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Zeiss S-Orthoplanar 105mm f/5.6 on Fuji GFX 50S II
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2023 5:18 pm    Post subject: Zeiss S-Orthoplanar 105mm f/5.6 on Fuji GFX 50S II Reply with quote

Well, it's pretty amazingly sharp. I still need to get used to focus precisly at f/5.6, this was much easier with the Pentax 67 105mm f/2.4.

These images are from one of the first walks I had with the lens in my neightbourhood a few weeks ago. All were shot at f/5.6 because, well, I still have to get around to ask a mechanic to rebuild the missing link inside my sample that connects the aperture ring to the iris mechanism. I could reach it by hand and open up the aperture as it was slightly closed when I got the lens. But I think it deserves a proper functioning aperture.



PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2023 7:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow - very interesting lenses you‘ve got there! Thanks a lot for posting some sample shots, it‘s highly appreciated. 👍


Do you have an S-Planar 120 mm as well? It‘s also a wonderful lens which holds up surprisingly well, even today.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2023 7:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for the feedback!

Sadly, that's pretty much it in terms of exotic high resolution lenses. I got hold on both lenses a few years ago, but I was able to use them on mirrorless only recently. The 105mm sits in a 3D printed clamping housing with a Pentax 67 Bayonetta that positions it as deep as possible into the original P67 helicoid extention tube. From there, the middle sized fixed-length Pentax 67 extension tube is mounted, followed by a custom 3D-printed P67-to-GFX adapter with a length fitted to make infinity focus possible. I could get away with an aftermarket P67-to-GFX adapter if I would be able to position the lens a few millimeters closer inside the helicoid. But that would require to remove the inner lens shades inside the helicoid that prevents the so far. Maybe I will do that next to.reduce the amount of parts and.to rely only on just one 3D printed mount.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 20, 2023 11:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Christian S. wrote:
Thanks for the feedback!

Sadly, that's pretty much it in terms of exotic high resolution lenses. I got hold on both lenses a few years ago, but I was able to use them on mirrorless only recently. The 105mm sits in a 3D printed clamping housing with a Pentax 67 Bayonetta that positions it as deep as possible into the original P67 helicoid extention tube. From there, the middle sized fixed-length Pentax 67 extension tube is mounted, followed by a custom 3D-printed P67-to-GFX adapter with a length fitted to make infinity focus possible. I could get away with an aftermarket P67-to-GFX adapter if I would be able to position the lens a few millimeters closer inside the helicoid. But that would require to remove the inner lens shades inside the helicoid that prevents the so far. Maybe I will do that next to.reduce the amount of parts and.to rely only on just one 3D printed mount.


Great that you're able to get 3D printed parts - I imagine that helps a lot. I feel like that lens has more potential for shooting at distance - judging by your shots I'd say that I prefer its oof rendering at least. 60 mm is said to be very nice for macros though... I hope your plans work out!

The S-Planar 120 mm f/5.6 is a simpler lens in terms of construction, a 6/4 design, as you can see in Marco Cavina's excellent article:
http://www.marcocavina.com/articoli_fotografici/Zeiss_cute_DFR_DDR_lenses/00_pag_English.htm

The S-Planar 120 mm is not free of CAs, particularly in direct sunlight, but I found its performance quite impressive overall and the rendering really nice at all distances. It also is significantly smaller and more light weight than I had imagined. Here are some SOOC captures made with that lens:


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53060459585_b51aebc78e_o.jpg


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53060459600_d180464624_o.jpg


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53060459640_1f031bff62_o.jpg


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53060088491_02d9e0cdbe_o.jpg


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53059503277_d26e946e77_o.jpg


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53059503292_6cd0141b04_o.jpg

I thought they might perhaps be of some use, if you want to compare something directly.

I would suspect the S-Orthoplanar to be superior in terms of CA correction, even though it doesn't seem like it's completely free of those as well. If you can challenge it a little, when there's some direct sunlight or stark contrasts, that would be great.

Thanks again for sharing some high-res sample shots!


PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 5:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Congratulations to you both, S-Ortho and S-Planar are both excellent lenses and indeed the S-Ortho has less CA.

Here my album with some S-Ortho 105mm shots:

https://www.flickr.com/photos/kds315/albums/72157638318121966





PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2023 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

kds315* wrote:
Congratulations to you both, S-Ortho and S-Planar are both excellent lenses and indeed the S-Ortho has less CA.




Thank you. Indeed - that's a very nice shot and really effective focusing! Is it processed or SOOC?

Here's two more (this time processed) shots with the S-Planar 120 mm:

Like father, like son. by simple.joy, on Flickr
Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/52377247695_120688f6b8_o.jpg


Full Res: https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/53061254783_01b2f4d873_o.jpg


PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2023 6:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To go along the corresponding bokeh pictures in the Ortho 60mm thread, here is the image of the Ortho 105mm wide open, shooting christmaslights in August:



BTW, the images of the 120mm look very nice, seems to be a great lens as well.


PostPosted: Wed Aug 02, 2023 8:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Christian S. wrote:
To go along the corresponding bokeh pictures in the Ortho 60mm thread, here is the image of the Ortho 105mm wide open, shooting christmaslights in August:




Thanks a lot - that's great. It does look quite round. I'm wondering if that has to do with your stuck aperture situation, or if it's indeed different with the 105 mm lens.

Christian S. wrote:

BTW, the images of the 120mm look very nice, seems to be a great lens as well.


Thank you - yes it is. I think pretty much all S-Planars are very good lenses for what they were designed for. And the S-Tessars are as well.


PostPosted: Sun Aug 06, 2023 5:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I finally sat down, 3D printed some protective front- and back-caps for the 105mm Ortho and shipped it to a service technician that will have a look onto the aperture lever issue, following a recommendation from Klaus. So no more updates for the time being but hopefully stopped-down ones in the future.


PostPosted: Tue Aug 08, 2023 6:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hope it turns out well! Like 1 small Like 1 small


PostPosted: Wed Aug 16, 2023 7:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, after just about a week (if you leave out shipping days), the parcel arrived home again surprisingly while I was abroad. My wife took care of the parcel so it was well cared for until when I arrived this evening. And what a fine job Foto Olbrich did! They analyzed the lens, ascertained a missing link, hand-made a new one(!), cleaned and adjusted the aperture assembly and refitted the aperture ring with new click-stop bearing balls while straighten out a slight oval-like misshape of it. It certainly feels like new now.

I will have a closer look at daylight again but what I can already see is that simple.joy's assumption seems to turn out true: the completely round bokeh balls were probably caused by me moving the aperture lever leftover inside the lens to a fully open position that it is usually not supposed to be set to. With the aperture ring now set to f/5.6, there is a leftover of the aperture blades sticking into the optics just like the 60mm S-Orthoplanar. The invoice of Foto Olbrich specifically mentions an aperture calibration so they did not just stick in a new aperture lever st goodwill reference position. I guess after all, this behavior is normal to at least both S-Orthoplanars I own. The Christmas lights torture test will.tell us more in the next few.days.

Edit:


PostPosted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I forgot that my self-made adapter was built for the Zeiss Orthoplanar WITHOUT the (back-then) defunctional aperture ring. I will have to create a new adapter setup, this time probably based on commercially available helicoids and thread adapters.

Meanwhile, by just holding the Orthoplanar in front of my old adapter, I gave it a shot versus my recently acquired native Fujifilm GF 110mm f/2.0 lens, which is supposedly the best lens in the GFX system. Both shot at f/5.6. I find them remarkebly similar in performance. Quite a feat!

Zeiss (left) vs. GF110 (right)


PostPosted: Sun Sep 03, 2023 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Christian S. wrote:
I forgot that my self-made adapter was built for the Zeiss Orthoplanar WITHOUT the (back-then) defunctional aperture ring. I will have to create a new adapter setup, this time probably based on commercially available helicoids and thread adapters.

Meanwhile, by just holding the Orthoplanar in front of my old adapter, I gave it a shot versus my recently acquired native Fujifilm GF 110mm f/2.0 lens, which is supposedly the best lens in the GFX system. Both shot at f/5.6. I find them remarkebly similar in performance. Quite a feat!

Zeiss (left) vs. GF110 (right)


Thanks a lot for this interesting comparison! While you're right and they're not far apart the S-Orthoplanar 105 mm image looks sharper to me. Of course it could be in part because of very slight difference in focus, but it feels like that all across the frame to me. Highly impressive result indeed - it could also be the case that that's a magnification it is very comfortable at. Glad you got your lens back in great condition! Hope you'll have lots of fun with it. 👍

To me it certainly seems like a good idea to not discount any Zeiss lens too quickly, regardless of its age, particularly, if there's a "S-" in front of its name... 😅

Need some more proof?

S-Planar 32 mm f/5.6
Multidimensional cathedral by simple.joy, on Flickr

S-Planar 120 mm f/5.6
Take in all the color by simple.joy, on Flickr

Three-spirited! by simple.joy, on Flickr

S-Planar 74 mm f/4
Playing it close to the chest, nut? by simple.joy, on Flickr


PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2023 11:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, these are truly beautiful macroshots! I really put the Orthoplan to shame with my attempts.

Indeed, the Orthoplan seems a tiny bit sharper, and that's with open aperture and a 5% focal length penalty.


PostPosted: Mon Sep 04, 2023 11:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Christian S. wrote:
Wow, these are truly beautiful macroshots! I really put the Orthoplan to shame with my attempts.

Indeed, the Orthoplan seems a tiny bit sharper, and that's with open aperture and a 5% focal length penalty.


Thank you, but you're actually way closer to letting the lens do what it does best... most of the magnifications shown would be way out of the optimal range for the S-Orthoplanar 105 mm, according to Klaus' Macrolenses data:
http://www.macrolenses.de/ml_detail.php?ObjektiveNr=378, which states optimal magnification as 6...21x

I'm sure it does hold up fine even closer than that, but trying it for something the size of an A4 sheet (albeit slightly more interesting, perhaps...) might show its full potential.

Apart from that it would be very interesting to see what happens if you tried to push it a little bit (shooting droplets in direct light for example):
Mandatory morning breathing by simple.joy, on Flickr

I always find it fascinating how really well corrected lenses deal with things like that.

And if you have time to try an additional shot from a very low POV, in order to show the transitions (which I'm sure look great on the S-Orthoplanar), I'd also love to see that.

Everyone‘s a standout today… part 2 by simple.joy, on Flickr


PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2023 6:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Excellent shots!! Like 1 Like 1


PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2023 6:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Christian S. wrote:
Wow, these are truly beautiful macroshots! I really put the Orthoplan to shame with my attempts.

Indeed, the Orthoplan seems a tiny bit sharper, and that's with open aperture and a 5% focal length penalty.


It is S-ORTHOPLANAR btw. not Orthoplan Wink


PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2023 7:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@simple.joy:
Cannot agree more, as all Zeiss "S-" lenses are really special and within their defined ranges excellent performers!

Those btw.paved the way for modern microelectronics on chips, as some erly stepper systems relied on Zeiss S-Planar lenses (back then first optimized for 546nm, then 436nm, then 365nm wavelengths - written on lens in Angströms)



This one was Diffraction limited, resolution up to 1500 l/mm. 25cm height, 10 cm diameter, ca. 10 kilos weight.


PostPosted: Tue Sep 05, 2023 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

@simple.joy: no prob, I will take those shots gladly. I just found out that a) there is no commercially available way to adapt the M55x0.75 to a standard helidoid but b) I got a threaded tube with a flange alongside the lens that I can now use to change the 3D printed adapter accordingly. I think I will be able to take some shots this week already.

kds315* wrote:
Christian S. wrote:
Wow, these are truly beautiful macroshots! I really put the Orthoplan to shame with my attempts.

Indeed, the Orthoplan seems a tiny bit sharper, and that's with open aperture and a 5% focal length penalty.


It is S-ORTHOPLANAR btw. not Orthoplan Wink


Yes, your are right, sorry for the mixup. The Orthoplan is not on my camera but rather on the desk behind me Very Happy



PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2023 12:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How about this?



PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2023 5:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Christian S. wrote:
How about this?



Thanks - those are great looking shots and exactly what I was talking about! While it's interesting to see that this lens is pretty far away from being free of CA in challenging situations, it actually looks nice the way it is. I also like the rounded pentagon shapes. A while ago I didn't enjoy them, but now I'm starting to get why Rodenstock usually went with those types of apertures, while it's even more of a mystery why Schneider-Kreuznach used the inwardly shaped pentagon stars... anyway, it's always great to have some options for bokeh experiments. 😉