shinano pigeon 5b

[uddhava]

Has anyone ever seen one of these?
It is from a local seller.

[philslizzy]

I've never seen this one but it looks like a later version of the 'V', coupled rangefinder 35mm camera. The shape and position of the rangefinder (and the model number) would suggest to me that it is probably 1958-1960. Quite late for a 35mm folder.

Older Pigeons I have seen seem to be of good quality, like German cameras of the era. Solid, well made and usually working.

Uncommon, it isn't featured in Mckeowns (or at least my 12th edition). It values the V it at 4-5 times the older versions, probably indicative of its rarity and collectability.

[uddhava]

[philslizzy]

[uddhava]

That's a nice looking camera!
I didn't know that such nice cameras were made in that style (with the lens that
pulls out) and I was thinking more of a folding camera. Also maybe without the rangefinder
coupled, but just built into the camera like yours. Are you able to get accurate focus that
with that type?

[philslizzy]

It's called a 'tube camera' The tube was designed for two reasons, one to give a more modern appearance and two to avoid any problems that bellows have - leaks, splitting etc.

All tube cameras have a mechanism that holds the lens at exactly the right position, either by a 'pull out and turn' method or in this case, spring loaded. And the MIOM Photax unscrewed to the end of its thread.

I know of no tube cameras with rangefinder coupling due to the construction. This one uses a knob on the right as you look at it, you turn the knob and focus the rangefinder, read off the distance and set the focus on the lens. the one in the photo is focused at 5 metres. All the models that I have have front cell focus.



This is older but nicer than its later brethren the Braun Paxina 29 and 35 models.

I love tube cameras and have several of them. A common problem with this type of camera is the shutter actuator. If it is built-in such as this model, there has to be a pretty complicated mechanism which often goes wrong - as it did in this case. The double exposure lock was needlessly complicated as was the shutter release - six mechanical pieces and two springs just to keep the rangefinder symmetrical. German over engineering. I have modified the inside now to make it simpler. The double exposure mechanism was stripped out - eight pieces including two springs - but a piece had sheared off it. I am making a new shutter release.

Cheaper ones use the actual shutter release on the shutter its self.

You can get a pretty good one for less than £20 with postage on ebay. My favourites are the Brauns but I have Goldammer, Agfa and Vredeborch models too.

But your camera is special, there's not much about it on the net and believe me I've tried and McKeowns don't even mention it. It is an extremely rare beast, get it working and use it!!

[uddhava]

[luisalegria]

The Shinano you have there is quite uncommon I think.
Interesting coupled rangefinder to a front cell focus lens, and also there are few 35mm folders like this from Japan.
Looks like they wanted a direct competitor for the Kodak Retinas and similar, but the market was moving away from that style by the time this came out.

There are only a few cameras like that - coupled rangefinder with front cell focus - because the mechanism is inconvenient.
The most common of that sort is the infamous Kodak 35 with rangefinder, where the coupling mechanism is absurdly clumsy.
There is also a fairly common Iloca model that is better designed.

[philslizzy]

The Akarette is nice, I have two of them - but they are Akarelles, The Akarette has a knob wind and the Akarelle, a lever wind. This is the 1953 (+/-2 years) version with the viewfinder selector. The 1957 version (only Akarelle) has a bright line VF. My '57 model is not working and I think never will but the 1953 version like this one works perfectly. Both models go relatively cheaply £20 to £25 and are always advertise on ebay. Go for that if you haven't bought it.





a couple of pix taken on the Akarelle Mk1 (1953) AGFA Vista 200. supermarket scan

[luisalegria]

That Shinano 5B seems to be rare, rare, rare
Camerapedia says

"No surviving example of the Pigeon 35 5B is known yet"

[philslizzy]

[philslizzy]

[luisalegria]

This Shinano seems to have a coupled rangefinder on its front cell focus lens.
And neatly done too. Not a monster like the Kodak 35.

Who knows if it works though.

I can say the Kodak 35 rangefinder does work, though all of them will need adjustment, they are really easy to work on.

[uddhava]

[luisalegria]

Rangefinding with such a camera is best done with the eyes and judgement.
You can get an add-on rangefinder but I have never had much advantage from them.

We actually had distance measurement as a exercise in school back in my day.
i.e., we learned to guess distances up to 1/2 kilometer. I don't know if that's done anymore.

Guessing distance -

1m - length of a meter stick. Carry around a meter stick in your house and poke it at objects and get a feel for how things look 1 meter away.
2m - length of a tall man - Assume an invisible basketball player and imagine he is lying flat in front of you, in the direction you are measuring.
3m - length of a horse,
4m - length of a car,
etc.

This is useful only if you are using fairly small apertures, for more DOF. No method with anything but a coupled rangefinder will work well if you are trying to do large apertures at close range.