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Leitz Elmar 135mm/F4 (M39/LTM)
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PostPosted: Mon Aug 31, 2015 8:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi there, Abbaz ! Thanks for those illustrations and comments but I think there's been some confusion with the details for the 135/4/ Elmar. The drawing of the optics is actually for the Tele Elmar, as are the MTF curves. And, the details for the 135/2.8 are for the earlier version. Latterly, Leitz changed the design considerably and the MTF curves at f5.6 became pretty much the same as the Tele Elmar.

This is not meant to criticise anything you write - the error concerning the 135 Elmar comes from an incorrect heading in Erwin Puts' own material which you very properly cite. His later Leica Compendium shows different drawings and charts (pp515-519, 3rd ed.). He also added data about the changes to the 135/2.8.

I have deliberately not copied and reproduced the images from Puts' book because copyright rules mean I would need permission to do so.

As an aside, although the 135/2.8 is a big and (very) heavy lens, on a Leica camera it has the great advantage of the enlarged viewfinder that makes focusing so much easier. But, of course, that's irrelevent on other digital bodies.


PostPosted: Sun Sep 06, 2015 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Elmar 135mm/F4 on Ricoh GXR-M (clickable for larger view):



PostPosted: Sun Apr 02, 2017 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
It's blooming again.

Elmar + 20mm distance ring:






PostPosted: Tue Apr 04, 2017 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Elmar lens head on Leitz Visoflex close focus helicoid with Ricoh GXR-M:



I really like the very smooth bokeh. Picture was taken WO/F4.


PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 3:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I too have this lens. Its a beauty, I should definitely use it more.

Here are 3 pictures taken on APS-C:


#1


#2


#3


Last edited by Drosovila on Mon Apr 10, 2017 8:54 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nice examples. Thanks for posting.

BTW, I did recently a comparison between 10 different 135mm lenses incl. Minolta, Zeiss, Nikon, Topcon, Pentax, etc. and the Elmar was by far the best of all. It's really an excellent lens in every aspect.


PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
This time I took my Panasonic Lumix GF1 MFT camera to extent the FOV to 270mm FF equivalent as I wanted to make also some birds pictures.

All shot RAW and converted/resized with minor adjustments in LR6.

#1


#2


#3


#4


#5


#6


Although it's rather cumbersome to focus correctly with this camera (in comparison to my Ricoh GXR-M) the smaller format of the sensor has definitely some advantages as well. On the other hand the higher resolution is rather demanding for the lens but obviously no problem for the Elmar.

Cheers,


PostPosted: Sat Jun 09, 2018 12:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
An almost perfect lens for my Sony A7RII 42MP/FF camera. By far my best 135mm lens....
Please click on pictures for best quality viewing.

#1 on Visoflex close focus helicoid


100% center crop of#1


#2 fully open at F4 (worst quality) infinity landscape


100% corner crop of #2


PostPosted: Sun May 10, 2020 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Panorama-Experiment

As I wanted to see if the Elmar is capable for landscapes I made a simple 2-row panorama consisting of ttl. 8 pictures with my A7R II, all shot at F5.6 RAW.

Here is a near center single picture:



And here is the final 8-pictures panorama which is originally 130mpx in size (apprx. 20.000 x 6.500px):



Unfortunately the car is disturbing in the foreground.
However, it's only a test picture and in original size quite impressive and (besides the unsharp foreground due to short DOF of the tele lens) tack sharp from corner to corner.

It's definitely something to consider for future landscape photography.

BTW, I've used "PanoramaStudio 3.4.5 PRO" for the assembling task.


PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2020 1:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ricoh GXR-M:



PostPosted: Wed May 13, 2020 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Tedat wrote:
Nordentro wrote:

The lens is aluminium made and have probably similar weight as the Canon, m39 mount Wink


well... M39 yes... but Paxette


Yes, I was going to say paxette. Lenses designed for cameras with deep FFDs will always be smaller than lenses designed for a 28.8mm FFD


PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2021 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
As mentioned already in my other thread about the Minolta MD 300mm/F4.5 I.F. I am presently investigating the best option for tele shooting with my newly acquired Panasonic Lumix GX80 for which my present original lens collection ends by 200mm.
The Minolta MD300/4.5 would be a possible option but now I've compared it with the Leitz Elmar 135mm/F4 in combination with my Komura Telemore 2X converter which gives me 270mm focal length (FOV 540mm).

Here is a test shot wide open at F4 (optimized and downsized in Lightroom), clickable as usual:



IMHO the Elmar/Komura combination is the better option, both in sharpness and portability. The downside is the slightly smaller magnification and of course the requirement of longer exposure times compared to the Minolta option.

However, the Elmar is really a great lens, even when used with converter....


PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2021 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
A perfect IQ, seems to preserve perfectly black components of the image and no colour shift.

Did you have a side-by-side comparison of this Leitz to 4/135 Sonnar (Zeiss or Jupiter) and 4/135 Schneider? I guess both, being high quality lenses, do not have the same microcontrast?


PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2021 10:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
alex ph wrote:
A perfect IQ, seems to preserve perfectly black components of the image and no colour shift.

Did you have a side-by-side comparison of this Leitz to 4/135 Sonnar (Zeiss or Jupiter) and 4/135 Schneider? I guess both, being high quality lenses, do not have the same microcontrast?


I've never been using the SOnnar 4/135mm and a Leitz Tele-Elmar 4/135mm side by side. My Sonnars (aan uncoated pre-war for Contax RF) and a coated post-war for the Praktina) are incredibly sharp for a 1930 computation. There is some blueish fringing, typical for real Sonnars, but otherwise remarkably sharp even at f4. I've been using the Leitz 3.4/135mm APO as well - incredibly sharp and completely aberration-free at the A7RII (43 MP FF). It is said that the Tele-Elmar 4/135mm is nearly as good as the later 3.4/135mm APO.

S


PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:
alex ph wrote:
A perfect IQ, seems to preserve perfectly black components of the image and no colour shift.

Did you have a side-by-side comparison of this Leitz to 4/135 Sonnar (Zeiss or Jupiter) and 4/135 Schneider? I guess both, being high quality lenses, do not have the same microcontrast?


I've never been using the SOnnar 4/135mm and a Leitz Tele-Elmar 4/135mm side by side. My Sonnars (aan uncoated pre-war for Contax RF) and a coated post-war for the Praktina) are incredibly sharp for a 1930 computation. There is some blueish fringing, typical for real Sonnars, but otherwise remarkably sharp even at f4. I've been using the Leitz 3.4/135mm APO as well - incredibly sharp and completely aberration-free at the A7RII (43 MP FF). It is said that the Tele-Elmar 4/135mm is nearly as good as the later 3.4/135mm APO.

S


Not in my experience, the original Elmar is way better than Tele-Elmar, speaking of CA. Sharpness is the same. Many samples owned/tested, today I only keep the Elmar. The Apo is obviously better, but less fascinating to my eyes


PostPosted: Thu Mar 11, 2021 11:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
alex ph wrote:
A perfect IQ, seems to preserve perfectly black components of the image and no colour shift.

Did you have a side-by-side comparison of this Leitz to 4/135 Sonnar (Zeiss or Jupiter) and 4/135 Schneider? I guess both, being high quality lenses, do not have the same microcontrast?


Yes, of course. I have compared CZJ Sonnar, Jupiter and Nikkor Sonnar LTM 135mm lenses with my Leitz Elmar as I own all of them.

Not really surprisingly the Leitz Elmar beats all of them.

Bottom line: I have not seen any better 135mm lens than the Leitz Elmar 135/4 up to now and I own 12 different 135mm lenses. Maybe the contemporary Leica APO-TELYT-M 135mm f/3.4 is slightly better. I don't know, but I'm not prepared to spend almost 4.000,- Euro to find it out. Wink


PostPosted: Fri Mar 12, 2021 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
tb_a wrote:
Bottom line: I have not seen any better 135mm lens than the Leitz Elmar 135/4 up to now and I own 12 different 135mm lenses. Maybe the contemporary Leica APO-TELYT-M 135mm f/3.4 is slightly better. I don't know, but I'm not prepared to spend almost 4.000,- Euro to find it out. Wink


I agree. I haven't seen a better 135. Some other 135s are faster and have excellent qualities and characters of their own, but the Elmar is unbeaten, which is incredible for a lens from 1960-61.

It's wonderful adapted to mirrorless cameras too - small and light with a tiny adapter - almost like not using an adapter at all.
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