Minolta 800mm f/8 mirror lens?

[motleypixel]

Hey gang,

I have the opportunity to by this Minolta MD lens for $300 with two extenders and a 45mm Minolta pancake lens. Few questions:

1. Is that a good deal/fair price?
2. It's an MD mount and I know I'd like to buy it to photograph the moon. I've converted one MD 50/1.5 Rokkor-X to fit Canon EOS and achieved infinity focus on crop sensor i.e. Canon 40/50D, do you think I could adapt it to EOS as I did with the 50/1.4 MD?
3. Any other input on this lens would be much appreciated.

I think this is the lens with better details on flickr: http://www.flickr.com/photos/kenwales/4277800414/in/photostream/

Here are a few low res shots:







Thanks,
Roy

[Himself]

300$ doesn't look bad at all.
I'll grab it if I were you.
The mirror looks good?

[motleypixel]

I haven't even seen the lens in person yet...we are meeting Friday. So any pointers on the inspection...I'm okay with normal lenses and looking for snappy oil-free apertures, fungus, etc.

I did talk to the owner and he's the original owner and he picked it up back in 78' for some reason which he forgot why and has been in storage ever since. He was a minolta film shooter.

I'm thinking this may make a nice moon lens right?

Thanks,
Roy

[walter g]

I've never seen one for sale, but I haven't really been looking. I can tell you if it was the standard Rokkor X version it would be in the $600 plus range.

[motleypixel]

This is what it says on the side of the lens: http://www.flickr.com/photos/kenwales/4277800414/in/photostream/

Seem searching for the Rokkor X versions via google I keep coming up wiht a black lens body and not the off-white like this one.

-Roy

[walter g]

The black Rokkor X version is the one I've seen before. There are a couple on Ebay.

By the way the RF version your looking at weighs 1900 grams. So it's a good thing it has a handle.

[cooltouch]

Something tells me that this lens is worth a lot more than $300. There's a black one (no handle) on eBay right now with a BIN of $1699:

Click here to see on Ebay

And another with a BIN of $950:

Click here to see on Ebay

Note that the above lens was built for the Leica R mount -- which was fairly common for that lens, apparently.

Also note the "O" in the Minolta logo. From what I've read, Minolta switched to this later style logo in 1981, so this lens is at least that young.

This lens will not have apertures -- snappy or oil free or otherwise. It's a mirror with a fixed f/8 aperture. The main things to look for with an old lens like this are 1) fungus and 2) delamination or discoloration of the silver from the surface of the mirror's glass.

Since you've already converted an MD 50mm to EOS, I think you'll find this to be easier since there will most likely not be any sort of aperture coupling lever at the back of the lens to deal with, nor any internal lever mechanisms either.

Found this thread where the black version is discussed -- most of the images have been taken down, but a couple are still up:

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1035&message=27367575&changemode=1

I found this comment "A brand-new design for the 800mm mirror lens. This version had a white body, with a rigid carrying handle. It still used front mirror focusing, but now there was a thin focusing ring with a knob at the front, rather than a track. Like the previous ones, it was sold in R mount for Leica SLRs, but this one was not re-branded as Leitz, it was a Minolta lens." here:

http://thesybersite.com/minolta/historical/Minolta_Lens_Chronology.htm

Bottom line, if I were in your shoes, I'd do whatever it takes to get a hold of that lens. I suspect the white variant is a good deal rarer than the black version, and is probably worth quite a bit to Minolta collectors. Bearing this in mind, if you do convert it to EOS, then it would behoove you to make sure that the conversion can be reversed so that its collectible value can be preserved.

[fatdeeman]

As long as it's in good condition I say buy it without hesitation, it's a rare lens and worth much more than $300, especially with mirror lenses being so popular at the moment!

[exaklaus]

I'd get it for that price, if I were you!

Klaus

[Rolf]

Not sure that this is a specialized lens for moon shots.

I believe there are better ones on the market. I like to shot with mirrors too, bad mainly with distances below of 50-60 meters. For this type of shooting it is not necessary to go with 800mm (no handheld, only with monopod or better tripod, long exposere times, high iso, mirror lockup etc)

On the other side the price is no too much and if it doens´t work for your type of photography you can sell it without loss.

[Fretless Pete]

That looks like a real bargain - well done on the price. You could easily triple + your money if you hated it

I've no experience with mirrors, but there's no reason it shouldnt take a decent Moon photo. It has enough reach to get a large pic / detail, and f8 is fine as a moon shot aperture. You'll need a tripod and mirror lock up, and with a fixed ap f8 you'll need some where around 1/160th or 1/200th @ ISO 100 ( you need to experiment )

Just to show you .. (you'll get a closer shot with 800mm obviously)
Here's one I shot at virtually identical settings - 600mm SW scope on EOS 40D, f7.5 ( fixed Ap ), ISO 100 , 1/200th , Tripod, MLU, 2 second timer

Click Photo again when open, and you'll the large size

http://photo-sharing.winsoftmagic.com/1/9d86nlimbo.jpg


Some more info - check the list ! Rokkor 1600mm f11 Mirror lens

http://www.paulfvs.dds.nl/lenses.html

[motleypixel]

Well folks, I got it...super nice guy! The lens is in immaculate condition...looking at the mirror end shows a very shinny new-like surface. The case is in superb condition. The lens rear cap is included along with with the front cap and the only thing that shows considerable wear is the front lens cap...it's made of a "pleather" type material that's starting to deteriorate. I want to try to find the best way to restore the front cap.

The lens also came with a UV filter insert/drop-in and he thought the filter size for that is 37mm. Not sure if I should even use that drop-in filter or not. I mounted it to a cheap SRT-101 (not sure if that's the actual body model) and it seemed to focus nicely.

The case came with the original untouched warranty card as well. Wow, I'm so stoked about this. looks like the EOS conversion should go easy w/o any permanent damage to the original mount or lens so I will be sure to make the conversion reversible. I suppose the only thing that I will have to pay attention to is the registry distance and try to make the rear element .5mm closer to the sensor (Minolta registry is 43.5mm right whereas Canon is 44mm).

So the deal got even better...he threw in a 1.5 and 2X Minolta TC's and a 45/2 Pancake Minolta MD Rokkor-X and 3 Sunpak flashes (two 433 D's and one 333). All for $300 USD.

I'll be sure to post the final conversion and test shots here.

Thanks for the great advice folks!

-Roy

[Attila]

Congrats Roy! I look forward your test results!

[Rolf]

Yes asap please

[cooltouch]

Congrats, Roy! I can't wait to see images from that lens.

Do you have a stout tripod? If not, put that on your to-buy list. You'll need one with that bazooka.

If you have a way to scan prints or slides or negs, I, for one, would love to see images taken with good 'ol film. It should give you a reasonably good idea what to expect from the lens. But considering that Minolta built an 800mm mirror in Leica mount for several years, the quality must be high.

[motleypixel]

Thanks guys. Well, having just a few minutes to examine the lens at work after buying it, I think I may have some hurdles to overcome that are more complex than aperture mechanics found integrated with many of the Minolta lens mounts. Even though the mount is simple w/o any aperture mechanics, it does have an fixed element w/in the bayonet mount which means (I think) that if I remove the four screws holding the mount on the lens and simply replace it with a turned/machined M42=>EOS mount then it probably wouldn't work. So the conversion to EOS is looking bleek. About the only way to make this work is to possibly machine an EOS mount to go over the existing mount but that would move the registry out which would not enable infinity focus (I think).

Hummm...thoughts, thoughts, thoughts...

I suppose I could buy a Sony Alpha DSLR like this guy did with his: http://www.flickr.com/photos/kenwales/4277800414/

Or use a film body.

Or machine the existing mount surface area to makeup the stacked distance of the added EOS mount...ugly...LOL.

-Roy

[Attila]

Try with film and sell after ... I don't think so this usable lens for you time to time. If you are lucky a collector will pay to you good sum and you can buy more usable lenses.

[aoleg]

Most mirror lenses focus beyond infinity to facilitate correct focusing under a variety of temperature conditions. This can mean the lens *will* focus at least to infinity when fitted with an EOS adapter. Maybe not of course.

[motleypixel]

Humm interesting...not ruling out the conversion yet...too pre-occupied right now to seriously start planning.

**********UPDATE!

After inspecting the mount and the glass in the mount, I think it's just a clear piece of glass doing nothing more than protecting the inside back of the lens. I will remove the mount this weekend and determine if that glass is doing anything optically...any suggestions to test glass if it has any optical properties?

LOL, have a look at this one:
Click here to see on Ebay

One big differ in the 1600/11 and my 800/8 is that it looks like the 1600/11 doesn't have an element in the mount...ugg, wish that was the case with the 800/8.

-Roy

[cooltouch]

[motleypixel]

good idea on the micrometer...if it's spherical then it would have optical properties.

Kind of hard to test with and w/o the glass because if I'm going to test EOS it will be w/o the glass...only way to test with the glass is to use the native mount.

-Roy

[Fretless Pete]

Do you have any friends with a Sony / Konica / Minolta body you could borrow for a day or so ?

What about your local friendly camera shop ? I think the novelty of seeing you walk in with the 800mm will be enough for them to help you out with your problem

[AhamB]

Maybe the lens also has an infinity focus adjustment somewhere. If you're not reaching inifinity after the conversion you might be able to simply adjust some screws (often hidden under the front ring or under the rubber focus grip of normal (non-mirror) lenses.)

[ManualFocus-G]

[Fretless Pete]

Ok, thanks for that. I thought when Sony took over everything that all Minolta lens from whatever period would fit