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Zenit 3m Industar-50 5cm f3.5 Red P silver finish
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PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 7:08 pm    Post subject: Zenit 3m Industar-50 5cm f3.5 Red P silver finish Reply with quote
Marc did start to me to collect 'Red Army members' those Russian lenses what are close to ww2. You can recognize them from cm focal length scale and red P mark. It was a damn fine idea , these lenses usually provide very high quality output for fragmentation of price like others. Today I found this Industar in SLR version , I have one already in RF version.

Camera is surprisingly working I found until this one only non working copies.



Last edited by Attila on Mon Jun 06, 2011 12:21 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 8:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Well done Attila!!

Congratulations!

Please, share the images with us.

I love the industar 50.

Rino.


PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 8:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I will do thank you! cute little gem in my opinion too.


PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is the little pancake in M42?


PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hexanon wrote:
This is the little pancake in M42?


Yes, mostly available in black. What I did find today first version, alu finish lens.


PostPosted: Fri May 27, 2011 9:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I never seen one in aluminium. Nice find!


PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 2:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I look forward to seeing the lens itself and images from it...what camera first the panny G1 or the Nex?? Very Happy


PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
i am glad to know about the red "P" business. thanks.


PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mo wrote:
I look forward to seeing the lens itself and images from it...what camera first the panny G1 or the Nex?? Very Happy


Panny is done already, just not published yet with RF version. I think SLR lens will meet with NEX.


PostPosted: Sat May 28, 2011 1:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
fish4570 wrote:
i am glad to know about the red "P" business. thanks.


Now you have a beautiful Leica body, start to hunt Red "P" lenses instead of Leica glasses.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 8:26 am    Post subject: Re: Zenit 3m Industar-50 5cm f3.5 Red P silver finish Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
Marc did start to me to collect 'Red Army members' those Russian lenses what are close to ww2. You can recognize them from cm focal length scale and red P mark. It was a damn fine idea , these lenses usually provide very high quality output for fragmentation of price like others. Today I found this Industar in SLR version , I have one already in RF version.

Camera is surprisingly working I found until this one only non working copies.


Guys, do not want to disappoint you, I wrote about this earlier, a red "P" (П) means that the lens is coated.("П" = Просветленная). Then all the Soviet lenses were coated and the need for labeling disappeared. Red "P" (П) does not imply any particular characteristics and does not mean any higher quality.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 9:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
You don't know the truth fotkino, red P mark not only coating mark, it is mark lens is older and better than others.If a lens made closer to war chance is higher to buy a better quality lens. Many of them exceptional. Right after the war Red Army did kidnapped resources from Germany, people , machinery, glass etc. My practical experience prove it , they are significantly better than latest ones.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
You don't know the truth fotkino


here http://www.zenitcamera.com/qa/qa-indexes.html and in all Russian sources you can find:

"П - Просветление: Надпись на передней оправе старых отечественных объективов, обычно красного цвета, указывает на наличие просветления оптики (ср. с MC). Эта маркировка просуществовала относительно недолго и исчезла в связи с ненадобностью -- непросветленной фотографической оптики попросту более не выпускалось.
Буква -- кириллическая."

or

"П" (Pi) - Coated: Inscription on the front rim of the old home of lenses, usually red, indicates the presence of coated optics (cf. MC). This marking lasted a relatively short time and disappeared in connection with useless - uncoated photographic optics is simply no longer available.
The letter - the Cyrillic.

IMHO high quality, or the magical properties of these lenses are attributed incorrectly or to increase prices in the market, because not many people except the Russian speak Russian and can read the original.

You think they're better just because the build quality of the old Soviet lens itself is better, newer copies have a strong difference in the quality of the lens to the lens.

So I still stay with my opinion and do not insist that you change your Smile

More views - a better world:)


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 9:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Try them ...


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 9:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
You don't know the truth fotkino


PS: You're right at the expense of German heritage, the post-war lenses actually partially made ​​from German glass which undoubtedly increased the quality - but this is not all lenses of that time, and the letter "P" can be considered an indirect sign of the quality of the lens.
No exact data on what lenses collected from German glass and what does not.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 9:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
fotkino wrote:
Attila wrote:
You don't know the truth fotkino


PS: You're right at the expense of German heritage, the post-war lenses actually partially made ​​from German glass which undoubtedly increased the quality - but this is not all lenses of that time, and the letter "P" can be considered an indirect sign of the quality of the lens.
No exact data on what lenses collected from German glass and what does not.


Yes, no exact data made of year can increase chance to get those lenses what are made from German glass. Red P , cm focal length and serial number can help to find them.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 10:48 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:

Yes, no exact data made of year can increase chance to get those lenses what are made from German glass. Red P , cm focal length and serial number can help to find them.


I see you're a big fan of quests:)

According to rumors in 1947 from the German parts had been collected 500 copies of lenses "ZK" ("ЗК") 2/50 mm (Sonnar-Krasnogorsk) = Jupiter-8

Information from an official source http://www.zenitcamera.com/archive/lenses/jupiter-8.html says that this lens actually manufactured from materials and equipment brought from Germany, but in what quantity - are not mentioned.

possible German glass was a little

but it is important not only from some glasses - but whose hands built the lens

Good luck finding a really good thing!


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 12:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
German glass or not, the build quality is better. And because they do not command any higher prices on the market compared non-marked ones, I'd say they're a fantastic buy.

One thing that doesn't get a lot of attention is internal matting. The older "P" lenses are great in that respect. A great deal of later Soviet designs have shiny internal walls. I once had a mir 1B that looked as if it was done with a high-gloss paint inside. For a lens that is already susceptible to flare, this is a big no-no. But the chrome ones are always matte. There was certainly an attention to detail with these early designs.

Attila, best of luck with the industar! I recommend thoroughly checking it for haze. It usually is on the element right above the aperture blades. Very easy to clean and improves the lens significantly.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 1:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I must admit, my `P' marked lenses are no better optically than non-P lenses. This is probably another internet myth. The 000xxx being another.


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 1:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
I must admit, my `P' marked lenses are no better optically than non-P lenses. This is probably another internet myth.


What's your experience in owning both versions?


PostPosted: Sun May 29, 2011 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
fotkino wrote:
Good luck finding a really good thing!


I already found many.

Marc, thank you for advise about haze.

This talk a bit remind me about Fuji color film. At the beginning when I was a bit clue less I said Fuji Color film is crap , due I did judge on my few experiences and Excalibur , Katastrofo did show me some captures Laughing
Now I know even cheapest Fuji color film can be really excellent , process, lens and scan make lot of difference.

Just same case with Russian lenses if you get a looks average copy you may think all are same , which is wrong for sure. This can be happen with Red P lenses also of course. I bought at least one copy from all what I find and I bought many non red P too.
Based on this experience I found Red P lenses has significantly better quality than others.

My latest purchase was a Leica Elmar 5cm f3,5 I found my Industar-22 copies are better ,FED-50 too. Elmar is non coated or maximum single coated. Russian has better coating and they are sharper too for fraction of costs.


PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 7:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:

Just same case with Russian lenses if you get a looks average copy you may think all are same


Oh, those Russian...! Smile

I'm not sure what is doing everywhere, but when you buy something Russian production - to ask the seller to show several at once, the lens is always different, and even the new one can choose one out of four.
It is normal practice and the seller are treated with understanding.

And there's a joke: do not buy anything that Russian made ​​on Monday or Friday Smile
(I think that the international joke, and not only about Russia Smile)


PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 1:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Laughing Laughing Laughing Yes , I know at the first time I didn't buy Russian lenses for own purpose just for try and re-sell I didn't kept any. Due I did grow up in Hungary I had not so positive opinion about them and it's changed when I did both first Leica body and lens. Body was nicer finished , but was same non -working item just Russians. I had to ask my self why I pay 10X more price for a little better finish? And I bought 10 pcs from price difference, bodies are same all require maintenance or make a compromise faster speed is rare faster than 1/125. Lenses were great surprise all silver RF lens was top quality lens. Now I am great fun of them.


PostPosted: Mon May 30, 2011 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This is a seriously terrible picture but it's one of the very few I've taken with my Industar П 5cm on the A850. Completely untouched from Camera Raw defaults. This was at f3.5 (wide-open) and 1/125th. 200 ISO, which yes, should have been bumped up.




Enjoy Attila

~Marc
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