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Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7
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PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 10:59 am    Post subject: Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7 Reply with quote
Recently i found a nice set of RE Topcors (2.8/28mm, 3.5/58mm Macro, 5.6/200mm) which was fitting perfectly into my existing little collection (4/20mm, 1.4/58mm, 1.8/58mm, 2.8/100mm, 3.5/135mm). Yesterday i got an Exacta adapter, and today i could do a first "quick & dirty" test of the lenses using the A7.

RE Auto Topcor 20mm 1:4: small, lightweight superwide without floating focusing. Wide open there's loss of contrast in the corners (similar to all retrofocus superwides from that time), at f5.6 even in the corners quite good. Nearly no CAs (better than most other 20mm / 21mm lenses with exeption of the AIs 2.8/20mm which about 15 years "newer")!

RE Auto Topcor 28mm 1:2.8: one of the latest "classical" RE lenses. Wide open very good, at f5.6 excellent. Nearly no CAs!

RE Auto Topcor 58mm 1:1.8: Corners a bit soft at f1.8, no CAs visible. Stopped down to f4 or f5.6 an excellent lens!

RE Auto Topcor 58mm 1:1.4: Huge lens (bigger than the Canon FD 1.2/55mm), a bit unusual (asymmetrical!!) construction due to the small Exacta bayonet. At f1.4 quite soft (but nice detail resolution), at f2 normal contrast, af f5.6 excellent also in the extreme corners. Nearly no CAs! Quite nasty background bokeh, extremely smooth foreground bokeh.

RE Auto Topcor 58mm 1:3.5 Macro: Five lenses, at infinity surprisingly good corners (probably even better than the Minolta MC/MD 3.5/50mm Macro), at f8 excellent from corner to corner. No CAs!

RE Auto Topcor 100mm 1:2.8: small, but quite heavy portrait lens. Excellent center sharpness wide open, at f2.8 a trace of missing resolution in the extreme corners. At f5.6 truely excellent from corner to corner. No CAs!

RE Auto Topcor 135mm 1:3.5: slightly less convincing than the 2.8/100mm - some remaining aberrations in the corners at f3.5, and some CAs, too. Similar to most other 3.5/135mm lenses from other manufacturers.

RE Auto Topcor 200mm 1:5.6: small, lightweight and slow, but excellent lens. Virtually no CAs, very good corner resolution from f5.6-11. Comparable to the best MF 200mm lenses such as Minolta MC/MD-I 4/200mm or Canon new FD 4/200mm IF, albeit one stop slower.

To be honest - i was surprised by the consistency of the performance of the entire set of eight lenses, especially since most of these constructions date from the early 1960s. In addition, most of these RE Topcors are remarkably well corrected for color aberrations as well.

I will add some test shots soon (100% corner crops from each lens).

Stephan

Last edited by stevemark on Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:52 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 12:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Great you got those - wonderful lenses indeed!

The 3.5/58mm is the MACRO, right? It has that written in its name usually Wink

You're missing the 85mm, which is truely outstanding, there has been one on ebay just a few days ago.


PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kds315* wrote:

The 3.5/58mm is the MACRO, right? It has that written in its name usually Wink

Oh yes, thanks for the hint - i've added the "Macro" in my original posting!


kds315* wrote:

You're missing the 85mm, which is truely outstanding, there has been one on ebay just a few days ago.

I guess it was quite expensive ... Wink
And i never buy from ebay anyway. Right now I prefer the fun of lurking around in real shops ... where things such as an MD 2.5/250mm RF can be found for CHF 100.-- Wink ... or the huge Mamiya Sekor C 105-210mm for CHF 10.-- !

Stephan


PostPosted: Wed Aug 03, 2016 2:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Interesting, you found bokeh disturbing using the RE 58/1.4. From my personal experience it subjectively seems really nice closed down a bit from f/1.4 Smile


PostPosted: Fri Aug 05, 2016 10:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
y wrote:
Interesting, you found bokeh disturbing using the RE 58/1.4. From my personal experience it subjectively seems really nice closed down a bit from f/1.4 Smile


As you might have noticed i was speaking about backgrund bokeh. The foreground bokeh of the Topcor RE 1.4/58mm bokeh is incredibly smooth Wink

Stephan


PostPosted: Sun Aug 07, 2016 9:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Corner crops? Who cares, these are superb lenses and the performance in the corners is perhaps the least important feature!


PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 7:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Stephan, your results are very consistent with Modern Photography's published tests from April 1962. They noted that most of the edge sharpness problems were due to curvature of field, particularly at close distances.


PostPosted: Sat Nov 19, 2016 11:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The 25mm 3.5 really is a gem, you should hunt one down, superb close focusing ability as well and the 35mm 2.8 is no slouch either.


PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 2:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Macca wrote:
The 25mm 3.5 really is a gem, you should hunt one down,

I never hunt any lens ... that would be too expensive. I simply take what's coming, and that's usually more than enough stuff ... The first Topcon stuff came as an early RE with RE Topcor 1.4/5.8cm for CHF 100.-- (about USD / EUR 100.--), the second round was a another - although later - Topcon RE with the RE Topcors 4/20mm, 1.8/58mm and 2.8/10cm for CHF 108.--, and finally we had this irresistable lot of RE Topcors containing the 2.8/28mm with hood, another 1.8/5.8cm, the 3.5/58mm Macro, and the 5.6/200mm as well as a third RE for CHF 180.--.


Macca wrote:
superb close focusing ability as well and the 35mm 2.8 is no slouch either.

I just another small test with the Topcors, this time including the 2.8/35mm. Results will be published soon.

Stephan


PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:
I just another small test with the Topcors, this time including the 2.8/35mm. Results will be published soon.

Great! Looking forward to it.


PostPosted: Fri Nov 25, 2016 9:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:
Macca wrote:
superb close focusing ability as well and the 35mm 2.8 is no slouch either.

I just another small test with the Topcors, this time including the 2.8/35mm. Results will be published soon.

Stephan


A comparison with some of the gems from other mounts would be interesting (e.g. Minolta MD 35/2.8 & 85/2, Canon (n)FD 100/2.8).
Also, a few test shots at close range might be interesting. The Minolta MD35/2.8 (and the MD35/1.8) has significant field curvature at close range.


PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 6:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Boris_Akunin wrote:
stevemark wrote:
Macca wrote:
superb close focusing ability as well and the 35mm 2.8 is no slouch either.

I just another small test with the Topcors, this time including the 2.8/35mm. Results will be published soon.

Stephan


A comparison with some of the gems from other mounts would be interesting (e.g. Minolta MD 35/2.8 & 85/2, Canon (n)FD 100/2.Cool.
Also, a few test shots at close range might be interesting. The Minolta MD35/2.8 (and the MD35/1.Cool has significant field curvature at close range.


I don't own the RE Topcor 2.8/35mm, therefore i can't repeat / extend the test right now ... but i doubt the Topcor would outperform a "modern" lens like the Minolta MD-III 2.8/35mm or the Canon nFD 2.8/35mm.

Stephan


PostPosted: Sun Nov 27, 2016 11:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The Topcor 2.8/35 is a superb lens, of course, I'm talking general use, not corner crops wide open Wink


PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 8:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:
Boris_Akunin wrote:
stevemark wrote:
Macca wrote:
superb close focusing ability as well and the 35mm 2.8 is no slouch either.

I just another small test with the Topcors, this time including the 2.8/35mm. Results will be published soon.

Stephan


A comparison with some of the gems from other mounts would be interesting (e.g. Minolta MD 35/2.8 & 85/2, Canon (n)FD 100/2.Cool.
Also, a few test shots at close range might be interesting. The Minolta MD35/2.8 (and the MD35/1.Cool has significant field curvature at close range.


I don't own the RE Topcor 2.8/35mm, therefore i can't repeat / extend the test right now ... but i doubt the Topcor would outperform a "modern" lens like the Minolta MD-III 2.8/35mm or the Canon nFD 2.8/35mm.

Stephan


Some of my results using it: https://www.flickr.com/photos/kds315/albums/72157634063921101


PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 9:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:
Boris_Akunin wrote:
stevemark wrote:
Macca wrote:
superb close focusing ability as well and the 35mm 2.8 is no slouch either.

I just another small test with the Topcors, this time including the 2.8/35mm. Results will be published soon.

Stephan


A comparison with some of the gems from other mounts would be interesting (e.g. Minolta MD 35/2.8 & 85/2, Canon (n)FD 100/2.Cool.
Also, a few test shots at close range might be interesting. The Minolta MD35/2.8 (and the MD35/1.Cool has significant field curvature at close range.


I don't own the RE Topcor 2.8/35mm, therefore i can't repeat / extend the test right now ... but i doubt the Topcor would outperform a "modern" lens like the Minolta MD-III 2.8/35mm or the Canon nFD 2.8/35mm.

Stephan


Well I often wonder what some of these lenses have that other don't......so what does the Topcor 35mm have that the Canon FDn 35mm doesn't especially when the Canon lens is fairly cheap and easier to get and would think many digi cameras can use FD adapters.
I have the FDn 35mm f2.8 and it gives very good results on a film camera, but not bothered if it's not as good as the best\most expensive...lens wide open.


PostPosted: Mon Nov 28, 2016 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
FWIW I did sell my copy of the Minolta MD 111 24mm 2.8 as I found it to be worse than the Topcor 25mm 3.5 at any aperture ( obviously except 2.Cool. Not as in depth tests as Stephan does, more daily usage and dirty tests. The guy who bought from me was happy with it though.

Stephan apologies for suggesting you "hunt" anything down, merely a term of preference, if you encounter one in your normal way of finding them I hope you get to test it. The 20mm f4 is good but the 25mm better.


PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 12:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Excalibur wrote:

...
Well I often wonder what some of these lenses have that other don't......so what does the Topcor 35mm have that the Canon FDn 35mm doesn't especially when the Canon lens is fairly cheap and easier to get and would think many digi cameras can use FD adapters.
...


I'm not an Topcon/Topcor expert at all - so others may respond more accurate than i do.

When i got my first RE Topcor (an 1.4/5.8cm) I was surprised how smooth focusing and aperture ring were - the lens is from the mid 1960s ...! Most of my MF Nikkors from the 1970s and 1980s are nowhere as smooth as my first RE Topcor. That was the first impresssion. Later, of course, a few other Topcors arrived with stiff focusing ...
Most of the RE designs origin from the 1960s, and at that time they certainly were top designs (in line with Leica and Alpa), prestigious and expensive. And i think that's why they are still being appreciated! Of course a carefully readjusted Topcor RE 2.8/28mm feels much nicer than a simple and plasticky MD-III or nFD 2.8/28mm. And obviously it is rarer Wink

Stephan


PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
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PostPosted: Tue Nov 29, 2016 2:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:
Excalibur wrote:

...
Well I often wonder what some of these lenses have that other don't......so what does the Topcor 35mm have that the Canon FDn 35mm doesn't especially when the Canon lens is fairly cheap and easier to get and would think many digi cameras can use FD adapters.
...


I'm not an Topcon/Topcor expert at all - so others may respond more accurate than i do.

When i got my first RE Topcor (an 1.4/5.8cm) I was surprised how smooth focusing and aperture ring were - the lens is from the mid 1960s ...! Most of my MF Nikkors from the 1970s and 1980s are nowhere as smooth as my first RE Topcor. That was the first impresssion. Later, of course, a few other Topcors arrived with stiff focusing ...
Most of the RE designs origin from the 1960s, and at that time they certainly were top designs (in line with Leica and Alpa), prestigious and expensive. And i think that's why they are still being appreciated! Of course a carefully readjusted Topcor RE 2.8/28mm feels much nicer than a simple and plasticky MD-III or nFD 2.8/28mm. And obviously it is rarer Wink

Stephan


Well you can always compare the Topcor RE 28mm with the heavy metal Canon Fd 28mm either f2.8 or F3.5 http://www.mir.com.my/rb/photography/companies/canon/fdresources/fdlenses/earlyfdlenses/28mmfd.htm


PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 5:08 pm    Post subject: Re: Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7 Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:


RE Auto Topcor 100mm 1:2.8: small, but quite heavy portrait lens. Excellent center sharpness wide open, at f2.8 a trace of missing resolution in the extreme corners. At f5.6 truely excellent from corner to corner. No CAs!


Quite heavy? Are you sure you meant that for this lens? it is one of the smallest and lightest 100mm lenses other than the Nikon E 100mm f/2.8 that I know. It's 265 grams while the Nikon E is 225g. The Nikon E is like a pancake 100mm and every other 100mm is heavier and larger.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 10:07 pm    Post subject: Re: Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7 Reply with quote
cbass wrote:
stevemark wrote:


RE Auto Topcor 100mm 1:2.8: small, but quite heavy portrait lens. Excellent center sharpness wide open, at f2.8 a trace of missing resolution in the extreme corners. At f5.6 truely excellent from corner to corner. No CAs!


Quite heavy? Are you sure you meant that for this lens? it is one of the smallest and lightest 100mm lenses other than the Nikon E 100mm f/2.8 that I know. It's 265 grams while the Nikon E is 225g. The Nikon E is like a pancake 100mm and every other 100mm is heavier and larger.


Actually, the Zuiko 100/2.8 is even smaller.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 06, 2022 11:36 pm    Post subject: Re: Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7 Reply with quote
caspert79 wrote:

Actually, the Zuiko 100/2.8 is even smaller.


That one is Nikon E size. Do you happen to have that one laying around to throw it into the Minolta/Topcor 100mm comparison?


PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2022 6:05 am    Post subject: Re: Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7 Reply with quote
cbass wrote:
caspert79 wrote:

Actually, the Zuiko 100/2.8 is even smaller.


That one is Nikon E size. Do you happen to have that one laying around to throw it into the Minolta/Topcor 100mm comparison?


Compared it before with the Minolta. Center resolution a bit higher than Minolta. Minolta better in corners. Minolta slightly more vivid colors.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 07, 2022 4:54 pm    Post subject: Re: Eight RE Topcors from 20mm to 200mm on the A7 Reply with quote
cbass wrote:
stevemark wrote:


RE Auto Topcor 100mm 1:2.8: small, but quite heavy portrait lens. Excellent center sharpness wide open, at f2.8 a trace of missing resolution in the extreme corners. At f5.6 truely excellent from corner to corner. No CAs!


Quite heavy? Are you sure you meant that for this lens? it is one of the smallest and lightest 100mm lenses other than the Nikon E 100mm f/2.8 that I know. It's 265 grams while the Nikon E is 225g. The Nikon E is like a pancake 100mm and every other 100mm is heavier and larger.


Sorry - not very precise description from my side.

The Topcor RE 2.8/100mm feels quite heavy since it is quite small, and nevertheless weighs 265 g.

S
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