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ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011 Posts: 2726 Location: Kiel, Germany.
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:37 am Post subject: Which lenses would deserve a remake? |
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ForenSeil wrote:
Hi!
Some lenses like the Helios 40-2 85/1.5 and a retrostyle Petzval for DSLR where "restartet" on the market.
Do you know any further lenses (or kind of lenses) which would make you happy to get as a remake?
No matter if AF or MF, old or young etc.
For example I would love to hear that Sony would reboot the really tiny but highly praised Minolta MD 250/5.6 Mirror lens (maybe as AF for E-Mount?) _________________ I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language) |
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duckrider
Joined: 11 Dec 2013 Posts: 437 Location: Germany
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 2:39 am Post subject: |
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duckrider wrote:
The original Hologon 15mm 3 lens type & Kern Makro Switar Apochromat deserve higly to be rebuild again! Older Summilux 35 aspherical (the original type, not the one with pressed asph.lenses!) too. Zeiss 2/85mm for M-mount. Nikon classics in brass & glass, not the plastic bullshitt from today.
Novoflex makro 35mm Noflexar. ....and some other... _________________ T*homas
(from the origin land of Zeiss, an obligation )
Zeiss ZF 3.5/18, 2.8/25, 2.0/35, 2/50macro, 1.4/50, 1.4/85, 2/100macro
Nikon Df, F2AS, F2A, F3/T, FM
ALPA 11Si, Angulon 2,8/35 ; Xenar 1,9/50 ; Tele-Tessar 4/200
Leica R3 SAFARI Safari Lenses 2.8/28 ; 2/50 ; 4/180
Rolleiflex SL 350 , Zeiss 2,8/16 ; 4/18 ; 2,8/25 ; 2,8/35 ; 1,4/35 ; 1,8/50 ; 2,8/85 ; 1,4/85 ; 4/135 ; 4/200
Leica M9-P, Leica M4-2, Tri-Elmar "Wate", Distagon 2,8/21, Biogon 2,8/28, Biogon 2/35, Planar 2/50, Tessar 4/85, M-Elmar 50mm, Summicron 90
Sony alpha 7r & adapters for all lenses above |
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luisalegria
Joined: 07 Mar 2008 Posts: 6602 Location: San Francisco, USA
Expire: 2018-01-18
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:10 am Post subject: |
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luisalegria wrote:
Simple one- Meyer Trioplan 100/2.8
Maybe too similar to the Helios, but the 75/1.5 Biotar is IMHO more desirable. _________________ I like Pentax DSLR's, Exaktas, M42 bodies of all kinds, strange and cheap Japanese lenses, and am dabbling in medium format/Speed Graphic work. |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:15 am Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Funny, I was going to say a triplet, but not the Trioplan 2.8/100, which to me, is an example of a bad triplet. I'd much rather see one of the great ones like the Triotar 4/85 and 4/135. I've yet to find a 2.8 or 2.9 triplet that was any good to be honest, f4 seems to be the maximum for the triplet design without sacrificing too much quality.
I'd also like to see a full range of Sonnars and some dialytes like the Meyer Helioplan and Cooke Aviar.
Just about any of the old classic designs for primes would be infinitely preferable to the modern zoom lenses which are mostly junk. _________________ I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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luisalegria
Joined: 07 Mar 2008 Posts: 6602 Location: San Francisco, USA
Expire: 2018-01-18
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:14 am Post subject: |
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luisalegria wrote:
With the Trioplan, like the Petzvals, the point is that "its so bad its good".
As for modern lenses, the wide zooms are mostly better than the old primes.
And long tele modern lenses, even the more expensive zooms, are much superior to the old simple ones.
The cheap modern zooms are not better, true, and often worse than the classic primes. _________________ I like Pentax DSLR's, Exaktas, M42 bodies of all kinds, strange and cheap Japanese lenses, and am dabbling in medium format/Speed Graphic work. |
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Lightshow
Joined: 04 Nov 2011 Posts: 3666 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 4:55 am Post subject: |
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Lightshow wrote:
I'd love to see the Topcor's updated with newer coatings, better grips, and a better mount than Exakta.
Rokkor 58/1.2 & 28/2.5 with newer coatings.
nFD 50/1.2L, 85/1.2L, & 80-200/4L but in EF mount.
Contax.... Nuff said.
Leica R... Ditto.
A FF digital OM1 with manual and AF lenses. _________________ A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
My lens list
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/ |
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duckrider
Joined: 11 Dec 2013 Posts: 437 Location: Germany
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:32 am Post subject: |
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duckrider wrote:
Forgot:
Thambar & Imagon! _________________ T*homas
(from the origin land of Zeiss, an obligation )
Zeiss ZF 3.5/18, 2.8/25, 2.0/35, 2/50macro, 1.4/50, 1.4/85, 2/100macro
Nikon Df, F2AS, F2A, F3/T, FM
ALPA 11Si, Angulon 2,8/35 ; Xenar 1,9/50 ; Tele-Tessar 4/200
Leica R3 SAFARI Safari Lenses 2.8/28 ; 2/50 ; 4/180
Rolleiflex SL 350 , Zeiss 2,8/16 ; 4/18 ; 2,8/25 ; 2,8/35 ; 1,4/35 ; 1,8/50 ; 2,8/85 ; 1,4/85 ; 4/135 ; 4/200
Leica M9-P, Leica M4-2, Tri-Elmar "Wate", Distagon 2,8/21, Biogon 2,8/28, Biogon 2/35, Planar 2/50, Tessar 4/85, M-Elmar 50mm, Summicron 90
Sony alpha 7r & adapters for all lenses above |
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scsambrook
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 2167 Location: Glasgow Scotland
Expire: 2011-11-18
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:44 am Post subject: |
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scsambrook wrote:
Yes, the Thambar, please. And the 73/1.9 Hektor (which I've never actually been able to try) and the 85/1.5 Summarex. _________________ Stephen
Equipment: Pentax DSLR for casual shooting, Lumix G1 and Fuji XE-1 for playing with old lenses, and Leica M8 because I still like the optical rangefinder system. |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:55 am Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
luisalegria wrote: |
With the Trioplan, like the Petzvals, the point is that "its so bad its good".
As for modern lenses, the wide zooms are mostly better than the old primes.
And long tele modern lenses, even the more expensive zooms, are much superior to the old simple ones.
The cheap modern zooms are not better, true, and often worse than the classic primes. |
When I called them junk I was referring to the excreable almost disposable build quality. Even mega expensive stuff like the Canon L 1.2/50 which is held together with sticky tape.
Honestly, most modern lenses are such nasty cheap plastic trash that even if they were a lot better in IQ than an old lens I still wouldn't want them. _________________ I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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56 DIN
Joined: 24 Apr 2010 Posts: 1656 Location: Germany Erbach /ODW
Expire: 2021-11-18
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:01 am Post subject: |
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56 DIN wrote:
not one single lens
everything in it´s time, only fashion repeats itself all 20 years _________________ Thomas
NEX & manual lenses
Nikon & manual lenses |
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calvin83
Joined: 12 Apr 2009 Posts: 7555 Location: Hong Kong
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 10:08 am Post subject: |
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calvin83 wrote:
We maybe able remake the lens but not the historical value.
P.S. The optical glasses for the old lenses may not available anymore. _________________ https://lensfever.com/
https://www.instagram.com/_lens_fever/
The best lens is the one you have with you. |
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Arkku
Joined: 28 Feb 2007 Posts: 1416 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 11:38 am Post subject: |
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Arkku wrote:
APO Lanthar 125mm f/2.5? =) |
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scsambrook
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 2167 Location: Glasgow Scotland
Expire: 2011-11-18
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:17 pm Post subject: |
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scsambrook wrote:
We all know we're only dreaming . . . but I've got to say I can't really agree with Ian when he says
Honestly, most modern lenses are such nasty cheap plastic trash that even if they were a lot better in IQ than an old lens I still wouldn't want them.
I have some very nice and well regarded (and now costly) older lenses. I also have some dirt-cheap modern cheap plastic ones that are optically undeniably 'better' than some of the Old And Great Ones. My almost-all-plastic AF Pentax 50-200 zoom has a wobbly barrel when set to 200mm and it rattles if I shake it, but the results are simply first class. And - Glory of Glories - it and my similarly plastic AF 35/2.4 (which will give the much vaunted 35 Flektogon a run for its money any time) weigh next to nothing in a bag when I go walking. I'm happy to own such nasty things.
If Ian's taken apart as many old lenses as I reckon he has, he's probably got a good idea of how poorly made many of them actually were _________________ Stephen
Equipment: Pentax DSLR for casual shooting, Lumix G1 and Fuji XE-1 for playing with old lenses, and Leica M8 because I still like the optical rangefinder system. |
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fatdeeman
Joined: 13 Jun 2009 Posts: 780 Location: UK
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 5:56 pm Post subject: |
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fatdeeman wrote:
Arkku wrote: |
APO Lanthar 125mm f/2.5? =) |
This!
What an incredible lens and I will probably never own one because it fetches up to 3x it's original RRP!
I have a 90mm F/3.5 APO Lanthar and it's a wonderful little lens so I can only imagine what a joy the 125mm is to use! _________________ - Dave
www.lensporn.net
www.flickr.com/photos/fatdeeman/
DSLR: Canon EOS 60D, Samsung GX-1S (Pentax *ist DS2)
Mirrorless: Panasonic DMC-G1, Sony NEX-5N
Compact: Canon PowerShot G3
Lenses:
Wide: Tokina RMC 28mm F/2.8, Tamron Adaptall 2 28mm F/2.5, Sun Optical 28mm F/2.5, Super paragon 28mm F/2.8, Sigma filtermatic 24mm F/2.8, Fujinon 35mm F/2.8, Sun Optical 35mm F/2.8
Standard: Industar 50-2, Helios 44-2, Helios 44M, Helios 44M-3, Pentax-M 50mm F/1.4, Pentax-M 50mm F/1.7, Pentax-M 50mm F/2, Ricoh 50mm F/1.7, Chinon 50mm F/1.7
Tele: Pentacon 135mm F/2.8, Pentacon 200mm F/3.5, Optomax 200mm f/3.5, Sun Optical 135mm F/3.5, Soligor 350mm F/5.6
Zoom: Tokina 28-70mm f/3.5-4.5 SZ-X270 SD, Sigma Zoom Pi 35-200mm F4-5.6, Sun Optical 28-80mm F/3.5-4.5, Sunagor 80-205mm F/3.8, Tokina RMC 80-200mm F/4, Vivitar 70-150mm F/3.8, Tamron 95-205mm F/6.3, Tamron Adaptall 28-200mm F/3.8-5.6 LD Aspherical, Tokina RMC 70-210mm F/3.5
Mirror: Falcon (Samyang) 800mm F/8, MTO-11CA 1000mm F/10, Tamron Adaptall 2 500mm F/8
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CuriousOne
Joined: 31 Dec 2013 Posts: 669 Location: Home
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:21 pm Post subject: |
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CuriousOne wrote:
I'd like to have AF Tair-3, in more modern and lighter body. _________________ I have nothing to compensate with lens |
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JohnBar
Joined: 21 Jun 2012 Posts: 581 Location: Liverpool
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:27 pm Post subject: |
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JohnBar wrote:
calvin83 wrote: |
We maybe able remake the lens but not the historical value.
P.S. The optical glasses for the old lenses may not available anymore. |
This echoes my belief in that the reason the classic lenses look so good is down to the recipe that they used for the glass. German glass from the 50s and 60s is in a world of its own, often made with ingredients such as lead and rare earth elements. Reproducing glass like this would probably not be possible in the modern world because of RoHS directives or some other restriction imposed by a nanny state.
Then again construction quality would be horrendously expensive in the modern age. Take for example the Schneider Xenar for Retina which can be bought quite cheaply but would cost a lot to make today. Here are someones thoughts about the Xenar
"Xenar f2.8 50mm noted 1956 from Schneider. This is a full quality item in a heavy
chromed brass mount and well above the 3 glass lenses in performance- and original price. For most purposes
it matches the Zeiss Tessar as a top grade lens and finding differences would be a laboratory test job." _________________ Rectilux 3FF Series single focus anamorphic attachments
http://www.transferconvert.co.uk/cinemania/rectilux-3ff.html
Regular News on https://www.facebook.com/pages/Rectilux/704770636267200 |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 6:46 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Of course the Xenar matches the Tessar - they use the same design! Actually, the Voigtlander Color-Skopar 2.8/50 is better than either the Xenar or Tessar 2.8/50s, probably due to the rare earth glasses it uses. Albrecht Tronnier recalculated the Voigtlander lens designs in the 1948-50 time period to take account of new glass types and for a few years, until Zeiss and Leitz got their act together post-war, Voigtlander were making the best 35mm format lenses in the world.
The point about the banned glass types is valid, additives like Thorium and Lanthanum are banned. Lanthanum glass as used by companies like Zeiss and Voigtlander can only be matched in refractive index today by exotic stuff like fluorite. _________________ I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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Lightshow
Joined: 04 Nov 2011 Posts: 3666 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:28 pm Post subject: |
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Lightshow wrote:
fatdeeman wrote: |
Arkku wrote: |
APO Lanthar 125mm f/2.5? =) |
This!
What an incredible lens and I will probably never own one because it fetches up to 3x it's original RRP!
I have a 90mm F/3.5 APO Lanthar and it's a wonderful little lens so I can only imagine what a joy the 125mm is to use! |
Add me to the list, I want the 125 quite bad.
Here's a question... Are there any APO wide angle lenses? _________________ A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
My lens list
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/ |
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Nordentro
Joined: 24 Jun 2010 Posts: 4713 Location: Lillehammer, Norway
Expire: 2015-01-29
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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Nordentro wrote:
The "dream lens", Canon 50mm f/0.95 LTM _________________ Lars | Manuellfokus.no |
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ForenSeil
Joined: 15 Apr 2011 Posts: 2726 Location: Kiel, Germany.
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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ForenSeil wrote:
Lightshow wrote: |
Here's a question... Are there any APO wide angle lenses? |
Rodenstock 35mm f/4.5 Apo-Grandagon (up to 6x9 coverage I think, so VERY wide)
But I don't know any serious APOs with <50mm focal length for 35mm
I heard that Leitz is currently developing an Apo-Summicron 35/2 _________________ I'm not a collector, I'm a tester
My camera: Sony A7+Zeiss Sonnar 55/1.8
Current favourite lenses (I have many more):
A few macro-Tominons, Samyang 12/2.8, Noritsu 50.7/9.5, Rodagon 105/5.6 on bellows, Samyang 135/2, Nikon ED 180/2.8, Leitz Elmar-R 250/4, Celestron C8 2000mm F10
Most wanted: Samyang 24/1.4, Samyang 35/1.4, Nikon 200/2 ED
My Blog: http://picturechemistry.own-blog.com/
(German language) |
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Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 57865 Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
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Posted: Mon Mar 31, 2014 9:19 pm Post subject: |
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Attila wrote:
Almost all deserve it, even Domiplan LOL _________________ -------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
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sichko
Joined: 20 Jun 2008 Posts: 2475 Location: South West UK
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Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 1:53 pm Post subject: |
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sichko wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The point about the banned glass types is valid, additives like Thorium and Lanthanum are banned. |
Are you sure about Lanthanum being banned ? Lanthanum glasses appear to be available from Schott and the like.
Quote: |
Lanthanum glass as used by companies like Zeiss and Voigtlander can only be matched in refractive index today by exotic stuff like fluorite. |
Do you mean dispersion (variation in refractive index with wavelength) rather than refractive index (RI) ? Fluorite has a low RI whereas Lanthanum glasses have, typically, high RIs. However both have low dispersion values. _________________ John |
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Arkku
Joined: 28 Feb 2007 Posts: 1416 Location: Helsinki, Finland
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Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 2:39 pm Post subject: |
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Arkku wrote:
sichko wrote: |
iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The point about the banned glass types is valid, additives like Thorium and Lanthanum are banned. |
Are you sure about Lanthanum being banned ? Lanthanum glasses appear to be available from Schott and the like.
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It would also be interesting to see a reference about thorium being banned. I've been trying to find out if it is the case or not, and haven't been able to come up with any info either way. My assumption has been that it's not technically banned but just not commercially viable anymore. |
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GeorgeSalt
Joined: 09 Feb 2013 Posts: 336 Location: Norfolk, UK
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Posted: Tue Apr 01, 2014 10:33 pm Post subject: |
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GeorgeSalt wrote:
Arkku wrote: |
sichko wrote: |
iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
The point about the banned glass types is valid, additives like Thorium and Lanthanum are banned. |
Are you sure about Lanthanum being banned ? Lanthanum glasses appear to be available from Schott and the like.
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It would also be interesting to see a reference about thorium being banned. I've been trying to find out if it is the case or not, and haven't been able to come up with any info either way. My assumption has been that it's not technically banned but just not commercially viable anymore. |
I'd be inclined to agree with the last statement. Thorium is still widely used, just not for optics. Combine the relatively low radiation risk, the environmental disposal considerations and then throw in that the characteristic that thorium glass has non-stable optical properties that degrade with time.. and the commercial viability soon looks less promising. Thorium isn't a banned substance as far as I can see.
Lanthanum is still used for optical glass. It's not banned. |
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