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Tamron 200mm compact lenses
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PostPosted: Fri Jun 27, 2008 1:57 am    Post subject: Tamron 200mm compact lenses Reply with quote

This is a curious creature - Its a very early Tamron T-mount lens, it appears to be a model F0-63 introduced in 1963. It seems to be a fairly uncommon lens in this early Tamron product line, perhaps even rarer to have been sold under the Tamron brand.



http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.tamron.co.jp/data/old-lens/olm200f6_3.htm

It is an extremely simple lens, with just a focusing mount and a diaphragm (manual only, not even preset), 3 elements in two groups according to the Tamron site. In other words, its a Wundertute ! Just a small one. It must have been very cheap back then.

Its extremely light and it fits very nicely in a jacket pocket in its neat soft leather case. If you want to carry a long lens while going light, its a good alternative to an extender. And if one is going to stop down anyway, well, this one comes stopped down already !

Its performance isn't bad I think, though not particularly good either - all at f/6.3













The bird -



crop -



Last edited by luisalegria on Tue May 01, 2018 12:40 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just acquired one of these. As Luis describes this lens is real old school: slow and simple. I just had a sortie around the garden and took this with an extension tube on, Samsung NX20, f8, exported from LR (I mainly needed to reduce noise, the NX20 gets noisy quickly when the ASA is upped, this was at 800ASA). A result to prompt me to see what else it can do...



PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 4:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Corking, marcus Like 1 small .


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Great result Marcus, some old lenses really can surprise you! Like 1 small


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 8:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Luis, your shots are awesome! I imagine, you applied some corrections? Incredible how a triplet may produce such pop-effect. Marcus, the same is yours!


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:44 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi Alex

Nothing but a little exposure or contrast.
I don't recall exactly what anymore because this is from quite a few years ago.
I shot these on the 6mp Pentax K100D.

I didn't think this was a particularly sharp lens, though that may just be my copy.
I think I did everything at f/6.3, I had no reason to do otherwise. From what Marcus posted it seems to improve considerably at f/8! And it seems also does well on extension rings - was that what you did Marcus?

This is not exactly a triplet, other than having three elements, its not a Cooke-type.
Its got a cemented pair in front and a single element in back, a simplified telephoto. All the cheap Japanese 200-500mm telephotos are like that, though usually the rear group is another cemented pair - 4 elements in 2 groups. This one has such a small max aperture I guess they thought to get away with just one piece of glass.

A proper Cooke triplet, at reasonably small apertures, can be very sharp indeed in the center, the big limitation is towards the edges of the field. You can see this best in something like a folding camera with a 105mm triplet covering a 6x9 negative, to stress its coverage. Compared to a Tessar at even f/8 the triplets corners will be much worse.


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 9:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Photographic_lens_design#/media/File:Typtelelens.png

This is the sort of formula this uses, except that in this case the rear group is just a single element, not a pair. A very simple telephoto.


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 10:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you, Luis, for an exhaustive and appealing explanation! Having NEX I am not much attracted by over-135mm lenses. But longer I meet memebers' telephoto shots better idea it gives of the power and resolution of such way of making photography.


PostPosted: Fri Apr 21, 2017 11:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes Luis, that was with a ~10mm extension tube. Bean bag on a picnic table. Focus distance was around four feet.
My impression of this lens is that it is already sharp at f6.3. As and when we get a little sunshine around here I'll see if I can take my usual test pics of the castle turret and post them on my test page.
I got two good lenses in the ~$15 bundle this came in: the photax-paragon 35mm f3.5 is impressing me too!


Last edited by marcusBMG on Thu Apr 26, 2018 5:07 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 10:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've now done some test pics. My conclusions so far are:

- this lens is a tad softer at f6.3, nothing between f8 and f11.
- sharpness is good. Actually when I browse through my test pics of the castle turret with various lenses the similarity between the best of them prompts me to suspect that the limiting factor may be the camera (+ distance, atmospherics etc...). In any case this 200mm makes the grade IMO as one of those "best" lenses.
- this lens is remarkably good in terms of fringing, in spite of its simple design. The pic of the white boat has numerous aspects to prompt fringing, haloes, coma etc - nada. Click on it to see full sized, look especially at the relections off railings etc. that are normally guaranteed to show up PF.

Seagull pics specially for you Luis. Corroborates this lens likes (certainly doesn't dislike) closer focus.

f6.3, f8, f11 crops, 1:1 pixel peep.




Resized, f8.


Different gull, same distance, 1:1 pixel peep crop (update: on my PC this isn't showing correctly - should be 1334 pix wide [try right clicking and select view image] )




PostPosted: Sat Apr 22, 2017 10:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like 1 small Like 1 small Like 1 small


PostPosted: Tue Apr 24, 2018 11:17 pm    Post subject: Re: Old Tamron 200/6.3 - a mini-Wundertute Reply with quote

luisalegria wrote:
. . .
http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.tamron.co.jp/data/old-lens/olm200f6_3.htm

It is an extremely simple lens, with just a focusing mount and a diaphragm (manual only, not even preset), 3 elements in two groups according to the Tamron site. In other words, its a Wundertute ! Just a small one. It must have been very cheap back then. . .



Another bump for this old topic. I appear to have a variation of this lens. Mine is labelled Ashreh.
It seems to perform about the same as those owned by luisalegria and marcusBMG. But my lens is different because it has just two elements instead of three. At the front there's a doublet, but behind the iris there's no glass - just a baffle.







Even so, it's sharp enough for me and I'm happy with the results I've had.
Both of these were at f/8 on my Canon 5D, and the red breasted sapsucker shot is a heavy crop:











The 2.5m minimum focus distance is a bit long, but otherwise I enjoy using this old, simple lens.
I've been looking to buy the Tamron version so I can compare it to my Ashreh, but I haven't been able to find one yet.

Tim


PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 4:23 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Looking good!
It could be that on mine the rear element is just a flat.
I'd have to dismantle it to be sure.

Otherwise yours looks exactly like the Tamron brand.

IIRC

Ashreh Supply Corp., Brooklyn, NY
Was a photographic products wholesaler.
It may still be in business.
They had a bunch of lenses from multiple makers just like Spiratone, Aetna, etc.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

luisalegria wrote:
Looking good!
It could be that on mine the rear element is just a flat.
I'd have to dismantle it to be sure.

Otherwise yours looks exactly like the Tamron brand.

IIRC

Ashreh Supply Corp., Brooklyn, NY
Was a photographic products wholesaler.
It may still be in business.
They had a bunch of lenses from multiple makers just like Spiratone, Aetna, etc.



Thank you. Can you please explain what you mean by "flat"?

When I received my 200 as part of a camera lot, I'd never heard of Ashreh before and I'd never handled such a simple looking lens. I've been surprised at how good the image quality can be and at how much I enjoy using it.

Regarding Ashreh, a quick search turned up some tidbits:
"Ashreh Supply Corporation of 425 Broadway, NY, NY. Filed for incorporation in New York on Oct 7 1964, and status is listed as active."
I found the information here:
http://www.miniaturebinoculars.com/page0018.htm


PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 1:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Interesting variant there 55. It's not exactly the same as my "tasei kogaku" original, the focus and aperture rings on yours (update: and Luis' tamron badged one) aren't as wide. But in other respects it is the same, and I just unscrewed the end of mine (these simple old lenses often unscrew into segments) to look at the end element and yes, that's just a flat glass plate whose absence would have little or no effect (looking at your pic are you sure there isn't some glass in that disk by the iris?). I double checked the length of the lens yep the focal plane is pretty much exactly 200mm from the front element (so no "telephoto").
Lens pics here.

Luis: did you review the f5.9 version, which I now have too?

Addendum - one of this years tulips, this time with the f5.9 version, f8 with short extension tube, samsung NX20, pp LR3.6.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 25, 2018 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good for you Marcus!
Thanks for checking.

Yes lensmakers sometimes put flats - that is, just uncurved pieces of glass - in the back of some lenses to prevent dust from entering.

So this thing is a doublet.

No, I never got the 5.9, missed it on auction a few times.
Yours looks very good!


PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 7:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

marcusBMG wrote:
. . . and I just unscrewed the end of mine (these simple old lenses often unscrew into segments) to look at the end element and yes, that's just a flat glass plate whose absence would have little or no effect (looking at your pic are you sure there isn't some glass in that disk by the iris?). . .

Addendum - one of this years tulips, this time with the f5.9 version, f8 with short extension tube, samsung NX20, pp LR3.6.


Thanks for the information, Marcus. I didn't know about flats. And yes, it's a fair question to ask, but I'm 100% certain the front doublet is the only glass in my lens.

And your photo... I shall never tire of tulips! Lovely. And I had to smile when I saw you mention an extension tube. I started carrying a tube in my bag only after I began using my 200 f/6.3. I enjoy using my Ashreh for flowers, but the 2.5m minimum focus distance is often too long.


luisalegria wrote:
. . . Yes lensmakers sometimes put flats - that is, just uncurved pieces of glass - in the back of some lenses to prevent dust from entering. . .


Thank you, Luis. That makes sense. I remember my Ashreh had a lot of dust inside when I received it.


Tim


PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 8:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like 1


PostPosted: Thu Apr 26, 2018 4:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well Luis I'll just chip in with an eval here - you could change the title of the thread to tamron 200's?

The fact is there is very little difference between the two lenses. My impression is that the f5.9 is just a tad less sharp. These are my standard castle turret test crops (now updated). Samsung NX20, f5.9, f8, f11.





This resized crop of another tower with lots of tourists came out nice and sharp - f11.


Last edited by marcusBMG on Mon Apr 30, 2018 8:01 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Sun Apr 29, 2018 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here are a few quick pics with the Taisei Kogaku Tamron 200mm f/5.9 mm version, with plano element in the rear position. All photos were taken on a Sony A7 Mii at ISO800. All but the photos of the gate house building and the small white church were taken wide open. A totally enjoyable, and very easy to carry 200mm lens!



#1


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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Nice. And the bokeh is a bit swirly in pic 1! Like 1 small


PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2018 7:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The physical look of this f/5.9 version seems a bit different than the f/6.3 version.

P.





PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2018 12:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Changed the thread name to "Tamron 200mm compact lenses"
To better describe the contents.

These are variants of very simple early T-mount Tamron (Taisei Kogaku) lenses, being of doublet design with or without an optical "flat" in the rear barrel, of f/6.3 or f/5.9 max aperture.

Obviously designed to appeal to the low end of the market. Uncommon in general and it seems one of the few Tamron-made lenses that is more common in Tamron/Taisei branding than under distributors names, though as we see there were some.