| View previous topic :: View next topic |
| Author |
Message |
Jesito
Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5745
Location: Olivella, Catalonia, (Spain)
Expire: 2015-01-07
|
 Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:20 pm Post subject: Have you tried Kodak Vision 3 250D ? |
 |
|
Jesito wrote:
It's not C-41 but ECN2. It does need a previous developing bath to remove the anti-halo layer, but gives an outstanding dynamic range of about 16Ev with no grain... Local people are getting mad with it. Very useful on backlit situations (very common here with the strong sunlight we suffer most of the year).
A colleague, (Kowska) tells on his site how to prepare the previous bath (and then use C-41 afterwards).
You can find resulting samples from Kowska here:
One of his samples:
Regards.
Jes
_________________
Jesito, Moderator 
Jesito's backsack:
Zooms Sigma 70-300, Tamron 35-135 and 70-210 short, 70-210 long, 28-70 CF Macro, 35-70, 35-80, Vivitar 70-210 KA, Tamron 70-250.
Fixed Industar-50, , Tamron 24mm, Tamron 135mm, Sands Hunter 135mm, Pancolar 50mm, Volna-3, many Exakta lenses
DSLR SIGMA SD9 & SD14, EOS 5D, Sony A700 and NEXF3, Oly E-330, E-400, E-450, E-1
TLR/6x6/645 YashicaMat, Petri 6x45, Nettar, Franka Solida, Brilliant
SLR Minolta X300, Fuji STX II, Praktica VLC3, Pentax P30t, EXA500, EXA 1A, Spotmatic(2), Chinon CM-4S, Ricoh, Contax, Konica TC-X , Minolta 5000, 7000i, 3Sxi, EOS 500 and CX
Rangefinders Chinon 35EE, Konica C35 auto, Canonet 28, Yashica Lynx, FED-2, Yashica electro 35, Argus C3 & C4, Regula Cita III, Voigtlander Vitoret (many), Welta Welti-I, Kodak Signette 35, Zorki-4, Bessa-R & L, Minolta Weathermatic, olympus XA2
Compact Film Konica C35V, Voigtlander Vitorets, Canon Prima Super 105, Olympus XA2 and XA3
Compact Digital Olympus C-5050, Aiptek Slim 3000, Canon Powershot A540, Nikon 5200, SIGMA DP1s, Polaroid X530, IXUS55, Kodak 6490, Powershot G9 and G10
CSCCanon EOS-M, Samsung NX100 and NX210, Lumix G5, NEX-F3
Last edited by Jesito on Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:16 pm; edited 1 time in total |
|
| Back to top |
|
 |
Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 57865
Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:26 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Attila wrote:
I did try once , never more my jobo tank was all over with graphite... it was very hard to clean it
_________________
-------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jesito
Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5745
Location: Olivella, Catalonia, (Spain)
Expire: 2015-01-07
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 7:45 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Jesito wrote:
| Attila wrote: |
| I did try once , never more my jobo tank was all over with graphite... it was very hard to clean it |
Our local colleagues don't use Jobo's, they develop straight on a tank, I'll comment on this there.
What about the results?. Do you keep samples?.
Thanks,
Jes.
_________________
Jesito, Moderator
Jesito's backsack:
Zooms Sigma 70-300, Tamron 35-135 and 70-210 short, 70-210 long, 28-70 CF Macro, 35-70, 35-80, Vivitar 70-210 KA, Tamron 70-250.
Fixed Industar-50, , Tamron 24mm, Tamron 135mm, Sands Hunter 135mm, Pancolar 50mm, Volna-3, many Exakta lenses
DSLR SIGMA SD9 & SD14, EOS 5D, Sony A700 and NEXF3, Oly E-330, E-400, E-450, E-1
TLR/6x6/645 YashicaMat, Petri 6x45, Nettar, Franka Solida, Brilliant
SLR Minolta X300, Fuji STX II, Praktica VLC3, Pentax P30t, EXA500, EXA 1A, Spotmatic(2), Chinon CM-4S, Ricoh, Contax, Konica TC-X , Minolta 5000, 7000i, 3Sxi, EOS 500 and CX
Rangefinders Chinon 35EE, Konica C35 auto, Canonet 28, Yashica Lynx, FED-2, Yashica electro 35, Argus C3 & C4, Regula Cita III, Voigtlander Vitoret (many), Welta Welti-I, Kodak Signette 35, Zorki-4, Bessa-R & L, Minolta Weathermatic, olympus XA2
Compact Film Konica C35V, Voigtlander Vitorets, Canon Prima Super 105, Olympus XA2 and XA3
Compact Digital Olympus C-5050, Aiptek Slim 3000, Canon Powershot A540, Nikon 5200, SIGMA DP1s, Polaroid X530, IXUS55, Kodak 6490, Powershot G9 and G10
CSCCanon EOS-M, Samsung NX100 and NX210, Lumix G5, NEX-F3 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 57865
Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 9:57 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Attila wrote:
| Jesito wrote: |
| Attila wrote: |
| I did try once , never more my jobo tank was all over with graphite... it was very hard to clean it |
Our local colleagues don't use Jobo's, they develop straight on a tank, I'll comment on this there.
What about the results?. Do you keep samples?.
Thanks,
Jes. |
Result was disaster I did throw out 3 rolls.
_________________
-------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
berraneck
Joined: 24 May 2009
Posts: 972
Location: prague, czech republic
|
| Posted: Fri Dec 07, 2012 10:56 pm Post subject: |
|
|
berraneck wrote:
yes this remjet layer on ECN2 film is a huge problem. so you say, there is a way how to remove it at home DIY? I can have lots of Kodak Vision for nearly funny price (around 1€/roll), but never bought it because if this issue
_________________
equipment doesn´t count, good photographs do |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Katastrofo
Joined: 26 Feb 2007
Posts: 10405
Location: USA
Expire: 2013-11-19
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:29 am Post subject: |
|
|
Katastrofo wrote:
I like the example, Jes, thanks for sharing it. |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
mo
Joined: 27 Aug 2009
Posts: 8979
Location: Australia
Expire: 2016-07-30
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 8:22 am Post subject: |
|
|
mo wrote:
The results on his blog are amazing ...well worth the effort I think in using his pre-soak bath. We have this strong light as well.. 
_________________
Moira, Moderator 
Fuji XE-1,Pentax K-01,Panasonic G1,Panasonic G5,Pentax MX
Ricoh Singlex TLS,KR-5,KR-5Super,XR-10
Lenses
Auto Rikenon's 55/1.4, 1.8, 2.8... 50/1.7 Takumar 2/58 Preset Takumar 2.8/105 Auto Takumar 2.2/55, 3.5/35 Super Takumar 1.8/55...Macro Takumar F4/50... CZJ Biotar ALU M42 2/58 CZJ Tessar ALU M42 2.8/50
CZJ DDR Flektogon Zebra M42 2.8/35 CZJ Pancolar M42 2/50 CZJ Pancolar Exakta 2/50
Auto Mamiya/Sekor 1.8/55 ...Auto Mamiya/Sekor 2/50 Auto Mamiya/Sekor 2.8/50 Auto Mamiya/Sekor 200/3.5 Tamron SP500/8 Tamron SP350/5.6 Tamron SP90/2.5
Primoplan 1.9/58 Primagon 4.5/35 Telemegor 5.5/150 Angenieux 3.5/28 Angenieux 3,5/135 Y 2
Canon FL 58/1.2,Canon FL85/1.8,Canon FL 100/3.5,Canon SSC 2.8/100 ,Konica AR 100/2.8, Nikkor P 105/2.5
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 10:07 am Post subject: |
|
|
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
I've done a lot of work with Kodak Vision2 films in BW, but when I tried it in C41 I had poor results. I will check this info about the pre-bath out, if it works then I'll be delighted as I have a lot of this film and as you say, it has massive dynamic range with very little grain.
_________________
I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jesito
Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5745
Location: Olivella, Catalonia, (Spain)
Expire: 2015-01-07
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 1:49 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Jesito wrote:
This is the pre-bath used by Kowska to remove the anti-halo layer:
Borax.......................20gr
Sodium Sulphate.....100gr
Sodium Hydroxide.......1gr
Water to complete one litre.
According his notes, a two minutes bath at the same temperature that the other chemicals, and then the standard C-41 process.
I'm really interested in this processs.
I cannot try this by myself because space constraints at home. (I currently live in a really small flat in a very nice area next to the sea, but too small to have even a temporary setup).
But if someone tries it and succeeds, I would think on setting up a small lab somewhere.
Please, keep posting. This film looks really promising.
Jes.
_________________
Jesito, Moderator
Jesito's backsack:
Zooms Sigma 70-300, Tamron 35-135 and 70-210 short, 70-210 long, 28-70 CF Macro, 35-70, 35-80, Vivitar 70-210 KA, Tamron 70-250.
Fixed Industar-50, , Tamron 24mm, Tamron 135mm, Sands Hunter 135mm, Pancolar 50mm, Volna-3, many Exakta lenses
DSLR SIGMA SD9 & SD14, EOS 5D, Sony A700 and NEXF3, Oly E-330, E-400, E-450, E-1
TLR/6x6/645 YashicaMat, Petri 6x45, Nettar, Franka Solida, Brilliant
SLR Minolta X300, Fuji STX II, Praktica VLC3, Pentax P30t, EXA500, EXA 1A, Spotmatic(2), Chinon CM-4S, Ricoh, Contax, Konica TC-X , Minolta 5000, 7000i, 3Sxi, EOS 500 and CX
Rangefinders Chinon 35EE, Konica C35 auto, Canonet 28, Yashica Lynx, FED-2, Yashica electro 35, Argus C3 & C4, Regula Cita III, Voigtlander Vitoret (many), Welta Welti-I, Kodak Signette 35, Zorki-4, Bessa-R & L, Minolta Weathermatic, olympus XA2
Compact Film Konica C35V, Voigtlander Vitorets, Canon Prima Super 105, Olympus XA2 and XA3
Compact Digital Olympus C-5050, Aiptek Slim 3000, Canon Powershot A540, Nikon 5200, SIGMA DP1s, Polaroid X530, IXUS55, Kodak 6490, Powershot G9 and G10
CSCCanon EOS-M, Samsung NX100 and NX210, Lumix G5, NEX-F3 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Attila
Joined: 24 Feb 2007
Posts: 57865
Location: Hungary
Expire: 2025-11-18
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 1:53 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Attila wrote:
I saw his log finally typically all made in bright light and little lighter than normal, I see nothing extra what you can't do with C41 and no pain with graphite. How to remove remjet well is key figure, I failed.
_________________
-------------------------------
Items on sale on Ebay
Sony NEX-7 Carl Zeiss Planar 85mm f1.4, Minolta MD 35mm f1.8, Konica 135mm f2.5, Minolta MD 50mm f1.2, Minolta MD 250mm f5.6, Carl Zeiss Sonnar 180mm f2.8
|
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:01 pm Post subject: |
|
|
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Jes, I have lots of 250D, 500T and 100T so I can always send you some rolls to try out.
I will try to find those ingredients to make the pre-bath as I've always know that this ECN-2 film was capable of stunning results in C-41, Flickr has a load of examples of this. But I couldn't figure out how they got around the remjet problem, if you don't fully remove it before the developer step, some particles of it inevitably end up stuck in the soft emulsion causes unsightly spotting.
I put a roll of Vision2 film through my local minilab (disguised in a C41 canister  ) and the results were not so good, so I knew the key was successful removal of the remjet. In ECN-2 processing machines it is done with water jets.
_________________
I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
Jesito
Joined: 24 Aug 2007
Posts: 5745
Location: Olivella, Catalonia, (Spain)
Expire: 2015-01-07
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 2:22 pm Post subject: |
|
|
Jesito wrote:
| iangreenhalgh1 wrote: |
Jes, I have lots of 250D, 500T and 100T so I can always send you some rolls to try out.
I will try to find those ingredients to make the pre-bath as I've always know that this ECN-2 film was capable of stunning results in C-41, Flickr has a load of examples of this. But I couldn't figure out how they got around the remjet problem, if you don't fully remove it before the developer step, some particles of it inevitably end up stuck in the soft emulsion causes unsightly spotting.
I put a roll of Vision2 film through my local minilab (disguised in a C41 canister ) and the results were not so good, so I knew the key was successful removal of the remjet. In ECN-2 processing machines it is done with water jets. |
Ian,
Is the same process for all those films?. I'm afraid I was wrong and what Kowska tried is the Vision 3, not 2.
It's clear that the Vision 3 250D it's clearly ECN2 process, as it is on the Vision 2: http://www.foto-r3.com/files/5217_kodak.pdf
It seems Vision 3 is an improved film over Vision 2.
_________________
Jesito, Moderator
Jesito's backsack:
Zooms Sigma 70-300, Tamron 35-135 and 70-210 short, 70-210 long, 28-70 CF Macro, 35-70, 35-80, Vivitar 70-210 KA, Tamron 70-250.
Fixed Industar-50, , Tamron 24mm, Tamron 135mm, Sands Hunter 135mm, Pancolar 50mm, Volna-3, many Exakta lenses
DSLR SIGMA SD9 & SD14, EOS 5D, Sony A700 and NEXF3, Oly E-330, E-400, E-450, E-1
TLR/6x6/645 YashicaMat, Petri 6x45, Nettar, Franka Solida, Brilliant
SLR Minolta X300, Fuji STX II, Praktica VLC3, Pentax P30t, EXA500, EXA 1A, Spotmatic(2), Chinon CM-4S, Ricoh, Contax, Konica TC-X , Minolta 5000, 7000i, 3Sxi, EOS 500 and CX
Rangefinders Chinon 35EE, Konica C35 auto, Canonet 28, Yashica Lynx, FED-2, Yashica electro 35, Argus C3 & C4, Regula Cita III, Voigtlander Vitoret (many), Welta Welti-I, Kodak Signette 35, Zorki-4, Bessa-R & L, Minolta Weathermatic, olympus XA2
Compact Film Konica C35V, Voigtlander Vitorets, Canon Prima Super 105, Olympus XA2 and XA3
Compact Digital Olympus C-5050, Aiptek Slim 3000, Canon Powershot A540, Nikon 5200, SIGMA DP1s, Polaroid X530, IXUS55, Kodak 6490, Powershot G9 and G10
CSCCanon EOS-M, Samsung NX100 and NX210, Lumix G5, NEX-F3 |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011
Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
|
| Posted: Sat Dec 08, 2012 3:50 pm Post subject: |
|
|
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Hi Jes
Yes, the Vision films all use the ECN-2 process, whether it is Vision, Vison 2 or Vision 3. 3 is improved over 2, but 2 is still excellent, the movie film is one generation ahead of the still film in technology, so the Vision 2 is the same technology as the Portra and Ektra pro films. The Vision 3 is next generation and we haven't seen that technology in the stills market yet, maybe we never will now Kodak have hit the hard times.
_________________
I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
David
Joined: 13 Apr 2011
Posts: 1869
Location: Denver, Colorado
Expire: 2013-01-25
|
| Posted: Mon Dec 10, 2012 1:03 am Post subject: |
|
|
David wrote:
I thought some of the Vision films used ECP-2, not ECN-2.
_________________
http://www.youtube.com/user/hancockDavidM |
|
| Back to top |
|
|
|
|
Search
Memberlist
Register
Profile
Log in to check your private messages
Log in
