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Vivitar Series 1 2.5/90
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:02 am    Post subject: Vivitar Series 1 2.5/90 Reply with quote
1977 Vivitar Series 1 2.5/90 VMC MACRO - 8 blades - MFD 39cm - 58∅

All, except the last 2, were taken indoors in low light...handheld













The next 3 are thru a window display






PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Great lens and pictures.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 7:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
This thread reminded me to use mine more often. The images are perfect representations of the Bokina's rendering; sharp, amazingly smooth bokeh and somewhat lacking contrast (the VMC coating is the Achille's heel of that lens), great shots!


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 9:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi Mir,

If you use other macro lenses, how do you compare 90 2.5 against them?


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
sceptic wrote:
This thread reminded me to use mine more often. The images are perfect representations of the Bokina's rendering; sharp, amazingly smooth bokeh and somewhat lacking contrast (the VMC coating is the Achille's heel of that lens), great shots!


Oh my. One click of auto=contrast. I find contrast as good or better than other period lenses.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
woodrim wrote:
sceptic wrote:
This thread reminded me to use mine more often. The images are perfect representations of the Bokina's rendering; sharp, amazingly smooth bokeh and somewhat lacking contrast (the VMC coating is the Achille's heel of that lens), great shots!


Oh my. One click of auto=contrast. I find contrast as good or better than other period lenses.


Agreed. With just a little post processing this lens produces amazing images.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
woodrim wrote:
sceptic wrote:
This thread reminded me to use mine more often. The images are perfect representations of the Bokina's rendering; sharp, amazingly smooth bokeh and somewhat lacking contrast (the VMC coating is the Achille's heel of that lens), great shots!


Oh my. One click of auto=contrast. I find contrast as good or better than other period lenses.

Don't get me wrong, it's an amazing lens (and contrast is very easy to increase in post processing), but the VMC is not up to par with, for instance, Pentax SMC.
Don't take my word for it, though:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3398353#forum-post-51021578
http://makingnottaking.blogspot.se/2010/05/tokina-90mm-f25-at-x-macro-bokina.html
This is a known property of this particular lens, and prospective buyers should be aware of it (and use a deep hood to minimize it) , which is why I mentioned it.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 3:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
sceptic wrote:
woodrim wrote:
sceptic wrote:
This thread reminded me to use mine more often. The images are perfect representations of the Bokina's rendering; sharp, amazingly smooth bokeh and somewhat lacking contrast (the VMC coating is the Achille's heel of that lens), great shots!


Oh my. One click of auto=contrast. I find contrast as good or better than other period lenses.

Don't get me wrong, it's an amazing lens (and contrast is very easy to increase in post processing), but the VMC is not up to par with, for instance, Pentax SMC.
Don't take my word for it, though:
http://www.dpreview.com/forums/thread/3398353#forum-post-51021578
http://makingnottaking.blogspot.se/2010/05/tokina-90mm-f25-at-x-macro-bokina.html
This is a known property of this particular lens, and prospective buyers should be aware of it (and use a deep hood to minimize it) , which is why I mentioned it.


The severe problem with the lens in the forum post on dpreview was probably not the coatings but the heavy internal dust and haze. For some reason this lens is very prone to gathering internal dust and also prone to haze forming in the inter-lens balsam glues. Most of the copies I've owned have this problem. Also, the flare problem described in the post would not be fixed by a lens hood, since it was due to scattering of the light from the white background (according to the replies...) which you can't block with a hood.

I've always been interested in trying a Tokina ATX to see if they actually did solve these problems. But if they have the same propensity for dust and haze formation as the original, then only a pristine example would give an improvement.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 4:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
How much improvement is needed over the original Vivitar S1? We're talking about one of the top sharpest lenses of its day, and easily a top performer today. Any difference between the two lenses in equal condition will be minuscule to the point where extreme scrutiny will be required to discern a difference. Even then it will be difficult. In regular use their results will be indistinguishable. I had an opportunity to get a Tokina in good condition and reasonable price, but when I thought about it, I shouldn't have two lenses basically the same and I do appreciate the Vivitar version build quality, so wouldn't want to give it up. I passed on the Tokina.

I have not experienced any problems with flare, or maybe I just don't see it. I find the Vivitar to give superior contrast to most of my lenses of that period and earlier. I do an auto-contrast in Photoshop as the first step in processing all of my photos, not just for issues of low contrast, but since I shoot .7AV under, it starts the exposure correction process.

And yes, I do love this lens...


PostPosted: Wed Mar 11, 2015 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Stop posting amazing flower shots like these; longing for Swedish spring is not made any easier by doing that Wink
Regarding hazy/dusty lens elements, I can only agree; my S1 had quite a dense coating of haze on several of the middle elements. I managed to clean it off, but can't recommend anyone doing the same. Disassembling the lenses was definitely more difficult than with the average 50 mm lens.


PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
listera wrote:
If you use other macro lenses, how do you compare 90 2.5 against them?



I have shot the TAMRON SP (52B) 2.5/90 - 8 blades - MFD 39cm - ∅49 - 1979-88
http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic,p,1429677.html#1429677
(The Tamron was shot on my old Maxxum 7D with the dedicated extender)

And the MINOLTA MD MACRO ROKKOR-X 3.5/100 - 6 blades - MFD 45cm - ∅55 - 1978 (MDII)
http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic,p,1429675.html#1429675
(The Minolta was shot on my old Maxxum 7D with the dedicated extender)

I have not yet used them on my a7, as i did so with the Vivitar

I will not say which one's best, i'm not going there !
I did like working with all of them...


PostPosted: Thu Mar 12, 2015 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have often wondered if the Vivitar was better than the Tamron 90 2.5, which I have and like a lot. The Vivitar is obviously very good though.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 13, 2015 8:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Lloydy wrote:
I have often wondered if the Vivitar was better than the Tamron 90 2.5, which I have and like a lot. The Vivitar is obviously very good though.

I've wondered the same thing but I only have the Vivitar. I keep an eye out for the Tamron but I've never found a bargain.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 18, 2015 2:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Just finished cleaning its dedicated Macro Adapter i've just received !

Sample to follow...... after all the snow is gone...


PostPosted: Thu Mar 19, 2015 10:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Took my recently cleaned Viv S1 90/2.5 for a test in my garden. Most flowers are still lurking in the dirt, so excuse the rather boring test subject...
On my A7R, the sharpness of this lens really comes through; here's a shot wide open (focused on the toe of the shoe):
[url=https://www.flickr.com/photos/scepticswe/16674755090/]
[/url]
Vivitar S1 90/2.5 wide open sharpness and purple fringing test by scepticswe, on Flickr
Also evident is some purple fringing, which goes away when stopped down.
I can't wait for more interesting subjects to pop up from the ground...


PostPosted: Sun Mar 29, 2015 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Handheld..... with extension 1:1 ...... closest mfd ...... high ISO







PostPosted: Mon Mar 30, 2015 4:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
SonicScot wrote:
Lloydy wrote:
I have often wondered if the Vivitar was better than the Tamron 90 2.5, which I have and like a lot. The Vivitar is obviously very good though.

I've wondered the same thing but I only have the Vivitar. I keep an eye out for the Tamron but I've never found a bargain.


The sensor flare on the Adaptall is just a show-stopper. A lot of folks claim they don't see it, and I can only imagine those people don't shoot in sunlight, with off camera lights, or at smaller apertures. Which makes me wonder what they were shooting.

Yeah, it's not always there, it's not even there most of the time. The fact that at any moment it might ruin a shot because enough light was in the frame--even just incidental light--and that the flare isn't reflected in the viewfinder means it's a risky lens in the field. It's too unpredictable.

The Vivitar, on the other hand, is very predictable. The only thing that will trip it up is a veiling flare that arises when a strong light source is directly in the frame, and you can see when it happens in the viewfinder.


PostPosted: Mon May 04, 2015 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hi,

So - I've done a lot of reading on this lens recently (though perhaps, not enough before buying it Very Happy) and I've got myself a Vivitar S1 90 2.5, SN 37711261, in OM mount. Due to reasons I ended up with one without the 1:1 adapter, although I've ordered the V2XMFTC Vivitar 2x macro focusing teleconverter in OM to use with it - I've seen more than one person using this and rating it as a thing you can do, anyway. I'm waiting on the actual adapter that would let me use an OM mount lens at all to arrive, hopefully it will later today.

I'm kind of really hankering after the proper 1:1 lifesize adapter for it, and I'm wondering if someone here can help me with some questions on it. Two main points I'd love to get cleared up, if I can.

1) I've read - somewhere in the vast amounts of stuff on this lens - that you can use the Tokina 1:1 adapter from their 90mm 2.5 AT-X on the Vivitar S1 version, but not the other way around? By "can use", does this mean they merely fit together and produce similar results, or that they are completely physically identical items internally in terms of multicoating, design, etc?

2) How agnostic is the lens and adapter combination about the mounts it's on, and does this factor into the actual resultant image from the lens at all? Essentially the question is - how convertable is say, an OM lens to an FD 1:1 adapter? Worth pursuing getting done (wouldn't be by my rank amatuer self who just got their first MF lens at all Very Happy) or not?

Many thanks for any help any of you can provide.


PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
piggsy wrote:
Hi,

So - I've done a lot of reading on this lens recently (though perhaps, not enough before buying it Very Happy) and I've got myself a Vivitar S1 90 2.5, SN 37711261, in OM mount. Due to reasons I ended up with one without the 1:1 adapter, although I've ordered the V2XMFTC Vivitar 2x macro focusing teleconverter in OM to use with it - I've seen more than one person using this and rating it as a thing you can do, anyway. I'm waiting on the actual adapter that would let me use an OM mount lens at all to arrive, hopefully it will later today.

I'm kind of really hankering after the proper 1:1 lifesize adapter for it, and I'm wondering if someone here can help me with some questions on it. Two main points I'd love to get cleared up, if I can.

1) I've read - somewhere in the vast amounts of stuff on this lens - that you can use the Tokina 1:1 adapter from their 90mm 2.5 AT-X on the Vivitar S1 version, but not the other way around? By "can use", does this mean they merely fit together and produce similar results, or that they are completely physically identical items internally in terms of multicoating, design, etc?

2) How agnostic is the lens and adapter combination about the mounts it's on, and does this factor into the actual resultant image from the lens at all? Essentially the question is - how convertable is say, an OM lens to an FD 1:1 adapter? Worth pursuing getting done (wouldn't be by my rank amatuer self who just got their first MF lens at all Very Happy) or not?

Many thanks for any help any of you can provide.


I have found the FD versions of the 90VS1 relatively easy to find. I bought one for a good price, new in box with adapter. Not sure about converting the lens, though. Might be better to get a full-up FD kit.

My experience with the adapter is that if you want to get to 1:1 it's better to use extensions. I have never tried mine with the 2XMFTC but that is probably an even better route. I think the combo will go well beyond 1:1 but again not sure if it will match perfectly. Having a 180mm f/5 lens that can go beyond 1:1 seems powerful. Not sure why I have not yet tried it, but will be super interested in your results.


PostPosted: Tue May 05, 2015 12:22 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ray Parkhurst wrote:

I have found the FD versions of the 90VS1 relatively easy to find. I bought one for a good price, new in box with adapter. Not sure about converting the lens, though. Might be better to get a full-up FD kit.

My experience with the adapter is that if you want to get to 1:1 it's better to use extensions. I have never tried mine with the 2XMFTC but that is probably an even better route. I think the combo will go well beyond 1:1 but again not sure if it will match perfectly. Having a 180mm f/5 lens that can go beyond 1:1 seems powerful. Not sure why I have not yet tried it, but will be super interested in your results.


Well, the main areas of concern with the V2XMFTC as far as I understand it are:

1) you lose 2 stops, before you even start using it as an extension tube for close focusing, rather than 1 stop as with the genuine 1:1 LSA.

2) the 1:1 LSA is possibly better for correcting the issues this particular lens runs into at higher than 1:2 magnifications, rather than something designed to work with a 50mm normal lens. Though there are 4 more bits of glass in it, so who knows what the ultimate effect is.

The main thing that makes me wonder about whether you could put lens A under the knife/screwdriver to work with 1:1 adapter B is that it seems - at least comparing mine to other photos - like it might just be something as simple as a mount and maybe a shim making them different. And I have to wonder how different the Tamrom 90 2.5 w/ adaptalls on it is at the basic construction level, from the Vivitar/Tokina 90 2.5s.


edit - having just got the adapter and shot some (pretty basic) stuff - wow is the hype about this lens ever for real. I was going to set this up so that I had this for special occasions and using the Oly MZ ED 60mm 2.8 my main walkaround lens but I can see myself dragging this one out everywhere for a while Very Happy


edit 2 - to answer some of my questions. First - I found where I read about which 1:1 LSA works with which - I actually went back to this series of articles on it on Making Not Taking and stupidly didn't just ctrl-f for it, it's in the comment section on this one

http://makingnottaking.blogspot.com.au/2009/11/vivitar-series-1-90mm-11-macro.html

Quote:

I used the Vivitar 90 for this comparison. Looking back, I'm not sure how useful the comparison actually is because it wasn't until some time after that I ever had the pleasure of owning the Tokina 90. Upon which I discovered, the Tokina 90 is incompatible with the Vivitar macro extender (at least with Nikon AI mounts) due to a raised ring with specific grooves cut to match the Vivitar 90 len's indexing tabs. The Tokina 90's indexing tabs do not line up with these grooves and thus cannot be used. But as demonstrated above, the Tokina extender can be used with the Vivitar 90 lens.



So potentially that Vivitar lens > Tokina LSA incompatibility is as a result of the Nikon mount, OTOH maybe not.

Also a cutaway here seems to show the tokina and vivitar 90/2.5 LSAs being ... pretty identical? Mostly? Maybe?

http://makingnottaking.blogspot.com.au/2009/10/vivitar-series-1-90mm-f25-vmc-12-bokina.html



(mashed together from an image source here - https://translate.google.com/translate?sl=auto&tl=en&js=y&prev=_t&hl=en&ie=UTF-8&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww2.xitek.com%2Finfo%2Fshowarticle.php%3Fid%3D731 on the vivitar lens and the tokina box art cutaway of their adapter)

My understanding of it is that the Tamron 90 2.5 has its own extender, which simply operates as an empty extension tube rather than sharing the 3 element design. Have seen various other people on forums saying they use simple tubes with the tokina/vivitar lenses, or the 2x MFTC without issues, so I'm starting to wonder how essential an item this really is now Very Happy - that and the pretty great performance of this BGN rated lens straight out of the bag at only 1:2.


PostPosted: Wed May 06, 2015 9:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Also WRT how adaptable any one mount version of the lens is to any other -

http://allphotolenses.com/lenses/item/c_113.html

the parts catalogue seems to suggest that there were non-trivial differences in construction for each mount's version.
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