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Camera body search for my MF lenses
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:00 pm    Post subject: Camera body search for my MF lenses Reply with quote

I own a couple hundred MF lenses. They fall generally into two categories:

*those with m42 mounts
*those with KAR mounts

I want to buy a mirrorless digital camera body to use with my lenses. Already own an Olympus E-PL1. Looking for camera body with a larger sensor, focus peaking, and shake reduction.

Like Pentax K-01 a lot but I worry it cannot work with my many Konica MF lenses? Not sure. Register distance issues? Adapter availability issues?

Only have several hundred $$ to spend. Any suggestions would be appreciated. I am lost. Crying or Very sad


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm in a similar situation, but not quite so many lenses Wink

Mostly for M42 and PK-mount lenses I use one of my Pentax DSLR's very successfully, so from that perspective the K-01 makes sense.

For virtually anything else (mostly Russian M39 r/f lenses) I use a Samsung NX5, which doesn't have focus-peaking, but it does have a "magnify" feature when using non-dedicated lenses in MF.

Your observation regarding Konica lenses is valid, they can't be used with infinity focus on a Pentax, even if you manage to find an adapter.

As the Samsung NX system is now effectively obsolete, lens adaptors are readily available on-line very cheaply, presumably as overstocks are cleared. The prices for s/h Samsung NX bodies seem to be steadily dropping as well. Do note that whilst most of the NX cameras only have the rear screen to use as a viewfinder, the NX5 and some others are "DSLR-styled" and have an electronic eye-level viewfinder as well. It's not "perfect", but I find it a lot easier to use. I have adaptors for nine different systems (including Konica) to fit my NX5 ... some of them I don't even have lenses for, but "just in case" Wink However, I don't know if or how well the focus-peaking works with MF lenses on the Samsung bodies that have that feature.

I'm not sure if there are any bodies other than Pentax with in-body image-stabilisation (anti-shake) that you can use with MF lenses, so you may have to compromise (as I have) and use a Pentax where shake-reduction is required and have another body for any lenses that won't fit on the Pentax.


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sony A7r ii

Save up for it! Price is dropping!

Seriously, a lesser camera cannot show full capabilities of lenses, especially one that crops the image circle.

Your extensive collection deserves to be shown at its best!


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:27 pm    Post subject: Re: Camera body search for my MF lenses Reply with quote

guardian wrote:
I own a couple hundred MF lenses. They fall generally into two categories:

*those with m42 mounts
*those with KAR mounts

I want to buy a mirrorless digital camera body to use with my lenses. Already own an Olympus E-PL1. Looking for camera body with a larger sensor, focus peaking, and shake reduction.

Like Pentax K-01 a lot but I worry it cannot work with my many Konica MF lenses? Not sure. Register distance issues? Adapter availability issues?

Only have several hundred $$ to spend. Any suggestions would be appreciated. I am lost. Crying or Very sad


For your KAR mount lenses you must go for a mirrorless system as the very short register distance of 40.5 mm won't fit on any existing DSLR like e.g. the Pentax ones.

Large senor, image peaking, shake reduction and limited budget is really a problem. The Sony A7 II which would offer all the requested features can most probably be found second hand within your budget. Anything else would be far more expensive.


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 5:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Having shot with the a7ii for several years I have to agree with Thomas. I have now upgraded to the a7rii for the better megapixels. But the a7ii is a fine camera, it has FF, IBIS and is mirrorless. With the recent intro of the A9 and price reductions on the a7rii and a7riii they can be had for 600 to 700 dollars on ebay. Save your pennies. Sell the EP and a couple of lenses. You will NOT regret it. It is certainly the best value that meets your criteria.


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 6:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It is very kind of you fellows to respond so quickly to my inquiry. Thanks so much to all of you.

Thank you!

Well, concerns regarding my KAR lenses on the Pentax K-01 are confirmed. Much regret. Everyone is so kind I feel safe in confessing what a fool I am:

I only just discovered the K-01 yesterday . . . six years too late! In the spirit of "you cannot get everything you want" I would be ready now to purchase that camera body new and forego use of my Konica lenses. I have so many MF lenses, I would not be wanting for glass to use with a K-01. And they were practically GIVING K-01 camera bodies away six years ago. I mean, setting aside KAR MF lenses, that camera body is practically designed for use with our MF lenses!! Of course the K-01 is not being manufactured today. Only used examples are available for purchase.

The price point of a K-01 body in 2012 was only several hundred dollars. Does anyone know of a similar product being manufactured today, equally MF lens friendly, which is available at an equivalent price point? If not I might just have to buy a used camera body, which I really would prefer avoiding.

But I need a low cost camera body which just LOVES MF lenses. The Pentax K-01 appears to be such a camera body. But are there others? I am such an idiot for not purchasing, for not even being aware of, the K-01 years ago. Believe me, even back then I owned way more than enough MF lenses to make the purchase smart.


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 7:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

When you can forgo shake reduction you can just get a Sony A6000 or a Fuji X-A5/X-T100 The only aps-c mirrorless bodies with shake reduction are the Sony a6500 and Fujifilm X-H1. Both pricey. But you might as well get a Sony A7 for 200 or so more.

Last edited by D1N0 on Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:30 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 8:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Anybody can go to https://www.adorama.com or https://www.bhphotovideo.com/ to sort the list of mirrorless cameras in order of price low to high to see new cameras available in your price range.


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D1N0 wrote:
When you can forgo shake reduction you can just get a Sony A6000 or a Fuji X-A5 The only aps-c mirrorless bodies with shake reduction are the Sony a6500 and Fujifilm X-H1. Both pricey. But you might as well get a Sony A7 for 200 or so more.


You might find a Fuji X-E1 cheaply or even X-E2 or X-E2s.
Superb cameras with everything except shake reduction.
They will take virtually all MF lenses, and adapters are cheap.
I have had X-E1 and now X-E2s and rarely use anything else for digital.
Of course I still shoot film so the MF lenses go on their matching film camera bodies for that.
Tom

#1


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, you could always get a Fujifilm GFX50R. Smile

51 megapixel Medium Format sensor. I know M42 lenses work with it. I don't know about a KAR adapter though.


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

guardian wrote:
... I need a low cost camera body which just LOVES MF lenses. The Pentax K-01 appears to be such a camera body. But are there others? I am such an idiot for not purchasing, for not even being aware of, the K-01 years ago. Believe me, even back then I owned way more than enough MF lenses to make the purchase smart.


If by MF lenses you mean M42 lenses the Pentax K-70 (currently on offer in the UK at £399.99 body only) fits all your pre-requisites (except mirrorless). A very up-to-date 24Mpixel sensor with excellent shake-reduction and focus-peaking on the tilting rotating "live-view" screen. I bought one three months ago and it's image quality is light-years ahead of the K-5 I previously used, which is very similar in specification to the K-01. My only regret is that the K-70 is now available even more cheaply than the "special offer" I had when I bought mine Wink


PostPosted: Wed Dec 19, 2018 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think your decision needs to take into account the lenses you like shooting.

i.e. Do you have a lot of wide angle lenses?

If so then 14mm, 17mm, 21mm, 24mm, 28mm are not used to their capability on an APS-C sensor camera, because they end up with a field of view like 21mm, 25mm, 32mm, 36mm, 42mm, etc, which is not really what they're capable of.

So in the end, I would also suggest the A7ii.


PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 6:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

dnas wrote:
I think your decision needs to take into account the lenses you like shooting.

i.e. Do you have a lot of wide angle lenses?

If so then 14mm, 17mm, 21mm, 24mm, 28mm are not used to their capability on an APS-C sensor camera, because they end up with a field of view like 21mm, 25mm, 32mm, 36mm, 42mm, etc, which is not really what they're capable of.

So in the end, I would also suggest the A7ii.


With only a few hundred to spend I'd expect that to be rather pricey. The original A7 would be significantly more affordable. Both are outside MY budget as I'm after a full spectrum converted model (which adds to the cost)
If wide angles is not a major concern one of the APSC e-mount bodies might be a good option (I think most or all the models over the last few years have the features wanted). That way if desired a FF model can be added when funds allow while still using the same adapters...


PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

All the additional comments are much appreciated. Many thanks.

I have been researching, here on the internet, as much as I'm able.

Insofar as I can determine the affordable Sony camera bodies (e.g., A7) do not offer any sort of image stabilization whatsoever. Apparently, as best I can glean, several years ago Sony believed it was a better approach to build the IS into the lens.

I can state with absolute certainty, beyond any doubt whatsoever, that not a single one of my MF lenses possesses an image stabilization mechanism, or function, of any sort or nature. And IS is a feature I want given plans to use whatever camera body I buy with my MF lenses, if not solely then at least heavily.

I continue to work on this and I will report back should an endpoint be reached. I hope this happens sooner rather than later.


PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If using a crop sensor on a budget, you can use a focal reducer to try to get more (~90%) of the 36x24 onto the sensor. Unfortunately, nobody is making one for Konica AR lenses, but I did read somewhere once of a person fitting a Konica lens receiver from a donor camera, onto a focal reducer made for a different system. Focal reducers do introduce their own problems at times, however.


PostPosted: Thu Dec 20, 2018 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

guardian wrote:
All the additional comments are much appreciated. Many thanks.

I have been researching, here on the internet, as much as I'm able.

Insofar as I can determine the affordable Sony camera bodies (e.g., A7) do not offer any sort of image stabilization whatsoever. Apparently, as best I can glean, several years ago Sony believed it was a better approach to build the IS into the lens.

I can state with absolute certainty, beyond any doubt whatsoever, that not a single one of my MF lenses possesses an image stabilization mechanism, or function, of any sort or nature. And IS is a feature I want given plans to use whatever camera body I buy with my MF lenses, if not solely then at least heavily.

I continue to work on this and I will report back should an endpoint be reached. I hope this happens sooner rather than later.


Thats no good then Sad

It's a shame the KAR lenses are AR not KA / RK as I first thought those would both fit on Pentax DSLRs which have has IBIS for around a decade.
AR lenses are somewhat more difficult to adapt & must be about the only common SLR mount I've not got an example of yet


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 3:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Again, I thank everyone for your very kind assists. The stuff you guys wrote really DID help me and all of your posts are surely appreciated.

I bought a Pentax K-01 mirrorless camera. As I wrote up thread I would be willing to do, I sacrificed being able to use my Konica MF glass. But I did get shake reduction, focus peaking, and a good measure of friendliness where MF lenses are concerned. The K-01 actually has an AF/MF switch! The camera was purposefully designed to use Pentax MF PK lenses going back to 1975, and with a simple adapter Pentax (or other) MF m42 lenses even older than that.

Cost was several hundred dollars for a used camera with snap count south of 500. The seller also threw in an f/2.8 40mm SMC Pentax-DA XS pancake lens, the one Pentax designed for use with the K-01. Since it is an AF lens it counts for nothing here, but it is a well regarded lens nevertheless and will be nice to have.

For what this camera cost I do not know of an alternative which would have satisfied my requirements. Also, reviews of the Pentax K-01 I found contained mostly praise.

So we shall see how this goes, see if the camera arrives and is as represented. You never know. Here is the auction:

Click here to see on Ebay then click see original listing


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I hope you like yellow. Smile

guardian wrote:
I own a couple hundred MF lenses. They fall generally into two categories:

*those with m42 mounts
*those with KAR mounts

I want to buy a mirrorless digital camera body to use with my lenses. Already own an Olympus E-PL1. Looking for camera body with a larger sensor, focus peaking, and shake reduction.

Like Pentax K-01 a lot but I worry it cannot work with my many Konica MF lenses? Not sure. Register distance issues? Adapter availability issues?

Only have several hundred $$ to spend. Any suggestions would be appreciated. I am lost. Crying or Very sad

Your Konica AR lenses will not reach infinity due to registration distance. I don't think there are any AR to K adapters because of that.
The A7II is probably the best option that fits most of your requirements, and prices in the $700-$1000 range.
It's native format size so 28mm is wide, yay.
I think the K-01 would have been more popular if it would have had a shorter register, IMO, it's failure is partly responsible for there not being a proper mirrorless from Ricoh/Pentax.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 8:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

guardian wrote:
Again, I thank everyone for your very kind assists. The stuff you guys wrote really DID help me and all of your posts are surely appreciated.

I bought a Pentax K-01 mirrorless camera.

Cost was several hundred dollars for a used camera with snap count south of 500. The seller also threw in an f/2.8 40mm SMC Pentax-DA XS pancake lens, the one Pentax designed for use with the K-01. Since it is an AF lens it counts for nothing here, but it is a well regarded lens nevertheless and will be nice to have.


Absolute gift! That lens alone can fetch a very good price (see https://www.amazon.com/Pentax-40mm-2-8-XS-Lens/dp/B0078KOEMA ) and might be well worth selling on if you've got no want/need for it Wink


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 10:57 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lightshow wrote:
I think the K-01 would have been more popular if it would have had a shorter register, IMO, it's failure is partly responsible for there not being a proper mirrorless from Ricoh/Pentax.


That's really a tragedy: Ricoh burried the excellent GXR-M concept because they acquired Pentax, Pentax never managed to implement a really nice mirrorless camera and obviously Pentax took over the whole development lead.
The K-01 was only designed for Pentax hard core fans and failed therefore totally. Not even a viewfinder or at least a tilt screen was impemented and the usage of lenses is limited to Pentax-K and M42.
Most probably Ricoh/Pentax will totally disappear sooner or later as well as obviously their camera business is already on the edge. Sad story.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 11:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tb_a wrote:

Most probably Ricoh/Pentax will totally disappear sooner or later as well as obviously their camera business is already on the edge. Sad story.
Unfortunately I also think this is likely, as far as the camera-business is concerned. Ricoh has capital to inject in this, but I see little dedication to make it happen. Even Ricoh's own GR-III has been delayed forever and I fear for Ricoh that meanwhile the market has moved on. Due to this, I'm unsure what to do with my GXR. Although I really like the concept and the quirkiness, I find it a bit small to use with MF-lenses. But it might become some sort of relic Question

But back on topic, to use K-mount lenses, a Pentax-camera is a really nice choice.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

kypfer wrote:


Absolute gift! That lens alone can fetch a very good price (see https://www.amazon.com/Pentax-40mm-2-8-XS-Lens/dp/B0078KOEMA ) and might be well worth selling on if you've got no want/need for it Wink


Happy Dog Happy Cat Like Dog


Friends

I see you know and recognize that highly-rated lens!! I was actually pretty pumped to get it. And I have no plans whatsoever for a sale. Wink


Sjak wrote:

But back on topic, to use K-mount lenses, a Pentax-camera is a really nice choice.


Agreed, except that I would say K-mount lenses OR m42 lenses



Full disclosure:

Guys I'm probably gonna write more here than I should. I've long been a fan of quirky cameras. My DSLR is a Sigma SD14 . . . of all things! But here is the deal:

The Sigma SA mount bears a certain similarity to the PK mount. It's not a perfectly correct fit. But with minor modification I have been able, in the past, actually to mount MF lenses with Pentax PK mounts onto my Sigma camera body. And my ownership of an SD14, over the years, is what was responsible for acquisition of so many m42 MF lenses. This because adaptation to Sigma SA from other than m42 lenses is a tough slough.

I continue to love my SD14. But it has no focus peaking, it has no shake reduction at all, and I am becoming older by the day. Still have a fairly steady hand but I'm no spring chicken! Also I did not want to spend a fortune. So perhaps you begin to glean why the Pentax K-01 was a fit for me . . . . for now. The future?

Continue to want a FF camera body with register distance that will accommodate all my MF lenses, including Konica AR. The one I want already (and finally) exists, but it is so new that adapters remain for now a challenge, a severe impediment to purchase for MF lens folks. That camera body is the Nikon Z6. Why a Z mount?

Because the Z mount diameter is sufficiently large properly to implement IBIS with a FF sensor. I will not buy a FF camera body whose mount diameter was actually sized for an APS-C sensor. Period.

The Pentax K-01 in this regard? Clearly the PK mount diameter is more than adequate properly to implement shake reduction given this camera body's small APS-C sensor size.


Last edited by guardian on Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:56 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sjak wrote:
I'm unsure what to do with my GXR. Although I really like the concept and the quirkiness, I find it a bit small to use with MF-lenses. But it might become some sort of relic Question


I'll certainly keep my GXR's forever. Fortunately I've got 2 complete M-sets plus the 28 and 50 mm lensor and the long small sensor zoom. A complete GXR-M (body, M-module and EVF) is also used rather expensive and there is no better APS-C camera in existence for the use of old RF lenses (developed for film) on digital as it was developed exactly for this purpose. It's in combination with the small RF-lenses still my most preferred set-up for hiking and holidays.


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 2:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tb_a wrote:
I'll certainly keep my GXR's forever. Fortunately I've got 2 complete M-sets plus the 28 and 50 mm lensor and the long small sensor zoom. A complete GXR-M (body, M-module and EVF) is also used rather expensive
Yes, that's one of the reasons I may sell it... I have a very clean body, a newlike M-module, 2 small-sensor zooms, EVF, newlike flash.

tb_a wrote:
and there is no better APS-C camera in existence for the use of old RF lenses (developed for film) on digital as it was developed exactly for this purpose. It's in combination with the small RF-lenses still my most preferred set-up for hiking and holidays.
I absolutely love the fact that Ricoh went this far with this concept. But somehow I never bonded with the system in use. I also got an ultra-cheap GX100 to see if it's (1) the Ricoh-interface (2) the ergo with manual lenses, or (3) me needing to get used to it / use the right lenses on it. It's certainly not (1) so will figure out whether it's 2 or 3. If it's 3, I'll put it for sale. I put a lot of effort in gathering the system so I'm not going to give up too easily Wink


PostPosted: Fri Dec 21, 2018 2:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

guardian wrote:

Continue to want a FF camera body with register distance that will accommodate all my MF lenses, including Konica AR. The one I want already (and finally) exists, but it is so new that adapters remain for now a challenge, a severe impediment to purchase for MF lens folks. That camera body is the Nikon Z6. Why a Z mount?

Because the Z mount diameter is sufficiently large properly to implement IBIS with a FF sensor. I will not buy a FF camera body whose mount diameter was actually sized for an APS-C sensor. Period.


What has the camera mount diameter to do with the functionality of IBIS where the sensor is moving? IMHO this diameter may in the worst case only limit the diameter of the rear optical element of the lens itself.
Maybe somebody is able to explain the relationship betw. mount diameter and IBIS. I would love to learn the theory behind. It sound's a little bit esotheric for me.

I don't know which marketing department invented that story. Was is Nikon or Canon?