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Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 12:33 am
Post subject: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 12:33 am
Post subject: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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Some don't like the ninja star bokeh, others do. I purposely bought this lens with this feature in mind. What are your opinions?

f/2.8, shot with Speedlite on Canon 450D and a little pp afterward


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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:40 am
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 8:40 am
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Well personally me... I do not like any rough shapes in the bokeh. It has to be smooth and pleasing especially in portrait lenses.


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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 9:46 am
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 9:46 am
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Well, it is a matter of taste.
You obviously like the way these out of focus highlights have been rendered, and for this occasion with this model you have applied the result that this lens produces.
I can't imagine that all your portraits will have out of focus highlights in the background - on other occasions there may be no highlights and then the background bokeh will most likely be different.
You like it - that's all that matters.
OH


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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 10:39 am
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 10:39 am
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Edited

Last edited by bernhardas on Wed Jun 15, 2016 8:01 am; edited 1 time in total


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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 7:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 7:03 pm
Post subject: Re: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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frenched wrote:
Some don't like the ninja star bokeh, others do. I purposely bought this lens with this feature in mind. What are your opinions?


If you need a rationale, you're just going for a cinematic look. Pick your favorite movie-- pick any movie-- and you'll find many shots with bokeh just like yours. Some Director of Photography even gets a shiny gold statue with a funny name handed to him once every year and that guy's shots are filled with stop signs made of light (the ninja stars may exaggerate that shape a bit, but not much). Do you think any Cinematographer has ever lost sleep over bokeh shapes? That's for internet forums to get worked up over. Just my opinion...

Very nice shot, BTW...


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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 7:09 pm
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 7:09 pm
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Laughing this is my favorite most used lens from all what I have Wink


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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 9:08 pm
Post subject: Re: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 9:08 pm
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CBokeh wrote:
frenched wrote:
Some don't like the ninja star bokeh, others do. I purposely bought this lens with this feature in mind. What are your opinions?


If you need a rationale, you're just going for a cinematic look. Pick your favorite movie-- pick any movie-- and you'll find many shots with bokeh just like yours. Some Director of Photography even gets a shiny gold statue with a funny name handed to him once every year and that guy's shots are filled with stop signs made of light (the ninja stars may exaggerate that shape a bit, but not much). Do you think any Cinematographer has ever lost sleep over bokeh shapes? That's for internet forums to get worked up over. Just my opinion...

Very nice shot, BTW...


I dunno, the bokeh in Taxi Driver has always looked bad to my eyes.

I just don't understand why Zeiss would build a premium lens and then hamstring it with a crappy iris.

Taxi Driver, with infamous triangular oof highlights:



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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 11:19 pm
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Posted: Tue Dec 30, 2014 11:19 pm
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Weird shaped bokeh can look good, as long as it doesn't become the focal point of the image , as Bernhard pointed out. If the picture by frenched had the same density of bokeh on both sides of the girl - I think it would have been better. I don't think it would have overpowered the portrait, because the girls face would be the focal point and not a small area of bright bokeh. I don't think the shape would make any difference other than the photographer wanting to have something different. Which can be the difference of selling an image or not.


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 1:44 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 1:44 am
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CBokeh wrote:
Do you think any Cinematographer has ever lost sleep over bokeh shapes? That's for internet forums to get worked up over.


LOL +1. Smile

iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
I just don't understand why Zeiss would build a premium lens and then hamstring it with a crappy iris.


Because Rollei paid Zeiss to build a Planar with a three-blade iris. Their check was good, so what the heck?

Also, I'd be the last man on Earth to argue with Martin Scorcese about cinematography. Smile

Really, this lens is a 3-in-1. At f/1.4 it's fairly sharp along the focal plane but overall has a soft gentle look, very thin DOF and creamy circular bokeh. At f/2.0-f/2.8 you get the ninja stars. From f/4 and down the BG is back to "normal" and it becomes crazy sharp.

I understand it's all a matter of preference and I appreciate the comments. Here's another version of the shot for comparison. Same everything, but this time at f/1.4.


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 2:43 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 2:43 am
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I much prefer the 1.4 shot, it's superb.


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 9:28 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 9:28 am
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Seriously guys, seeing those beautiful green eyes of the gorgeous girl I cannot give a c..p about the shape of the bokeh Wink. However since frenched had asked I have to say I like ninja bokeh very much as well as those triangular ones in Taxi Driver - it's something different from all round or ugly hexagonal-shaped. To be frankly honest I prefer f/1.4 smile of the girl with f/2.8 ninja bokeh Wink. With lens wide open bokeh circles on this photo are too big, too distracting and too artificial for me, but of course it's just my humble opinion.

Mateusz


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 9:57 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 9:57 am
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Hexagon is ugly and Ninja is nice ? Well, why not. Let's say, hexagon is common.
For me the shape of the highlights is not what matters the most when it goes about bokeh.

By the way, I prefer #2 because it is softer.


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:02 am
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 10:02 am
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memetph, well... you're right maybe hexagonal are just common not ugly, but I somewhat dislike them. Of course I don't mind if they're showing on the photo somewhere, but to be main part of the image...not the best thing for me.
As for other properties of bokeh apart from shape of the highlights I agree as well, but topic was about the shape of the highlights Smile.


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 3:10 pm
Post subject: Re: Zeiss Planar 85/1.4 AEG Ninja Stars
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frenched wrote:
Some don't like the ninja star bokeh, others do. I purposely bought this lens with this feature in mind. What are your opinions


My opinion is, you have produced 2 great images of a beautiful woman, the background in both of these images are just that 'backgrounds' and this young lady would look great in front of a garbage dump, if pushed for my favourite it would be the stars as long as in this case it's not overdone, looks quite hollywoodish Smile


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:06 pm
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:06 pm
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iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
I much prefer the 1.4 shot, it's superb.

Thanks, Ian. Coming from you that's high praise indeed. Smile

FYI the model happens to be my step-daughter. She and her husband came over for Christmas Eve dinner and I was teasing her about her hat. So I stood her up against the lighted Christmas tree and fired off a few snaps. She's a good sport.

Seems the opinions are running about 50/50 on the ninja stars. I was on the fence myself, but talked myself into the AEG in the hopes of learning how to handle it properly. So far I'm loving the lens.

Happy New Year, everyone!


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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:36 pm
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Posted: Wed Dec 31, 2014 11:36 pm
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I kinda prefer the second shot, but the first has a lot going for it. Don't give up on it! Very Happy Laughing
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