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Himself
Joined: 01 Mar 2007
Posts: 3242
Location: Montreal
Expire: 2013-05-30
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 Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 10:59 pm Post subject: RAW file |
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Himself wrote:
I have a 10M RAW picture taken with a 60-300mm SP Tamron.
For my 350D the maximum would be 8.2M.
Anyone have an answer for that?
How is it possible? |
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A G Photography
Joined: 11 May 2008
Posts: 1480
Location: Bologna - Italy
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 11:28 pm Post subject: |
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A G Photography wrote:
RAW files are compressed without loss of info, so dimension is relative to the number of details in the shot. The more details (alas different coloured pixels) the larger the RAW.
So there's no "maximum" dimension other than pixel resolution (height x width in pixels) multiplied for pixel depth (12 bit for a 350D).
Looking at RAW dimensions is also an almost sure shot to select the best detailed and focused shot (more details -> huger file).
Hope this makes sense to you.
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Himself
Joined: 01 Mar 2007
Posts: 3242
Location: Montreal
Expire: 2013-05-30
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| Posted: Sun May 25, 2008 11:54 pm Post subject: |
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Himself wrote:
Kind of.
I still don't understand why the manufacturer set 8.2M as a maximum while it's possible to reach more than that? |
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maddog10
Joined: 08 Apr 2008
Posts: 1072
Location: Maryland, USA
Expire: 2015-02-12
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 12:19 am Post subject: |
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maddog10 wrote:
It must be based on averages.
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Brian
Joined: 10 May 2008
Posts: 83
Location: Virginia, US
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 1:08 am Post subject: |
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Brian wrote:
There are lossless compression algorithms that will produce variable length files, with the exact size based on scene content. Usually, such compression schemes yield 2x~3x reduction from raw data. Under "pathological" cases, they can actually cause the compressed file to be bigger than the raw file. Huffman code is an example. |
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Athiril
Joined: 16 May 2008
Posts: 85
Location: Melbourne, Vic, Australia
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 1:56 am Post subject: |
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Athiril wrote:
Canon use lossless compression on their RAW files, you notice this with differing file sizes on the RAW files, otherwise theyd all be the same size. |
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LucisPictor
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 17633
Location: Oberhessen, Germany / Maidstone ('95-'96)
Expire: 2013-12-03
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 5:46 am Post subject: |
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LucisPictor wrote:
An uncompressed RAW file shot with an 8.2 MPix camera would not result in a 8.2 MB file! It would be much bigger.
You can try it: open a full-size RAW image in Photoshop (or whatever you use) and save it as a TIFF-file. The you see the actual, uncrompressed size.
In order to avoid these big files, RAW undergoes a lossless compression (remotely related to ZIP compression).
And thus a 8.2 MPix image might turn into a 10 MB RAW file (but not 30 MB).
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esrods
Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 148
Location: Sydney Australia
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 7:54 am Post subject: |
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esrods wrote:
I can see an apple and an orange. Camera's 8.2M refers to the total number of pixels where as the file refers to bytes. Each pixel has 3 bytes for colour (1 for red, green, and blue). So uncompressed 8.2M image has a file size of 24.6M bytes.
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Borges
Joined: 09 Mar 2007
Posts: 646
Location: Moers, Germany
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 8:11 am Post subject: |
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Borges wrote:
In germany we call it "comparing apples with peaches" - byte vs. pixel 
Michael
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zewrak
Joined: 12 Apr 2008
Posts: 1212
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 8:23 am Post subject: |
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zewrak wrote:
| esrods wrote: |
| I can see an apple and an orange. Camera's 8.2M refers to the total number of pixels where as the file refers to bytes. Each pixel has 3 bytes for colour (1 for red, green, and blue). So uncompressed 8.2M image has a file size of 24.6M bytes. |
+ ofcourse the metadata which contains settings of the camera, time and date when shot etc.
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ChrisLilley
Joined: 01 Jan 2008
Posts: 1767
Location: Nice, France
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 10:11 am Post subject: |
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ChrisLilley wrote:
| esrods wrote: |
| I can see an apple and an orange. Camera's 8.2M refers to the total number of pixels where as the file refers to bytes. Each pixel has 3 bytes for colour (1 for red, green, and blue). So uncompressed 8.2M image has a file size of 24.6M bytes. |
An uncompressed 8.2M RGB image at 8 bits per component has a file size of (8.2 x 3 = ) 24.6M, yes (ignoring any header information).
Raw files are not RGB (or else you would not be able to redo the white balance). They have a single value per pixel; the position of the pixel says whether that was covered by a red, green, or blue filter in the Bayer array. But that single value is 12 or 14 bits (otherwise there would be no lattitude for exposure compensation or tone mapping) which is typically stored in 16 bits for ease of processing.
Thus, an uncompressed 8.2M RAW file should be around 16.4M.
(This discussion ignores Foveon sensors or the Sony RGBA sensor)
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Last edited by ChrisLilley on Mon May 26, 2008 2:27 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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esrods
Joined: 23 Sep 2007
Posts: 148
Location: Sydney Australia
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| Posted: Mon May 26, 2008 10:33 am Post subject: |
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esrods wrote:
Thank you, Chris, for explaining RAW format.
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