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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:01 pm Post subject: Comparing some 135mm lenses, one being a Jupiter |
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woodrim wrote:
As I mentioned in another post, I got curious after seeing resulution data on the Jupiter 135mm lenses. The one I have,a Jupiter 11 in M42 mount (not 11-A), rated the lowest resolution, so I wondered how it might compare with a couple others of my favorites. I've done two series of shots and I'll start by posting one of them here. I'll identify the lenses as only A,B, and C as I would like to receive comments based on only what you see. I sense that much of the time people are influenced by their current bias when lenses are identified and their judgments are predetermined. Then again, some people don't like to play these games for fear of betraying their beliefs. We'll see.
I have an opinion after taking these pictures, but will hold until later. Since my Jupiter is f/4, I have taken all pictures at f/4 to even the field. I don't believe in making comparisons at fully open apertures when they are different. I used a tripod and took three pictures with each lens, refocusing each time, then selected the best from each lens. There was some breeze, so the framing will appear a little different. No sharpening, color adjustments, or CA corrections.
Lens A
Lens B
Lens C
Lens A 100% Crop
Lens B 100% Crop
Lens C 100% Crop
_________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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JohnBee
Joined: 11 Mar 2010 Posts: 179
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:04 pm Post subject: |
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JohnBee wrote:
I'm guessing A. is the Jup. 11
However, as I've never owned that particular version of Jupiter 11 before, and so, I'm going purely by color characteristics.
Also, you never mentioned what the other lenses were, which sort of makes the point of the game futile imo.
Last edited by JohnBee on Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:20 pm; edited 2 times in total |
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Hari
Joined: 29 Nov 2009 Posts: 1790
Expire: 2015-05-27
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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Hari wrote:
i dont know which is which but im loving lens 2's performance! _________________
Analogue Rangefinders: Leica M5, Leica M6 Titanium classic 0.72, Leica M7 0.58, Leica M7 0.85
Digital Rangefinder: Leica M9, Leica Monochrom, Leica M240
SLR: Leica R3 electronic, Canon AE1P
DSLR: Canon 5D MK2
M mount Lenses: Super-Wide Heliar 15/f4.5 ASPH. + Leica 24/f3.8 ASPH + Leica 28/f2 ASPH. + Leica 35/f1.4 ASPH. FLE + Leica Noctilux 50/f0.95 + Leica Noctilux 50/f1 + Canon 50/f1.2 LTM + Leica 50/f1.4 ASPH. + Leica 50/f1.5 + Zeiss ZM Sonnar 50/f1.5 + Leica APO Summicron 50/f2 + Leica Summitar 50/f2 + Leica Rigid Summicron 50/f2 + Zeiss ZM Planar 50/f2 + Leica 50/f2.8 E39 + Leica 75/f1.4 + Leica APO 75/f2 ASPH. + Voigtlander 75/f2.5 + Leica Summarex 85/f1.5 + Leica APO 90/f2 ASPH. + Leica 90/f2 E55 + Leica 90/f2.8 + Leica APO 135/f3.4
Leica R mount Lenses: Leica-R 60/2.8 E55 + Leica-R 80/1.4 E67 + Leica-R 180/4
EF mount Lenses: Canon 50/1.8 II
M42 mount Lenses: Too many
My pictures: http://www.flickr.com/photos/dementedjesus/ |
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ylyad
Joined: 01 Jun 2010 Posts: 476 Location: Zentralschweiz
Expire: 2013-12-05
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:21 pm Post subject: |
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ylyad wrote:
I've no clue on which is each, but B is my favourite. A is in the middle (good too, but less than B), C behind (I don't like it, at all: I mean, I'm even wondering if it's in focus). _________________
Camera: Fuji X-E2, Fuji X100T
MF: Canon nFD 50/1.4, Canon nFD 100/2.8, Tokina RMC 135/2.8
Tamron SP 24-48/3.5-3.8
http://www.flickr.com/derdide/
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:29 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
I too wonder about the focus on lens c. I believe it can perform better, and it was a windy day, so is possible I didn't nail it in the three tries, but something should be in focus. How about the bokeh? _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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Excalibur
Joined: 19 Jul 2009 Posts: 5017 Location: UK
Expire: 2014-04-21
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:33 pm Post subject: |
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Excalibur wrote:
From those shots..."B" looks the best on my monitor. _________________ Canon A1, AV1, T70 & T90, EOS 300 and EOS300v, Chinon CE and CP-7M. Contax 139, Fuji STX-2, Konica Autoreflex TC, FS-1, FT-1, Minolta X-700, X-300, XD-11, SRT101b, Nikon EM, FM, F4, F90X, Olympus OM2, Pentax S3, Spotmatic, Pentax ME super, Praktica TL 5B, & BC1, , Ricoh KR10super, Yashica T5D, Bronica Etrs, Mamiya RB67 pro AND drum roll:- a Sony Nex 3
.........past gear Tele Rolleiflex and Rollei SL66.
Many lenses from good to excellent. |
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Olivier
Joined: 18 Feb 2009 Posts: 5078 Location: France
Expire: 2015-08-06
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 3:59 pm Post subject: |
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Olivier wrote:
Without any clue I would say as John, that A is from the J11.
What are the 2 other lenses ? _________________ Olivier - Moderator
Dslr : Olympus Pen E-P2 - Fujifilm X-Pro2 - Canon 5D MkII.
SLr and MF lenses : for feedback and helping people, cameras and lenses I own : full list here http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic,p,1442740.html#1442740 |
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Schnauzer
Joined: 09 Apr 2008 Posts: 2155 Location: Maine, USA
Expire: 2012-03-08
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:03 pm Post subject: |
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Schnauzer wrote:
I have no idea what the lenses are but "A" looks nice until I look at "B". "B" really is a cut above to me. "C" isn't in the same league.
There isn't a great difference in bokeh, but again I prefer "B". _________________ Ron |
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Schnauzer
Joined: 09 Apr 2008 Posts: 2155 Location: Maine, USA
Expire: 2012-03-08
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:07 pm Post subject: |
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Schnauzer wrote:
Orio is the best I've ever seen at guessing lenses. I wonder if he could figure this out? _________________ Ron |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 4:58 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
I don't know if this might help give some clues but I shot this earlier today with my M42 J11A.
EOS 10D, 100/sec, think it was f/8, might have been f/5.6. |
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ryan s
Joined: 26 Sep 2008 Posts: 384 Location: Madison, WI
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:10 pm Post subject: |
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ryan s wrote:
I like A the best...guess I'm the only one
Don't know...it just does it for me. Looking at the crops, especially, there's no green "halo" around the white flower in the out of focus area. It also seems a little "warmer" with color rendering.
C is an average 135/2.8 or 3.5 I'd guess (Sears, JCP, et al). Watch, it ends up being the one with the best reputation _________________ Pentax Bodies: K10D + D-BG2 | MX |
M: Zenitar 16/2.8 | 28/2.8 | 50/1.7 | M39: Mir-1 GP 37/2.8 M42: Vivitar 28/2.5 AD2: Tamron SP Macro 90/2.5 |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 5:59 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
I see the green halo in all of them, just slightly different color tones. _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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Rodinal
Joined: 09 Jan 2011 Posts: 17 Location: Stockholm, Sweden
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 7:16 pm Post subject: |
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Rodinal wrote:
I also like A slightly better than B. The bokeh is somewhat more pleasing and the contrast seems higher on my monitor.
C has really rotten contrast and leaves me wondering if it is perhaps wide open? Then, I guess, C is the Jupiter by default...
Bjorn |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 7:23 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
woodrim wrote: |
I see the green halo in all of them, just slightly different color tones. |
I agree, it seems brighter/more pronounced in B however.
B is the sharpest, A not far behind, C isn't very sharp.
B's colours are slightly less warm so I like A's colours best, C I don't like the colours of so much.
I'm thinking C is the Jupiter 11 and the lack of contrast is because it's the the 11 rather than the 11A so is older with less good coatings, the lack of sharpness and contrast make me think like rodinal - that it's wide open.
Really good test though, you did a very good job with the images which allows us to make these judgments on such details, thanks for doing this.
I'm going to have to try to do something similar with my two 135 lenses and my 80-200 at the 135mm setting. |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 7:43 pm Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
I'm a little bit surprised by the result as I thought C would have shown better. I'll give others a chance to chime in before I reveal the identities. I will also add some shots from each of the lenses so you can see them as I have put them to use. The later shots will not have been taken with comparisons in mind and they will have been post processed, which equalizes some lenses. I like my general usage results from C much more than this test would suggest. _________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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iangreenhalgh1
Joined: 18 Mar 2011 Posts: 15679
Expire: 2014-01-07
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Posted: Mon Mar 28, 2011 9:12 pm Post subject: |
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
woodrim wrote: |
I'm a little bit surprised by the result as I thought C would have shown better. I'll give others a chance to chime in before I reveal the identities. I will also add some shots from each of the lenses so you can see them as I have put them to use. The later shots will not have been taken with comparisons in mind and they will have been post processed, which equalizes some lenses. I like my general usage results from C much more than this test would suggest. |
Technical precision is overrated imho, some lenses that aren't technically superb take very nice pics. After all, why are so many of us obsessed with various varieties of decades-old long obsolete glass? Sharpness and contrast aren't the be-all and end-all and sometimes the overall effect a lens gives can overcome any shortcomings it may have.
Look forward to seeing the pics as you're clearly a very skilled photographer and I'm following your threads as I feel you have a lot you could teach!
P.S. Sorry if that sounded ass-kissy at all! lol _________________ I don't care who designed it, who made it or what country it comes from - I just enjoy using it! |
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woodrim
Joined: 14 Jan 2010 Posts: 4060 Location: Charleston
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 1:26 am Post subject: |
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woodrim wrote:
This little exercise may show us how little difference there is between lenses. It didn't seem anyone could say with great confidence which lens was the Jupiter, despite the lens' qualities being fairly well known. And just one picture at one distance displaying one setting makes it even harder. Still, some people were right. But I'm going to post three pictures from each of the lenses taken during walk-abouts. These pictures have gone through my standard post processing routine, which brings the lenses a little closer together. First, here are my impressions from the test...
Lens A is the Jupiter 11. Although I don't consider it a big deal to perform well at fully open when f/4 is max aperture, I am impressed with the sharpness the lens has. I think the colors are accurate and the lens is surprisingly absent of CA in all but the most challenging of situations.
Lens B is the Vivitar Series 1 f.2.3. I am not surprised to see this lens win the sharpness competition. This is my very favorite 135mm of the dozen or so that I have. I like using it and I like the quality of the results. Although it does have CA issues like other Series 1 lenses, that is usually easily corrected in post processing. This is also the most expensive of my 135mm lenses with M42 copies commanding maybe in the $200 range.
Lens C is the Komura f/2.8. I am surprised that this lens did not show as well, and I have to wonder if I blew the focusing. It does have a more yellowish coloring, less contrast, but controls CA very well and has wonderful bokeh. This lens I suspect will show better in my three images to follow.
All three of these lenses will likely please the most discriminating of us photographers except for when we do side by side comparisons and closely examine pixels and pick at other details. I still prefer the Vivitar and the Komura over the Jupiter based on my earlier experiences, if not just because they are faster and will both provide better bokeh due to the wider apertures. Okay, here are the three real life examples from each lens:
Jupiter
Series 1
Komura
_________________ Regards,
Woodrim |
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NothingMan
Joined: 02 Mar 2011 Posts: 98 Location: Bosnia Herzegovina
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 2:48 pm Post subject: |
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NothingMan wrote:
Ooh, some truly lovely shots there! Love the squirrel one!
I finally won a jupiter 37A, I hope I will like as everyone else does _________________
Canon Gear: 5DII | 40D | 50 1.8 | 85 1.8 | 17-40 L |
MF Lenses: S-M-C Tak 50 1.4 | S-M-C Tak 135 3.5 | S-M-C Tak 28 3.5 | Helios 44-3/44-2/44m-4/44-4 | Yashica ML 50 1.4 | CZJ Pancolar 50/1.8 | Jupiter 37A | Zuiko 55 1.2 | Zuiko 24 2.8 |
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ryan s
Joined: 26 Sep 2008 Posts: 384 Location: Madison, WI
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Posted: Tue Mar 29, 2011 4:43 pm Post subject: |
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ryan s wrote:
I got part of it right
Komura made some decent lenses (my longest is currently a 90-250mm while my Pentax AF 80-320mm is getting repaired), so that result is kind of surprising. It definitely resembles my Sears 135mm at f/4
The Vivitar 135/2.3 is huge, though, so I know which I would take if I didn't hate the 135mm focal length...preferably in silver _________________ Pentax Bodies: K10D + D-BG2 | MX |
M: Zenitar 16/2.8 | 28/2.8 | 50/1.7 | M39: Mir-1 GP 37/2.8 M42: Vivitar 28/2.5 AD2: Tamron SP Macro 90/2.5 |
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