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Wide angle suggestion
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PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 7:37 pm    Post subject: Wide angle suggestion Reply with quote
Well, I'm looking for a wide-angle lens for my 400D. Right now, the only one I have that really covers wide-angle is the kit lens (18-55 zoom). It's not particularly good... mediocre sharpness, some CA, too much distortion. I can live with it for the time being but I want a better wide-angle lens. A 17mm fixed focal like the Tokina 17mm AT-X seems perfect to me, but i'm not spending 200-300 euros in that lens Sad I think maybe it's impossible to find a cheap (less than 100 euros), decent wide angle for my camera... do you have any suggestions? are there any affordable mf lenses below 20mm?


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 7:41 pm    Post subject: Re: Wide angle suggestion Reply with quote
naplam wrote:
are there any affordable mf lenses below 20mm?


The Zenitar is the only lens below 20mm that can be called affordable I think
(I do not consider the crappy ones like Panagor etc)

Otherwise if 20mm is ok there are several, like the MIR-20M, that go for around 100 Euros or a little more.
Another one is the Yashica
Then a little above (150 approx.) there is the Flek 4/20

In general "super wide angle" lenses and "cheap" do not go well together Sad


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 7:48 pm    Post subject: Re: Wide angle suggestion Reply with quote
naplam wrote:
... are there any affordable mf lenses below 20mm?


No, unfortunately not. I've been looking for such a thing for a while now! No chance! Maybe, if you're really lucky...


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Quote:
In general "super wide angle" lenses and "cheap" do not go well together


Seconded, unfortunately... Sad


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I bought a Vivitar 19mm f/3.8 just arrived today with Nikon AIS mount. This lens should wait for you Orio to testing and on the way a Nikkor 20mm f/3.5 Non-Ai lens. Sure a couple of Flektogon also wait for you to use them when you will be here in August. I am curious about this Vivitar in generally they are good average lenses they are not superb and not bad either.


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Attila wrote:
and on the way a Nikkor 20mm f/3.5 Non-Ai lens.


AWW-W-w I always wanted this one!
But could only find it for 300 Euros or more, so I always dropped it.


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I am glad if you like it Click here to see on Ebay this is mine. Hopefully it will not too abused.

Click here to see on Ebay This went after a little cheaper than mine.


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
It is a fantastic bargain, what you did. This lens normally is sold for double the price!


PostPosted: Wed Jun 13, 2007 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
YES ! Thank you I was simple lucky I didn't watch ever before this lens. I just would get a good lens.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
The trouble is that, even though you only need half frame coverage, all of the old glass was designed for 35mm full frame, so a 17-18mm lens is past 100 degrees of coverage. That requires a heck of a lens, and even though you don't get the benefit of all that extra cost on the DSLR you still have to pay for it.

There are a number of good 20-21s around, as has been mentioned, and there are a tiny handful of wider lenses that aren't made of unobtanium: the Spiratone 18mm comes to mind, which I think may have been made by Sigma - in any case I think there was a Sigma of similar specs. Neither is real common but not being a big name helps keep the price under control. The Spiratone 20/2.8 was also a much better lens than its price would suggest.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 7:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
rick_oleson wrote:
The trouble is that, even though you only need half frame coverage, all of the old glass was designed for 35mm full frame, so a 17-18mm lens is past 100 degrees of coverage...


Hmmm.... I don't get that. How is that possible?
If a lens is made for 35mm FF, how can it be past 100% on a crop cam?


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The wide angle issue is a problem with no good solution Sad

Quote:
Hmmm.... I don't get that. How is that possible?
If a lens is made for 35mm FF, how can it be past 100% on a crop cam?

I don't know what he meant but what's certain is that it's a waste to have a FF wide angle if you don't need it to cover the whole 35mm frame. Unfortunately there are no "digital" wide-angle (except zooms), as far as i know.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
There are digital wide angle primes but you would be amazed if you see the prices.

The main problem is the fact that a FF fis Eye is no real Fish eye anymore because of the cropfactor. the distorsion a FF fishey has gives problems if you want to use it as Ultra wide.

Guido


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 2:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Jigt wrote:
The main problem is the fact that a FF fis Eye is no real Fish eye anymore because of the cropfactor. the distorsion a FF fishey has gives problems if you want to use it as Ultra wide.

Guido


Well, Guido, that is not entirely true. A 16mm FF Fisheye, such as the Zenitar, is no longer a real fisheye anymore, that's right, but the 8mm Peleng for example still is a "real" fisheye. You don't have the central circular image anymore but it still shows the fisheye distortion effect...


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 4:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thats correct.

But an FF 28 equals a 42 on a 1.5 crop camera, one can hardly call this a wideangle.

The exreme wides on FF for example a 20mm becomes a 30 hardly an extreme widangle. The 20 mm's are rare and by that expensive.

The old 14, 15 , 16mm's were used as Fish eyes and distortion is not corrected. So If you want to do architecture with a cropcamera your choise is limited.

Guido


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 5:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Jigt wrote:
So If you want to do architecture with a cropcamera
Guido


you either:

- choose distant viewpoints if available

- use one of those AF zooms that all brands provide for crop cameras (and accept the inherent unavoidable limitations)

- save your money and buy a 5D, like I did.

- resort back to film use and buy a very good negative/slides scanner.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 9:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
Jigt wrote:
So If you want to do architecture with a cropcamera
Guido


you either:

- save your money and buy a 5D, like I did.


YES! I never thought before that there is so much difference beween crop and ff.

Michael


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Borges wrote:

YES! I never thought before that there is so much difference beween crop and ff.
Michael


For me, 5D means to be able to use my Flek 4/20 the way it is supposed to be used, and this alone was worth it.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Orio wrote:
Borges wrote:

YES! I never thought before that there is so much difference beween crop and ff.
Michael


For me, 5D means to be able to use my Flek 4/20 the way it is supposed to be used, and this alone was worth it.

And not only that, photos from a 5D are really better, crisp and contrasty. I'll buy one some day... but not in the near future. Too expensive for my self-imposed limits on photo gear expenses Wink


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
naplam wrote:


And not only that, photos from a 5D are really better, crisp and contrasty.


The 400D's technology is better on this regard, more advanced.
And the light meter also is much better in the 400D.
LCD is better.
Overall I think the 400D is a better camera, except for the crop format.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
there is a flek 4/20 in market place at the moment asking for offers they seem to be around the ?80 upwards from what I can see.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Grab it !


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 10:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Make sure it's M42, I made a quick search and only Exakta models popped up.


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 11:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Wide angle suggestion Reply with quote
How about Tamron Adaptall-2 SP 17MM, this will give you about 28MM coveage on the 400D. I have this combination and I like it.
Regards!

Cheng in Fredericton, NB Canada


PostPosted: Thu Jun 14, 2007 11:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I would buy long time ago a Tamron SP 17 mm lens can you publish some photos taken with this lens and some center and corner crop too ?
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