6, 135mm, set 5D to AV mode and shoot, note the shutter speed. Repeat this for f:8 and f:11.
2- Mount the Zeiss, set M mode, make the focus to the same spot, shoot, zoom check, if needed re-focus, recheck etc. use the noted values and shoot. Then do not touch to focus just set the aperture, set the shutter the same value of the EF.
3- Repeat 2nd strp for Rolleinar

the problem is Rolleinar has different color tones as if its exposure is much more than the other two even though they have the same pose values.

at 5.6 the order is like this:
1-Zeiss
2-Canon
3-Rolleinar
which makes me think that something is wrong with th tecinque as Rolleinar MUST and SHOULD be better than the Canon Smile

Canon, Rolleinar, Zeiss :


Last edited by yalcinaydin on Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:24 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is a very boring job, I not recommend. Just take a lens find nice subjects and enjoy.


PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm with Attila on this one - by all means find out your lenses' strengths and weaknesses but don't get bogged down with it.


PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
This is a very boring job, I not recommend. Just take a lens find nice subjects and enjoy.

Then I should choose Canon Ef 28-135 as it's flexible, has IS and has AF Smile
Zeiss looks a bit more sharp but I guess I'm missin something here Confused

And by the way Zeiss and Rolleinar are much more tele than the Canon as ı needed to move it like 20cm front to have the same composition. I don't think but can this be the cause?


PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Has IS and AF sound is boring me too ... I don't need sharpness only I need character from lenses I can found character in Meyer Trioplan even if unsharp. I didn't find character in AF lenses at least under 500 USD. For that amount what I have to pay an avarage AF lens I can buy a superb Carl Zeiss Contax lens and this lens will be usable my grandchildren too. I seen how Canon lenses are not kept their value (Canon FD) thanks for great maker tricks (change register distance, mount etc) so I will not invest for their lenses ever.


PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 10:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I should repeat this with natural light.
But I'm using strobes so I need to set up and shoot with strobes I guess.


PostPosted: Sun Oct 26, 2008 11:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Here is your medicine..

http://www.bobatkins.com/photography/technical/lens_sharpness.html


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 1:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
yalcinaydin wrote:

And by the way Zeiss and Rolleinar are much more tele than the Canon as ı needed to move it like 20cm front to have the same composition. I don't think but can this be the cause?


I've done this sort of comparison before, and it's laborious, but useful to me to determine which apertures are optimal for each of my lenses. Compared to the other folks on this forum, I'm a real lens neophyte, but in real life I'm an engineer, so I'll give my opinion anyway. Smile

I notice that the Canon DOF is quite a bit shallower than the other lenses, so first I'd check to see that the aperture is the same. But moving the lens closer will also change the DOF, too. However, you say in your text that the order makes the middle photo the Canon, but the text right above the photo puts the Canon first. Which is it?

And instead of using such a dark subject, use something a bit brighter so that you can see contrast differences and edge sharpness.


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
Has IS and AF sound is boring me too ... I don't need sharpness only I need character from lenses I can found character in Meyer Trioplan even if unsharp. I didn't find character in AF lenses at least under 500 USD. For that amount what I have to pay an avarage AF lens I can buy a superb Carl Zeiss Contax lens and this lens will be usable my grandchildren too. I seen how Canon lenses are not kept their value (Canon FD) thanks for great maker tricks (change register distance, mount etc) so I will not invest for their lenses ever.


I am SHOCKED as to how FAST the Canon lenses lose their value, even the L lenses! And the cameras themselves are always superseded by the "next one up the chain".

Canon does well with this scheme, however... Wink


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Laurence wrote:

I am SHOCKED as to how FAST the Canon lenses lose their value, even the L lenses! And the cameras themselves are always superseded by the "next one up the chain".

Canon does well with this scheme, however... Wink


But it's a great thing if you don't have to have the latest and greatest...

Craigslist in the Bay Area is awash with cream-puff 40D's for $800, and I paid a little less than that for my 30D when the 40D came out... I'm hoping my 'second' camera (a Rebel XT) lasts until the 60D comes out, and I can pick up a 50D for that. Smile


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Throndor wrote:
Here is your medicine..


Or Imatest Smile


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 7:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Guys, thanks for the links they are quite usefull.

I'm not a tech freak I just want to see if I should keep the Zeiss 4/135 or not as my Tamron 2.5/28 just sits because I allways use the Zuiko 3.5/28. And also I'm curious about the performance of my Canon zoom against the primes. I'm planning not buying any more lenses in the focal lengths that I own and have just one lens for every focal length so some must be gone Smile I'll use that budget for travelling more and shooting more Wink

asharpe wrote:
...However, you say in your text that the order makes the middle photo the Canon, but the text right above the photo puts the Canon first. Which is it?

And instead of using such a dark subject, use something a bit brighter so that you can see contrast differences and edge sharpness.

The name sequence above the picture is the one for the test picture which is Canon, Rolleinar, Zeiss. And I'll repeat the test in daylight Wink


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 8:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi!

I have done several if these tests. And I still find them interesting, but I have decided not to do them again.
The reason? I once have done a test twice with different results! Shocked
This taught me that I cannot reproduce test conditions like in a tech lab and thus my test results are basically for the bin.

I now "test" a lens by using it, turning the rings, holding it in my hands both just the lens and mounted to the cam. Then I check if I personally like the results that I get (no matter if the lens performance is objectively excellent or not) and this way I find my personal favorites.
As an example, I love the Vivitar 2.0/28, the Leica 2.8/35, the Pentax 1.7/50 or the Volna-3 although you easily can find better lenses in these focal ranges. These lenses (like so many others) just fit to me as a photographer and that's whay I rate them high!
Or I never could get along well with the Yashica ML 2.8/28 although this is without doubt (and many here will agree) one of the best 28mm lenses you can find.
So, my testshooting is not objective but very personal!


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 11:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
n6mod wrote:
Laurence wrote:

I am SHOCKED as to how FAST the Canon lenses lose their value, even the L lenses! And the cameras themselves are always superseded by the "next one up the chain".

Canon does well with this scheme, however... Wink


But it's a great thing if you don't have to have the latest and greatest...

Craigslist in the Bay Area is awash with cream-puff 40D's for $800, and I paid a little less than that for my 30D when the 40D came out... I'm hoping my 'second' camera (a Rebel XT) lasts until the 60D comes out, and I can pick up a 50D for that. Smile


I am planning my lenses on long term I think 10 yrs later current AF lenses will be unusable. I am pretty sure my MF lenses will.


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
LucisPictor wrote:
Hi!

I have done several if these tests. And I still find them interesting, but I have decided not to do them again.
The reason? I once have done a test twice with different results! Shocked
This taught me that I cannot reproduce test conditions like in a tech lab and thus my test results are basically for the bin.
...

So, my testshooting is not objective but very personal!


The lens tests for a general public are always problematic. And looking at other's tests is similarily only generally indicative.

However, doing these for my own education has been worth the pain.

First, I've become aware just how many variables there are
Second, I've learned what effects may correlate with what results, so I can have a tiny bit better control over my photography (if I manage to remain conscious, that is!)
Third, I've learned what actual diffrences there are between good and less good lenses, so now I have my own experience to go on when reading the pronouncements of others
Fourth, just what Lucis says: I have some idea of what I like and why


PostPosted: Mon Oct 27, 2008 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I remember thaqt the copnvenience of lenses tests always was in discussion.

I think that the purchase and use of lenses, don't signify the same things for all. At one extreme, it's the professional, who have a particular point of view (the result order), at the other, the hobbist, for whom the lens is only a toy. Between this two possitions, billions ones with more of the first or the second.

And this positions will determinate what is you looking for when purchase a lens and what are you doing with this.

This differences do it so beauty. Rino
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